[NFP] Civilization VI: Possible New Civilizations Thread

[Wielki Hegemon]

Can this change your mind?
Maria Theresa Leader Ability: Royal Marriage- May spend extra gold to send a Royal Children to another leader you have an alliance with. This gives you more diplomatic access plus extra diplo favor, or culture, per turn for both you and your ally.

This sounds much better
@LastSword Those people created distinct cultures, and sometimes empires and we are trying to blur this diversity because from some people's perspective Italy is one jar you can throw many things. At the same point, some of those people are opposed to blob Civs. I don't hate Italy as a country. All I want to say is mixing them all in a dull goulash is worse than separating them because many of them have some interesting and distinct background, history, and culture. I will explain to you why I want Venice over Italian Civ perhaps you better catch my perspective.
The main purpose I would like Venice is not a fact I want to cover some region/historical period or see a Civ or leader from previous iterations. The reason is simple. Venice offers me (and perhaps many of you too) one thing that no other Civ offers. A story. Opportunity to play as a state corporation with the addition of interesting trade, diplomacy, espionage, and culture crossovers. Brutal, sneaky, and greed manipulators using spies (even prostitutes were state workers) and secret police from the one hand and people who created almost magical out of this world culture and city. At the fall of its power changed its capital into a city of sin, the spiritual ancestor of Las Vegas. If this would be somehow distorted then this experience would be ruined. I fully understand this might be not a catchy story for everyone, but for me it is. Compared with this all filling geographical gaps, introducing modern nations, revisit leaders and Civs from previous iterations, using specific maybe even fun UI or UA is just a dry enumeration. Sometimes I think we all skipping a very important thing as it comes to possible new Civ. A fantasy of playing with a specific fraction with all set of their characteristics taken from history itself.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

*Replying to my own post*

Commercial Hub: Italy (Could be Venice too)
Theatre Square: Austria
Holy Site: Hawaii (Heiau) (But anything Mexican would be super cool!)
Ironclad: Italy (Makes the most sense as the only post-industrial civ really left)
Cuirasser: Morocco (Berber calvary)
Field Cannon: Timurids (Zamburak-thanks @dukewilliam)

Heiau feels more like a shrine replacement to me.

Korea. Oh, wait, they're already in the game, and it's a Campus replacement. On a more serious note, I'm also struggling to think of a non-European civ who's not already in the game who's a good candidate for this one--some of the better candidates I can think of would be Korea as mentioned or Japan with a Nō Theatre or Vietnam with a Water Puppet Theatre. A Mesoamerican Ball Court could conceivably have been a unique Theatre Square, but Aztecs already have that as an Arena replacer. It would be a bit of a stretch--it really ought to be a unique Holy Site (which we also lack a second version of)--but I suppose one could make the case for a Muskogean civ getting a Stomp Ground as a unique Theatre Square--but again, it would be better as a unique Holy Site. If one is going for a culture-focused Native American civ, a PNW tribe is the obvious choice, but I wouldn't see them as a unique Theatre Square candidate.

Yeah outside of the Seowon I couldn't think of anything in Asia that would be a theatre square. I guess for Africa you could mayyyybe use a Medina Quarter, but like the Piazza that's really just a placeholder for any district.

 

[SirMediocrity]

Jan Žižka has my vote--to me, Hussitism is a lot of what makes Bohemia such a compelling choice (though the war wagon is already a nod to that). Only downside is his capital would be Tábor rather than Prague--in which case I think Wenceslaus IV gets my backup vote (he tried very hard to keep the peace both between the Hussites and the Catholic Church and among the Hussite factions; I think he was more competent than history generally gives him credit for). Sigismund is just begging to lead Hungary, too, so that's a no from me.

I'm glad to see someone on this forum acknowledge Jan Žižka. I made a mod design for Bohemia a while back that had him as the leader. If I remember correctly I gave him the War Wagon as a unique unit and the Hrad as a unique district.

 

[PhoenicianGold]

Okay, we have a water mill replacement.

How about the Berbers get a Ghorfa replacing the granary? Add that, some oases bonuses, and something encouraging distance similar to the Gauls, and I think they're on the way to something interesting.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Yeah outside of the Seowon I couldn't think of anything in Asia that would be a theatre square. I guess for Africa you could mayyyybe use a Medina Quarter, but like the Piazza that's really just a placeholder for any district.

I'd throw out the possibility of a Water Puppet Theater as a possibility.
I mean the Observatory and Hippodrome are whole districts, even though they represent a singular building that could go into a district so...

The only other thing I could think of was something to do with Muay Thai for Siam, considering it's a big part of the culture today and historically performed at festivals, but that would probably work better in the EC. Besides I'd much rather a unique Commerical Hub (Floating Market) for them.

Okay, we have a water mill replacement.

How about the Berbers get a Ghorfa replacing the granary? Add that, some oases bonuses, and something encouraging distance similar to the Gauls, and I think they're on the way to something interesting.

If it doesn't go the Iroquois for a unique Longhouse, I could see that. I could also easily see a whole Ksar/Qsar being a tile improvement built on desert and give similar bonuses toward housing, food, and production on the desert tile.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

I'm glad to see someone on this forum acknowledge Jan Žižka. I made a mod design for Bohemia a while back that had him as the leader. If I remember correctly I gave him the War Wagon as a unique unit and the Hrad as a unique district.

In short: He was a badass and a madlad. The guy asked that when he died, his skin would become a drum to encourage his brothers.

 

[onepurpose]

Indeed. Examples are the Greeks, Mayans, Scythians, India, etc.

All of these are ancient civs/empires/culturalentities/whatever , which is the reason that it works partially ..

As I said in a previous post, the only way Italy could be is under a XIX century leader

 

[Guandao]

I might as well list my Wishlist for a "Final Frontier" Pass:
Alt Leader: Thuthmoses III for Egypt (I feel like Egypt needs an alt-leader the most, despite Firaxis' apparent love for Cleo, the New Kingdom period needs some love)
1. Any of the Western African Coastal Civs (Ashanti, Benin, Yoruba or Dahomey) (a really underappreciated area, and don't tell me Mali adequately represents all of West Africa, especially when they made Musa speak entirely in Arabic)
2. Morocco/Berbers/Numidia-I'm hoping for the leader to speak a Berber language instead since we already have two Arabic speaking leaders in Civ6.
3. A Native American Civ located in present-day USA (my picks are Choctaw/Cherokee/Creek, or the Hopi) A PNW Civ would be nice, but they are in Canada. I'll accept Apache/Navajo, Comanche or even the Sioux.
4. some form of Italy
5. Bulgaria
6. Madagascar (kinda represents SE Asia in its own way, but in Africa!)
7. Hittites or Assyria, or possibly even Aram/Palmyra/Syria led by Zenobia!
8. Tupi or the Guarani

Note how I prioritized Africa over the other continents. I think SE Asia is done in Civ6, along with East Asia, and probably South Asia. Oceania seems done as well.
City-States like Kumasi, Fez, Preslav, Antananarivo, Hattusa would have to be replaced depending on which Civs are added. I realized there's an achievement associated with Hattusa (RIP Hittites).

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

All of these are ancient civs/empires/culturalentities/whatever , which is the reason that it works partially ..

As I said in a previous post, the only way Italy could be is under a XIX century leader

Isn't it really up to the developers?

Not saying you are wrong or right but if the developers can create a Phoenician civilization that was comprised of a multitude of city-states over the more centralized Carthaginian Empire, or a separate Macedonian kingdom apart from the Greek city-states of Athens and Sparta, I don't see why the developers can't make a Renaissance Italy work?

3. A Native American Civ located in present-day USA (my picks are Choctaw/Cherokee/Creek, or the Hopi) A PNW Civ would be nice, but they are in Canada. I'll accept Apache/Navajo, Comanche or even the Sioux.

Well the Tlingit are located primarily in Alaska and a PNW culture.
But I agree with your reasonings and would almost pick any one.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

Here's my wishlist! Since it's the trend here, I might as well.

1: Toussaint Louverture of the Haitian Empire
2: Jose Rizal of the Philippine Empire
3: Puduhepa of the Hittite Empire
4: Tecumseh of the Shawnee Empire
5: Kaloyan of the Bulgarian Empire
6: Usman dan Fodio of the Sokoto Empire
7: Jose Artigas of the Uruguayan Empire
8: Brian Boru or Michael Collins of the Irish Empire
9(Alt Leader): Margaret I of the Danish, Swedish, and Norwegian Empire.

Note that I have ideas for all of these, so I'm a bit biased here.

 

[The Kingmaker]

All of these are ancient civs/empires/culturalentities/whatever , which is the reason that it works partially ..

As I said in a previous post, the only way Italy could be is under a XIX century leader

What is a “cultural entity” and why don’t the Italians qualify in your mind?

Greeks — disunited city-states, some fought each other
Maya — disunited city-states, some fought each other
Sumerians — disunited city-states, some fought each other
Italians — disunited city-states, some fought each other. They’ve only been a single nation-state for like a century and a half.

You don’t have to be a nation-state to be a civ.

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

What is a “cultural entity” and why don’t the Italians qualify in your mind?

Greeks — disunited city-states, some fought each other
Maya — disunited city-states, some fought each other
Sumerians — disunited city-states, some fought each other
Italians — disunited city-states, some fought each other. They’ve only been a single nation-state for like a century and a half.

You don’t have to be a nation-state to be a civ.

India -- Disunited kingdoms, some fought each other.
China -- China is whole again... Then it broke again...

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Michael Collins of the Irish Empire

I thought we were trying to get away from making too many Anglo civs.? That's the most Anglo name I could think of.

9(Alt Leader): Margaret I of the Danish, Swedish, and Norwegian Empire.

Over one from Egypt?

Anyway I've had my wish list but I haven't necessarily said leaders yet:
Navajo- Manuelito
Iroquois- Jigonhsasee or Hiawatha (Similar playstyles)
Austria- Maria Theresa
Italy- Cosimo or Lorenzo de Medici (I'd take Victor Emmanuel II if it means Italy can get in though).
Berbers-Dihya
Assyria-Ashurbanipal
Siam- Rama II or Rama V (unlikely Siam get's in)
Benin/Dahomey-Idia or Ghezo
Wildcard: Haiti- Toussaint Louverture
Alt leader: Akhenaten for Egypt

 

[Duke William of Normandy]

I thought we were trying to get away from making too many Anglo civs.? That's the most Anglo name I could think of.

I don't think he would enjoy being associated with the Brits. I don't blame him, either. Now the Welsh, on the other hand...

 

[onepurpose]

Renaissance Italy share a tongue and a culture.. but cannot be considered a single faction in terms of a playable civ .. It would be -more or less- like considering EU as a civ..

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I don't think he would enjoy being associated with the Brits. I don't blame him, either. Now the Welsh, on the other hand...

Had to look him up. To me his name sounded like he'd be some famous musician. Probably was thinking of Phil Collins who in fact is English.
Brian Boru on the other hand would work.

 

[Leucarum]

I think I'd prefer a rotating lineup of the renaissance Italian city states to a fully formed Italy. They are each so flavourful that it is easy to imagine how for example, a Venice, Florence or Papal State might play relative to one another and I find that to be much more appealing than an unified Italy... Which honestly I struggle to think of unique mechanics for...

 

[Xandinho]

I might as well list my Wishlist for a "Final Frontier" Pass:
Alt Leader: Thuthmoses III for Egypt (I feel like Egypt needs an alt-leader the most, despite Firaxis' apparent love for Cleo, the New Kingdom period needs some love)
1. Any of the Western African Coastal Civs (Ashanti, Benin, Yoruba or Dahomey) (a really underappreciated area, and don't tell me Mali adequately represents all of West Africa, especially when they made Musa speak entirely in Arabic)
2. Morocco/Berbers/Numidia-I'm hoping for the leader to speak a Berber language instead since we already have two Arabic speaking leaders in Civ6.
3. A Native American Civ located in present-day USA (my picks are Choctaw/Cherokee/Creek, or the Hopi) A PNW Civ would be nice, but they are in Canada. I'll accept Apache/Navajo, Comanche or even the Sioux.
4. some form of Italy
5. Bulgaria
6. Madagascar (kinda represents SE Asia in its own way, but in Africa!)
7. Hittites or Assyria, or possibly even Aram/Palmyra/Syria led by Zenobia!
8. Tupi or the Guarani

Note how I prioritized Africa over the other continents. I think SE Asia is done in Civ6, along with East Asia, and probably South Asia. Oceania seems done as well.
City-States like Kumasi, Fez, Preslav, Antananarivo, Hattusa would have to be replaced depending on which Civs are added. I realized there's an achievement associated with Hattusa (RIP Hittites).

I'd definitely buy this. To be more specific, the ancient civ I'd like that it was Assyria. The Italian representation for me I'd like Republic of Venice. At this point (when we'd be achieving ~58 civs) another civ of Oceania maybe wouldn't hurt, but I don't think it is that high priority.

Yeah, SE Asia is done, at least what refers to civs. But regarding to wonders, it's pretty underepresented. Especially when we see that we have four wonders in South Asia and only one in all SE Asia. For future packs, I wish they add at least more two wonder of East Asia.

 

[The Kingmaker]

Renaissance Italy share a tongue and a culture.. but cannot be considered a single faction in terms of a playable civ .. It would be -more or less- like considering EU as a civ..

See also Greece, Maya, Sumer, Scythia, India, Germany, Arabia, Gaul and the Maori.

Your blanket statement would apply to each of those civs as well. You do not have to have a single unified polity to qualify as a civilization. In fact, many civilizations never unified at all.

 

[Zaarin]

Unique Ability: Prague Defenestration. Target spy mission Neutralize Governor are easier against you

The Praguers liked throwing people out of windows so much they did it twice.

Well the Tlingit are located primarily in Alaska and a PNW culture.

And the PNW extends south into Washington and northern Oregon, though the further south you go the less sophisticated the culture. That being said the Makah or Nuu-chah-nulth of northern Washington would be pretty prime candidates for inclusion as the only whalers of the region.