Current v1.13 Development Discussion

[Imperator Knoedel]

America without Democracy after you just ruined Central Planning? Which side are you on anyway? That makes no sense unless... Mother of Marx, I should have seen the signs back when you removed Judaism entirely! Tell me, what changes have you in store for Fascism and Germany?

 

[baseballpie]

After not checking the forums for almost four months, I was expecting 1.13 to be released by now. You disappoint me, Leoreth.

In all seriousness, I love the sense of direction you continue to impart on your creation, and I look forward to release. Please continue to keep up the good work.

Also, if my memory serves me correctly, congratulations on Senior Mod! I only recall you as a Junior Moderator, so obviously you have done well.

Au revior,
BP

 

[Leoreth]

Yeah somehow I managed to waste away the summer by having fun outside and stuff. But now we're back on track again, I hope to carry the momentum over to the next version.

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

Also, if my memory serves me correctly, congratulations on Senior Mod! I only recall you as a Junior Moderator, so obviously you have done well.

Na, he has just gotten old.

 

[Leoreth]

*audience boos*

 

[Tigranes]

In all seriousness, I love the sense of direction you continue to impart on your creation, and I look forward to release. Please continue to keep up the good work.

BP

I was really surprised no one opened a thread about reaching milestone 1000th SVN commit. I used to complain about perpetual development, but I guess the best mod about historical development of the world in Civ's history must be continuous historical development of its own. I am enjoying the process.

 

[Panopticon]

We just don't believe in the Great Man theory of mod development. Leoreth's schedule is determined by objective environmental conditions (nice weather).

 

[Imperator Knoedel]

The entire history of mod development has been a history of class struggles.

 

[Bernd-das-Brot]

From the complete features list:

* Civilizations far ahead/behind in tech receive a penalty/bonus to research costs that scales with era.

* Tech leaders receive a tech penalty depending on how far ahead they are.


Are these two separate mali? Does it work for all techs of a given civilization or only for techs no other civ (or only a few civs) have?
(I may have entered modern era first, so all techs get more expensive for me, even Divine Right if I missed it until now? Or only the modern techs no one else has?)

Are there any tech cost changes from date/turn number still in game? I rememeber there was a tech cost change in classical age in former versions.

So the number of cities does not change the tech-cost anymore? (Would like that.)

And civs still have different tech costs? (e.g. European civs cheaper than most others.)

Please enlighten me.

 

[Bernd-das-Brot]

Is there a discount for small civilizations? (Rise of Civilization)

 

[ezzlar]

I believe Leoreth wrote so. Small civs get a boon.

Can the player release its vassals?

 

[Bernd-das-Brot]

I am not sure, but I don't think so.

Perhaps on the F1 screen with the small fist icon, but I think it just works for cities you own yourself.

 

[Chep]

why does China get an automatically founded City placed 3W from their double-holy-city every 2-3 turns in the 600AD-scenario if you raze the undefended city 1s of it?

Since China never seems to collapse in my games (5 so far in SVN 999-1000), I wanted to limit them a bit from early on, but they just keep getting that city founded over and over, making it impossible for me :/

Also, why does Indonesia keep founding Jakarta on the (later appearing) Coffee instead of on the Stone? Or is that dependant on the rest of their city placement?

 

[Tigranes]

Is there a discount for small civilizations? (Rise of Civilization)

If you mouse over the tech cost in the game it shows explicit discount amount and the reason: civ size.

 

[DarkLunaPhantom]

why does China get an automatically founded City placed 3W from their double-holy-city every 2-3 turns in the 600AD-scenario if you raze the undefended city 1s of it?

Since China never seems to collapse in my games (5 so far in SVN 999-1000), I wanted to limit them a bit from early on, but they just keep getting that city founded over and over, making it impossible for me :/

Every time AI China builds a settler, it gets a city (and loses that settler) from a predetermined list if founding such a city is possible for them.

 

[Chep]

SVN 1000:

- Mali doesnt produce Slaves (not sure if intentional), from spawn until ~1900 have never seen him have a slave.

- Tech-speed seems a bit off: China had Physics around 1620 in another game Spain had Scientific Method by 1570 (both Monarch-level). Several EU civs regularly have Astronomy around 1400 AD. Poland had Optics for trade in 1350 in my last game (and our relation was only at "cautious").

- AI civs collapse too late: China hardly ever collapses to the Mongols (only works if you also take 1-2 cities from their core), Ottomans and a few others also seem overly stable.

- Foreign Relations often cause a crisis or 2 in the early-game, without any real option by the player to influence or counter it.

 

[Ani Taneen]

- AI civs collapse too late: China hardly ever collapses to the Mongols (only works if you also take 1-2 cities from their core), Ottomans and a few others also seem overly stable.

It is 1912 in my 3000 BC Japan start, China still hasn't collapsed.

While the short term solution is to tweak stability for the AI. I feel like the long term solution is a civil war system.

Japanese civil war or internal conquest might be an idea for later on, if I get the chance to flesh out civil wars and rebellions in general.

When you do get a chance to look into it, are you thinking of it being a way to fulfill the Sengoku Jidai, Three Kingdoms period, and that silly thing Americans did for 4 years when they switched civics (America spawns with slavery, change it and see the south rise!!!).

Or could it an alternative to the collapse mechanic? Where unstable civs (that are too stable to collapse because their core is intact) start slowly seeing another AI try to pull an Alp Arslan on them (Armies show up and try to create a state within a state)?

 

[Panopticon]

- Tech-speed seems a bit off: China had Physics around 1620 in another game Spain had Scientific Method by 1570 (both Monarch-level). Several EU civs regularly have Astronomy around 1400 AD. Poland had Optics for trade in 1350 in my last game (and our relation was only at "cautious").

I would like to chime in on this one: Spain had Scientific Method by 1600 in the default difficulty level. This is the game in which I learned that Education is not a prerequisite for Scientific Method. So that means they had Astronomy and Printing Press as well, which might be fine.

 

[Leoreth]

From the complete features list:

* Civilizations far ahead/behind in tech receive a penalty/bonus to research costs that scales with era.

* Tech leaders receive a tech penalty depending on how far ahead they are.


Are these two separate mali? Does it work for all techs of a given civilization or only for techs no other civ (or only a few civs) have?
(I may have entered modern era first, so all techs get more expensive for me, even Divine Right if I missed it until now? Or only the modern techs no one else has?)

Yes, they are separate modifiers. The first is tech specific and depends on the number of civs already having discovered that tech. The second applies to all techs and depends on how far ahead you are.

They fulfill different roles: the first keeps the tech level closer between civs, the second slows down the frontrunner only.

So in your Divine Right example, the second would affect you.

Are there any tech cost changes from date/turn number still in game? I rememeber there was a tech cost change in classical age in former versions.

No, neither date nor era affect tech costs anymore.

So the number of cities does not change the tech-cost anymore? (Would like that.)

That's right.

And civs still have different tech costs? (e.g. European civs cheaper than most others.)

Please enlighten me.

Yes, civ specific modifiers still exist of course.

Is there a discount for small civilizations? (Rise of Civilization)

Yes. There's one for having recently spawned, and if you are in a later game era, another one for having less than five cities.

SVN 1000:

- Mali doesnt produce Slaves (not sure if intentional), from spawn until ~1900 have never seen him have a slave.

- Tech-speed seems a bit off: China had Physics around 1620 in another game Spain had Scientific Method by 1570 (both Monarch-level). Several EU civs regularly have Astronomy around 1400 AD. Poland had Optics for trade in 1350 in my last game (and our relation was only at "cautious").

- AI civs collapse too late: China hardly ever collapses to the Mongols (only works if you also take 1-2 cities from their core), Ottomans and a few others also seem overly stable.

- Foreign Relations often cause a crisis or 2 in the early-game, without any real option by the player to influence or counter it.

For the tech and stability: which difficulty was that on?

 

[Chep]

all on Monarch, I played Emperor in SVN 999, but decided to play on Monarch for SVN1000 since those results are probably more important for you.

no real difference in AI stability noticed between monarch & emperor though