[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Humankind's Three Sisters Plantation for the Haudenosaunee is a good example of branching out into more unique infrastructure for NA cultures.

It is an interesting choice indeed. Though I do have to admit if I had to choose only one Native culture to get a housing type infrastructure it's hard not to choose the longhouse for the Iroquois, considering Haudenosaunee means "People of the Longhouse."

The way gameplay works in Civ a "three sisters plantation" can definitely be the name of a unique ability.

 

[Birch617]

It is an interesting choice indeed. Though I do have to admit if I had to choose only one Native culture to get a housing type infrastructure it's hard not to choose the longhouse for the Iroquois, considering Haudenosaunee means "People of the Longhouse."

The way gameplay works in Civ a "three sisters plantation" can definitely be the name of a unique ability.

I personally think that a "Three Sister Plantation could work as UI/UB in the game, maybe for a Wampanoang civ, it could also be called like Three Sister Garden or Three Sister Mound; also other like the Zuni have unique agriculture inventions like the "Waffle Garden"

 

[Thenewwwguy]

Europe really has plenty of civs in it, at least compared to other regions of the world. Of course, there's still plenty of good choices there, there's only so many spots available for civs, and I would like a little more representation elsewhere. Overall Asia also has plenty of civs, but being that Asia is so huge, and naturally divided by the Himalayas, etc., I think it's only fair to sub-divide it a little more, which does change things.

E. Asia: Bhutan!!! If we get another East Asian civ, it must be Bhutan.
S. Asia: Tamil (e.g. Chola).
N. America: Haudenosaunee, or Navajo, or for an especially interesting/niche civ, the Inuit. All are good choices here.
S. America: Muisca.
Africa: Swahili, or Maasai.
Oceania: Noongars, or Papuan might be interesting.

I’d argue Bhutan is a south asian country, but let’s not get into that

My preferred civ for each region/major cultural macrogroup would be as follows:

E. Asia: Jurchens (I’d love the Ainu but I don’t think there’s an immediate good leader which comes to mind).

S. Asia (Dravidians): Chola

Indo-Aryan S. Asia/The stuff between India and Iran: Mughals (Equal in interest for me are the Afghans/Pashtuns)

Southeast Asia: Champa, Lan Xang/Lao, Phillippines

Central Asia: Timurids

Middle East (Bronze Age): Assyria + Hittites

Middle East (after Bronze Age): Palmyra (for Classical era) and Oman (later)

North Africa: Berbers

West Africa: any of the three main Nigerian ethnic groups (Igbo, Yoruba or Hausa).

East Africa: Swahili

Southern Africa: Mutapa

Eastern Europe: Bulgaria

Central Europe: Bohemia

Western Europe: Ireland

Mesoamerica: Purépecha

Southern South America: Guarani

Northern South America: Muisca

North America: Tlingit, Haida, Navajo, Seminoles

 

[Zaarin]

Indo-Aryan S. Asia/The stuff between India and Iran: Mughals (Equal in interest for me are the Afghans/Pashtuns)
...
Central Asia: Timurids

Aren't the Mughals and Timurids essentially the same--i.e., didn't the Timurids conquer India and become the Mughals?

 

[Thenewwwguy]

Aren't the Mughals and Timurids essentially the same--i.e., didn't the Timurids conquer India and become the Mughals?

yes! but culturally they were very different. the timurids were persianized turks, and so were the mughals, but the mughals adopted Hindustani culture fairly readily over time, and as a ruling empire their priorities were different, as were their styles of rule and conquest

 

[Kimiimaro]

On the flip side, that means getting stuck with Napoleon again.

There's always a slight chance that we could get Napoleon III instead to spice things up

 

[Abaxial]

The work of the anthropologist Franz Boas is relevant here. For the 99% of Civ players who just want a game, much of this discussion is irrelevant, but if one looks deeper, the game has a very Whiggish perspective. The course of Western development of civilisation is supposedly the only one, and the culture of, say, France is superior to that of the Inuit. But the Inuit have been around just as long as the French. They didn't develop universities and art galleries because their culture was in complete harmony with their surroundings. Pushing them down the same tech tree from warriors to modern infantry supposes that their culture is inferior, whereas in fact it is completely suitable for the Inuit people.

This is why I am in principle against bringing more tribes into the game. If a people have lived in their homeland for thousands of years and never got round to developing cities, it's likely because they never needed or wanted cities, and forcing them down the Western developmental path is inappropriate.

 

[Phoenix1595]

All I know is that it is March, which means we should finally know soon the last Civ in the pack!!!

As for my prediction, it often seems they hold back an returning civ for last during each xpack announcement. Guesses above about the Iroquois/Haudenosaunee are not completely unfounded.

 

[AntSou]

it often seems they hold back an returning civ for last during each xpack announcement.

The last reveals were Eleanor for GS and Shaka/Zulu for R&F. Gitarja/Indonesia was the last pack of the first round of DLC. I don't really think that sets a pattern.

In NFP new Civs have been packed together with returning Civs, and all individual packs have been highly requested returning Civs (Ethiopia and Babylon). I guess there's a pattern there, but it only takes one to break it...

 

[Tigranes]

Only 1 new civ to go and 11K+ replies in this thread! You people really love to speculate...

The work of the anthropologist Franz Boas is relevant here. For the 99% of Civ players who just want a game, much of this discussion is irrelevant, but if one looks deeper, the game has a very Whiggish perspective. The course of Western development of civilisation is supposedly the only one, and the culture of, say, France is superior to that of the Inuit. But the Inuit have been around just as long as the French. They didn't develop universities and art galleries because their culture was in complete harmony with their surroundings. Pushing them down the same tech tree from warriors to modern infantry supposes that their culture is inferior, whereas in fact it is completely suitable for the Inuit people.

This is why I am in principle against bringing more tribes into the game. If a people have lived in their homeland for thousands of years and never got round to developing cities, it's likely because they never needed or wanted cities, and forcing them down the Western developmental path is inappropriate.

Drastically slow down the natural conversion pace in the new barbarians mode and Fraxis got your wishes covered.

 

[AntSou]

The new Map Script, Highlands, was included with the Gauls.

Maybe we should try to figure out the next Civ by looking at potential map scripts that fit with the Civ's ability?

Ice Age was present in both Civ 5 and Civ 4 but is missing in Civ 6. That also fits perfectly with my Inuit gamble
---

That reminds me... I hope in Civ 7 tiles become more dynamic. Having environmental effects but no desertification mechanic feels like a waste. Deserts, Tundra and Snow tiles should have a chance of extending towards adjacent tiles without Woods at high levels of CO2. Having to plant woods to prevent increasing desertification would be so cool.

 

[cosmicmangobear]

I personally think if the final civ is Portugal, Civ6 is a wrap and the next content we get will be from a new game. If it's not Portugal (perhaps an indigenous North American civ or Italian republic) then we can expect at least another DLC. Portugal is just too important to leave out, having been a staple since Civ3 like Korea and Byzantium. I think they'll want to go for another female leader (Maria II?) keeping in line with R&F and GS and the new game mechanic will be focused either on public health or colonies.

 

[AntSou]

the new game mechanic will be focused either on public health or colonies.

They already confirmed there will be no plague/pandemic game mechanic, so I find it much less likely anything related to public health is necessary, since that's already handled by housing.

Besides, the game modes have had no relation a very tenuous relation, at best, to the Civs they're packed with.

 

[Jkchart]

Aren't the Mughals and Timurids essentially the same--i.e., didn't the Timurids conquer India and become the Mughals?

Yes and no. The Timurid Empire fell before the Mughals were established, but Timurid princes still ruled in small states in Central Asia. Then Babur conquered Kabul and used it to invade India, the rest is history. Also everything @Thenewwwguy says is correct too

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

The last reveals were Eleanor for GS and Shaka/Zulu for R&F. Gitarja/Indonesia was the last pack of the first round of DLC. I don't really think that sets a pattern.

In NFP new Civs have been packed together with returning Civs, and all individual packs have been highly requested returning Civs (Ethiopia and Babylon). I guess there's a pattern there, but it only takes one to break it...

I mean if Portugal was lead by a male leader it definitely would break the pattern in several ways.

 

[Zaarin]

yes! but culturally they were very different. the timurids were persianized turks, and so were the mughals, but the mughals adopted Hindustani culture fairly readily over time, and as a ruling empire their priorities were different, as were their styles of rule and conquest

Yes and no. The Timurid Empire fell before the Mughals were established, but Timurid princes still ruled in small states in Central Asia. Then Babur conquered Kabul and used it to invade India, the rest is history. Also everything @Thenewwwguy says is correct too

Thanks for the insight. Central Asia is a major blind spot in Western consciousness, and I've tried to correct that--but my personal knowledge of the region doesn't extend much past Antiquity.

There's always a slight chance that we could get Napoleon III instead to spice things up

I'm generally opposed to leaders/civs from later than the 18th century, but I'd be okay with Napoleon III. I feel like he's sorely underappreciated.

Only 1 new civ to go and 11K+ replies in this thread! You people really love to speculate...

That's why they call us "fanatics."

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

I'm generally opposed to leaders/civs from later than the 18th century, but I'd be okay with Napoleon III. I feel like he's sorely underappreciated.

He does have one of my favorite historical quotes:

"Silly ideas multiplied like rabbits in the head of Napoleon III ..."

He belongs, I think, in the same category as Charles the Bold of Burgundy: his ambitions and intentions grossly exceeded his actual resources and abilities, and in both cases the result was the destruction of their own states (Burgundy completely as an independent political entity, France as an Empire or Monarchy)

On the other hand, in the process of failing, he accomplished some memorable and lasting things within France like the "Boulevardization" of Paris, and he has a host of potential "Unique Units" in the founding of the Legion Etrangere, Zouaves, "Napoleon" 12-pounder artillery, the first steam-powered Ship of the Line: also named Napoleon (considered by many naval historians to be the first steam-powered Battleship in history - that's gotta be worth something!)

 

[Jah Live]

personally since Canada was supposed to (?) be the francophone post colonial civ, if there *was* going to be a majority-black post-colonial caribbean civ, I’d pick Haiti (led by Touissant L’Overture) before Jamaica, but that’s me

A cultural victory with Jamaica has potential, I actually wouldn't mind Haiti or Cuba too. I'm all for postcolonial Caribbean representation and believe the region has much to offer, the prospect of additional natural wonders and new exciting ways to play. Game developers would be taking a chance of course! But continuous base game appearances isn't essential, paid DLC's (Civilization & Scenario Pack) to test the waters, could certainly be considered. Particularly for console players who are unable to access mod content.

 

[Zaarin]

He belongs, I think, in the same category as Charles the Bold of Burgundy: his ambitions and intentions grossly exceeded his actual resources and abilities, and in both cases the result was the destruction of their own states (Burgundy completely as an independent political entity, France as an Empire or Monarchy)

On the other hand, in the process of failing, he accomplished some memorable and lasting things within France like the "Boulevardization" of Paris, and he has a host of potential "Unique Units" in the founding of the Legion Etrangere, Zouaves, "Napoleon" 12-pounder artillery, the first steam-powered Ship of the Line: also named Napoleon (considered by many naval historians to be the first steam-powered Battleship in history - that's gotta be worth something!)

The thing with Louis Napoleon is that his foreign policy was an unqualified disaster from start to finish, but his domestic policies were, on the whole, effective. One might say he was a middling leader but an effective administrator. At any rate, Civ is clearly willing to explore options that were "interesting" rather than successful (I mean, CdM also presided over the demise of the Valois dynasty). I could see Napoleon III being given some kind of penalty for combat offset by a boost to building districts and improvements or something to that effect.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

The new Map Script, Highlands, was included with the Gauls.

Maybe we should try to figure out the next Civ by looking at potential map scripts that fit with the Civ's ability?

Ice Age was present in both Civ 5 and Civ 4 but is missing in Civ 6. That also fits perfectly with my Inuit gamble
---

That reminds me... I hope in Civ 7 tiles become more dynamic. Having environmental effects but no desertification mechanic feels like a waste. Deserts, Tundra and Snow tiles should have a chance of extending towards adjacent tiles without Woods at high levels of CO2. Having to plant woods to prevent increasing desertification would be so cool.

I have been hoping for some ice age scenario or map. So we could be looking at the Inuit, maybe the Saami (or even less likely, somewhere in Siberia).

It's also possible that the map is a continent map, in which case the Americas seem most likely. At this point I think we can rule out a Middle East map since I don't think we are getting more on top of Babylon in NFP. Africa is still fair game but a longer shot I think.

I do believe that the Inuit may be the last extremely highly requested new civ besides Italy (I guess the Saami are comparably close as well, if you consider them as vicariously representing the almost-as-popular Finland). Many have observed that they don't really fit in as a civ, but the concept is so extremely popular they might be forced into a civ mold anyway.