I would concur, France and Germany makes the most sense. Germany bcs the iteration of germany in Civ 6 includes the HRE, and France because he was frankish.
I’d like a Phillippines civ to be a grand tour. Lapu Lapu or Aguinaldo as the leader, civ ability referring to the collection of precolonial city-states, kingdoms and empires, if Aguinaldo, a LA referring to political and diplomatic independence struggles, and a UI, like a Reef Park, which serves as a aquatic equivalent to the National Park
The language has generally been regarded as their biggest barrier, and I don't think there's any happy way around it. I don't think the devs would go with Arawakan in absence of a reconstructed Taino language, and even then I think they would have trouble finding someone who spoke Lokono.
But they can easily use widely spoken Arawakan languages that even have radio or TV dubs or short government programmes, such as Wayuu. I know it wouldn't be accurate, but it would be a close enough relative from the same language family. There wouldn't be much difference for the average player, I think almost no one who plays this game could differentiate between Arawakan languages. I know I couldn't
But they can easily use widely spoken Arawakan languages that even have radio or TV dubs or short government programmes, such as Wayuu. I know it wouldn't be accurate, but it would be a close enough relative from the same language family. There wouldn't be much difference for the average player, I think almost no one who plays this game could differentiate between Arawakan languages. I know I couldn't
not to mention a lot of the voice actors they’ve used don’t actually speak the language either, so they could always find a linguist who could guide the way and then get a voice actor to do it
I think Cuba as country and its people have achieve a lot of good things like it was mention before, but everyone agrees that cuban dictadorship is one of the most cruel in the history of the americas; but i think there is a chance to have a Cuban civ that its not lead by Castro
I would concur, France and Germany makes the most sense. Germany bcs the iteration of germany in Civ 6 includes the HRE, and France because he was frankish.
I’d like a Phillippines civ to be a grand tour. Lapu Lapu or Aguinaldo as the leader, civ ability referring to the collection of precolonial city-states, kingdoms and empires, if Aguinaldo, a LA referring to political and diplomatic independence struggles, and a UI, like a Reef Park, which serves as a aquatic equivalent to the National Park
I would concur, France and Germany makes the most sense. Germany bcs the iteration of germany in Civ 6 includes the HRE, and France because he was frankish.
And his capital would be Aachen if Germany and Aix-la-Chapelle if France.
I’d like a Phillippines civ to be a grand tour. Lapu Lapu or Aguinaldo as the leader, civ ability referring to the collection of precolonial city-states, kingdoms and empires, if Aguinaldo, a LA referring to political and diplomatic independence struggles, and a UI, like a Reef Park, which serves as a aquatic equivalent to the National Park
Now that I think about it, the amenities/population growth civ ability I suggested earlier makes more sense for the modern-day Philippines, as the islands have been relatively sparsely populated for most of history and the population really only exploded after WW2. A civ ability that would be more fitting for the precolonial Philippines would probably have to be something else. A bonus for each civilization or city-state met and then a further bonus for trading with them, maybe?
I should note that Aguinaldo has a mixed reputation here, because of his power struggle with Bonifacio (the other main revolutionary leader), which ended in the latter's death. I still think that he can be the leader choice, but this is probably the reason both the Civ V and Civ VI Philippines mods have featured Rizal as the leader instead. Rizal is an uncontroversial choice. Like Gandhi, he also never actually ruled the country.
I like the Reef Park idea. I really think that National Parks should be able to cover water tiles. It really gimps island civs that they don't. Or, you know, just civs on island maps in general.
But they can easily use widely spoken Arawakan languages that even have radio or TV dubs or short government programmes, such as Wayuu. I know it wouldn't be accurate, but it would be a close enough relative from the same language family. There wouldn't be much difference for the average player, I think almost no one who plays this game could differentiate between Arawakan languages. I know I couldn't
I think a Wayuu civ would be cool especially if they are lead by Torito Fernandez because it would show a modern face of South american indigenous history in the game
I should note that Aguinaldo has a mixed reputation here, because of his power struggle with Bonifacio (the other main revolutionary leader), which ended in the latter's death. I still think that he can be the leader choice, but this is probably the reason both the Civ V and Civ VI Philippines mods have featured Rizal as the leader instead. Rizal is an uncontroversial choice
i see. the main reason i suggested aguinaldo over rízal is because rizal didn’t actually lead the phillippines (and i’m not a fan of gandhi for that reason, among others, which i’ve been VERY vocal about in this forum).
i personally don't think that all leader should always be like rulers of civs cuz in some cases like Mexico, revolución leaders have more weigth on their countries that actual leaders (and Gandhi falls in that category for that reason but with the focus of Civ 6 of multiple leaders for civ we can now have both Gandhi and actual rulers of India)
i personally don't think that all leader should always be like rulers of civs cuz in some cases like Mexico, revolución leaders have more weigth on their countries that actual leaders (and Gandhi falls in that category for that reason but with the focus of Civ 6 of multiple leaders for civ we can now have both Gandhi and actual rulers of India)
in the case of mexico, a lot of the revolutionaries ended up being leaders in some capacity though. Even in regards to India, Nehru stands out as both a revolutionary and a option for civ leader.
But of course, in regards to India, I don’t think firaxis should be picking modern leaders regardless, especially considering the number of various great leader options throughout its past
side note: it’s embarrassing that only one of the gunpowder empires is in civ :/
If the Safavids were added, should they be an alternate leader for Persia or a separate civ entirely? Iran has more than 5000 years of history, and I don't know how appropriate Persia's civ ability is for the Safavid period... :/
i see. the main reason i suggested aguinaldo over rízal is because rizal didn’t actually lead the phillippines (and i’m not a fan of gandhi for that reason, among others, which i’ve been VERY vocal about in this forum).
Oh, I agree. Maybe a precolonial leader like Lapu-Lapu or Dayang Kalangitan or Lakandula would be good. But none of them ruled the whole country, just parts of it. Then we have the choice of post-independence presidents, but seriously none of them except Magsaysay and maybe Quezon appeal to me as leader choices.
If the Safavids were added, should they be an alternate leader for Persia or a separate civ entirely? Iran has more than 5000 years of history, and I don't know how appropriate Persia's civ ability is for the Safavid period... :/
I’d say mechanically they should be separate, because civ 6 persia is really just an achaemenid civ, kinda like how Indonesia is just a weirdly named Majapahit civ, but for them to be added, the current persia would have to be renamed
Lapu Lapu stands out as a good choice in my mind because of how he’s perceived, as a national hero, for being the first Filipino to resist colonialism.
honestly, i think that’s ok. the pre-colonial phillippines occupy a weird spot on the unity spectrum from celts, polynesia, ‘native americans’ and, to a lesser extent, india, which is totally completely culturally diverse small nations grouped into one (less valid to be blobbed into one civ), to the maya, phoenicia, greece, maori, etc, which are culturally very similar small nations grouped into one civ, which is more justified because of that cultural closeness. the philippines occupy a space in that spectrum which is very ambiguous in that it’s unclear which is a better representation. Does one select a colonial resister bcs the idea of the phillippines is already solidified, or is it ok to select local rulers bcs the idea of a filipino culture is shared enough from locality to locality that it’s appropriate to have, say, Lapu Lapu, lead the phillippines as a total civ.
Out of curiosity, what do people think about adding the Philippines as a civ? I'm not saying they should be added, although it is my country - I'm fully aware that Vietnam and Burma should be in first (see my sig). Just as a thought experiment.
There is a very good existing Philippines mod whose civ abilities (separate from leader abilities) focus on trade and tourism, so I'm thinking of a different tack. One idea I've thought of is bonuses to amenities and/or population growth. Not many existing civs have happiness/amenities bonuses, so it would be pretty unique.
Then there's the issue of whether the Philippines would be depicted as its postcolonial self, or as its precolonial polities such as Tondo, or maybe a combination of both. I'm hoping to avoid a situation like Indonesia's where it's clearly meant to be the Majapahit Empire yet the civ is called Indonesia and Gitarja says "Indonesia".
Oh, and Manila would have to be removed from Spain's city list. Not sure why it's there to begin with; colonial cities are generally not included in city lists. Unless it's because Philip II is the leader.
On the one hand, the Philippines were never really an empire or anything resembling it, so they don't have much business being a civ against the current roster. On the other hand, they represent a massive demographic and would sell well regardless of that fact.
I would expect a Filipino civ to be fairly religious, since most of my experience with Filipino culture has been heavily influenced by Catholicism or native animism.
While the Philippine islands are a pretty large spot on the map begging for something to occupy them, I think a Tondo city-state would hit a happy middle ground for VI's purposes.
As far as filling gaps on the map I feel like this game has done a pretty good job. Assuming MoorTires DLC is North Africa and Vietnam is real, the only real jarring place I feel that is really missing another civ is Native North America, particularly the western part of the U.S.
I would also argue there's enough room to put in another Ancient Mesopotamia/Near Eastern civ even if the Middle East is full of civs though.
Well I think it was intended to fill the Ukranian and Kazakh steppes, primarily. Then we got Georgia, so it definitely doesn't fill the Caucasus.
For Central Asia, I think there's a fair chance we could see a Samarkand-based civ, which would kind of cover the southern part of Central Asia, but wouldn't completely obviate Scythia's role in representing the Kazakh region. And I think that would be where they most naturally want to occupy given Scythia proper was mostly in Central Asia and Tomyris is hkind of a Kazakhstani figure.
For Eastern Europe, there are a couple of things at play. For one, the Scythians occupy what would have been a gap filled by the Huns, except we now have Hungary (etymologically different but in a way, at least by appropriation, related?), and Scythia's uniques are effectively what the Huns would have had anyway. Outside of a Scythia clone civ, I don't see the Huns happening. Great Bulgaria also occupied the region for a while, but I think if we get Bulgaria it will be filling the part of the Balkans not covered by Greece, Hungary, and Turkey. The only real civ I see standing a chance at "filling out" Eastern Europe in place of Scythia is Kievan Rus', but I think it's best odds are as a Russian alternate leader since the two form a sort of cultural continuity of the Rus people and the Russian uniques are all very Kievan.
I consider them primarily being Central Asian, specifically Tomyris who was part of the Massagetae tribe from present-day Turkmenistan, Kazakhstan and Uzbekistan.
If use shirt is relevant Andres Guazurarí is an option for a Guarani leader.
And by the way Guaranies are more than "natives resisting colonization". Guarani language is the only native american language spoken mainly by not ("pure") indigenous, with millions of paraguayans speaking it. At the same time many Guarani adapted to european ways and some reached high economic status in colonial societies.
SpoilerGuarani pics :
The Chiriguanos are also an example of this guarani interculturality, since they mixed with their subjugated arawak peoples of eastern Bolivia.
There are also a group of stories from the many regional guarani partialities, that tell ous about two great related caciques at the time of the spanish arrival, the cacique Guairá and cacique Paragua, the former chosee to live on the jungle and the later to mix with the spaniards and live on the fields. For me is interesting to see an extended native national story that acknowledge both the ethnogenesis and relation between Guaranies and Paraguayans, contrary to other stories where "the other" are see as complety unrelated and/or the mixed ones are see as isolated indentity-less.
So their in game design could be worked aroud the idea of mutual cultural influences. Not to forget that the famous argentinian Maté drink is of guarani origin!
Yes, they would have been a better fit for Age of Empires III, which was set in the colonial era (and Spain at least is in AoE III as well), but it is what it is, so we have the Spaniards and Goths at the same time. And the Goths get gunpowder units.
AoE2 timeline is 400 to 1600. There are many late 16th century scenarios. There are also the late Goths from Crimea on the Principality of Theodoro, so there are not problam with spaniards amd goths at the same time.
Out of curiosity, what do people think about adding the Philippines as a civ? I'm not saying they should be added, although it is my country - I'm fully aware that Vietnam and Burma should be in first (see my sig). Just as a thought experiment.
There is a very good existing Philippines mod whose civ abilities (separate from leader abilities) focus on trade and tourism, so I'm thinking of a different tack. One idea I've thought of is bonuses to amenities and/or population growth. Not many existing civs have happiness/amenities bonuses, so it would be pretty unique.
Then there's the issue of whether the Philippines would be depicted as its postcolonial self, or as its precolonial polities such as Tondo, or maybe a combination of both. I'm hoping to avoid a situation like Indonesia's where it's clearly meant to be the Majapahit Empire yet the civ is called Indonesia and Gitarja says "Indonesia".
Oh, and Manila would have to be removed from Spain's city list. Not sure why it's there to begin with; colonial cities are generally not included in city lists. Unless it's because Philip II is the leader.
Guarani language is the only native american language spoken mainly by not ("pure") indigenous, with millions of paraguayans speaking it. At the same time many Guarani adapted to european ways and some reached high economic status in colonial societies.
this is actually a big reason why i like the guarani in civ. It’s the only indigenous language which still is spoken more than spanish in its country (although maya, quechua and nahuatl and miskito are oft spoken too)
I think Cuba as country and its people have achieve a lot of good things like it was mention before, but everyone agrees that cuban dictadorship is one of the most cruel in the history of the americas; but i think there is a chance to have a Cuban civ that its not lead by Castro
I agree in general, but I think other Spanish American countries are more representative than Cuba. I still see Argentina, Chile or even Mexico as more likely than Cuba. However, it is unlikely to see any other modern Spanish American nation after Colombia, at least in NFP
AoE2 timeline is 400 to 1600. There are many late 16th century scenarios. There are also the late Goths from Crimea on the Principality of Theodoro, so there are not problam with spaniards amd goths at the same time.
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