D'Artagnan01: Low-level Training Day

[Bucephalus]

Looks like it is back to me. If I cannot play on Saturday (which is normally a good Civing day for me) I will post a skip.

I will use the previous summary-from-memory post as my planning post.

We have many advantageous trades available to us, I suggest that is a priority; and one of those trades is 'Iron', a God-sent opportunity to build some military.

So, be aware Tribute, you were playing with an 'Old Fart'.

Two, if I'm to be honest.

 

[CommandoBob]

We have many advantageous trades available to us, I suggest that is a priority; and one of those trades is 'Iron', a God-sent opportunity to build some military.

Good call! I don't even think I mentioned the trades in my planning, just focused on units and builds and such.

 

[Bede]

If you are checking the trade possibilities every single turn (as you should be) then those deals would have leaped right out at you. Be aggressive in your dealings and make sure you trade with everybody on the map that has something to offer.

 

[CommandoBob]

I will not be able to play my turns today, and thus ask for a skip.

However, it is also 4th of July weekend here in the States, so the game may languish until Wednesday or so. If no one picks it up by Monday evening, I will post a get and un-skip myself.

Which Save
Ansar the King's last save was at 340 AD (turnset 11); Bede's at 350 AD (turnset 12).

Continue from Bede's save?

 

[Bede]

Ok. if Bucephalus wants to take a turn that's great, otherwise I'll take one on Sunday afternoon.

@Bucephalus, might be interesting if you played from ansar's save. I imagine you can do a better series of deals than TGOM.

 

[Tribute]

Eh heh heh, old farts....

 

[Bucephalus]

Ok. if Bucephalus wants to take a turn that's great, otherwise I'll take one on Sunday afternoon.

I can play a turn if necessary, but no earlier than Sunday.

@Bucephalus, might be interesting if you played from ansar's save. I imagine you can do a better series of deals than TGOM.

You have a vivid imagination, Bede.

 

[Bede]

Then I'll take it tonight and have it ready for you tomorrow.

And remember, I don't have all the answers just a little more experience with the game, so my imagination is not all that vivid.

 

[Bede]

Growth and trade, growth and trade.

Being an intel junkie I spend some of the hoard on embassies for a look at the capitols

First the competition

And compare Paris

Cleo is showing hte effects of her war with Everybody

Not only do these guys get production discounts they are flat out producing us, but we are doing better at producing commerce.

There were lots of field swappings between towns as I wanted some to grow and some to produce more shields. The growth towns were the higher commerce towns while the shield emphasis went to those that had their population limits or were working on expansive projects. Any town that can do at least 9 shields net should get a barracks for training maces.

Everybody is off on a wonderfest

350AD

390

400

440

Paying attention to the trading possibilities every turn opened up the possibility of acquiring Feudalism when Education was learned in 400 AD, and I played it this way.

My reasoning went like this: The other continent (Abe and Ragnar) had Feudalism and were willing to trade Feudalism and lots of money for Education. But what if they knew Invention as well? On the other hand Lizzie knew Feudalism, but didn't have as much money, but I could get it for Theology (a worthless tech on the other continent). So that's how it went and lo and behold

Now I could have moved on and traded it to Abe as well but he wasn't willing to put money in the deal other than a token payment and he wanted to include Chivalry, not a useful piece of knowledge for us. I know everybidy likes Knights, but I see no reason to spend 70 hammers on a 4 hit unit when I can spend 40 (maces) on a 4 hit unit. Maces aren't fast movers, but we want deterrent more than striking power (at least until MilTrad is learned) right now and I foresee war for coal, maybe and maybe not even then.

Lyons is working a university as a prebuild for the Observatory and Astronomy is due soon. Be careful about trading Astronomy out as there is still a cascade out there from Leo's. Check the wonder builds carefully if you think it makes sense to trade, and if there is any doubt in your mind, don't. You can use f7 to find out who is building what where and use the espionage screen to investigate the towns, if you want to check.

Our next tech choice should be Navigation as it opens the map trading free for all and it gets us options for overseas trade. If we are going to get over the 80/20 hump and get our population in the core to 12 we need at least two more luxuries. Otherwise, once the entertainment slider gets to 30% it may be time to call in the priests and build a temple.

North of this line should get no town buildings at all (I did put a barracks into Cherbourg so I didn't have to recall the entire army for upgrades) but nothing else should go into them, even harbors....

You can start selling out the dud techs for whatever you can get if you are so inlclined.

Both Abe and Ragnar have guns and we just may want to stir them up a little. Declare on one and ally the other. Think about it.

The nations on our continent are nothing to worry about. Tech suckers is all they are right now. It might be fun to go acquire Chivalry then sell it to Liz and follow with a trade for horses and watch her wreck her economy getting ready for war.

 

[Bucephalus]

Bede, did you take this from Ansar's save or your own?

 

[Bede]

Played from my own

 

[Bucephalus]

Both Abe and Ragnar have guns and we just may want to stir them up a little. Declare on one and ally the other. Think about it.

Absolutely, that's my kinda game; and it's the perfect time to do it because they can't drag our neighbours in to it.

The nations on our continent are nothing to worry about. Tech suckers is all they are right now. It might be fun to go acquire Chivalry then sell it to Liz and follow with a trade for horses and watch her wreck her economy getting ready for war.

Now that thought intrigues me. It really irritates me that we are dependent on Hiyawotsisname for Iron, when it's so close to our border that I can smell the rust. How much gold will we pay him - or someone else - for Iron over the course of the game? If we could set-up Lizzie as our puppet (maybe make a little something from Chivalry, certainly from the Horses), then it would be no trouble to raze & replace a few Southern Iroquois cities while England's stout Yeomen did all the real fighting.

 

[CommandoBob]

Now that thought intrigues me. It really irritates me that we are dependent on Hiyawotsisname for Iron, when it's so close to our border that I can smell the rust. How much gold will we pay him - or someone else - for Iron over the course of the game? If we could set-up Lizzie as our puppet (maybe make a little something from Chivalry, certainly from the Horses), then it would be no trouble to raze & replace a few Southern Iroquois cities while England's stout Yeomen did all the real fighting.

Good and sneaky, I like that. Unless she has an ROP with the Big Chief.

In a short time, we will need iron and coal to make railroads. We will not need iron for many military units, only Knights and Cannons and a few naval units (Privateer, Frigate and Ironclad).

 

[Tribute]

Lizzie's "yeomen" are too limited in number; the English are already outnumbered by the Iroquois. It's not a very good idea. Maybe there's a better way?

 

[Ansar]

War with Iroquis sounds like fun. MA with Lizzie sounds even more fun, since we are squeezing him in and they share touching borders, so while they fight each other, we take the cake, as in we beat Hiawatha up. Lizzie may be outnumbered, but Lizzie + the mighty French = death to the Iroquis.

But why would we want to declare war on a nation on the other continent? that would give us WW...and thats bad...(read: please explain.)

 

[D'Artagnan59]

If we attack the English, GET LITTLER FRANCE! THE ENGLISH HAVE STOLEN OUR LANDS! JUST THANK GOD I'M NOT GEORGE PATTON!

 

[Bucephalus]

Lizzie's "yeomen" are too limited in number; the English are already outnumbered by the Iroquois. It's not a very good idea. Maybe there's a better way?

Sure, but this suggested plan of campaign is an extension of Bede's ponderings on whether we should aquire 'Chivalry' in trade, and subsequently sell to Lizzie; we then sell her horses too. I agree totally that as things stand, war with Iroquoi is a suicidal idea, but a war of limited objectives - with Lizzie's newly built Knights on side - would not be beyond us in 20 turns or so, if we improve the military.

 

[Bucephalus]

But why would we want to declare war on a nation on the other continent? that would give us WW...and thats bad...(read: please explain.)

The WW wouldn't be noticeable really, since we wouldn't actually engage in any combat. America & Scandinavia meanwhile put all their energies in to building and destroying military units, none of which helps them down the road to Space.

 

[CommandoBob]

Granted that we will soon need iron for Railroads, do we need it badly enough to get into a war when we have no coal? Iron for military needs is not critical since our goal is the stars in the sky and not stars on our shoulder-boards.

We may need to war for resources. For now I think we need to get smarter, firster.

If we gear up for war, we are not building libraries and universities and markets and other things to make us smart, fat and happy.

My fear is that we not have any coal in France and have to make war twice: once for iron and once for coal. This would disrupt our economy twice. My desire would be to wait until we 'discover' coal (when we learn Steam Power), examine our status and make our plans from that point.

 

[Bucephalus]

We may need to war for resources. For now I think we need to get smarter, firster

Given our UU, the next resource of significance is Salt.