Dawn of Civilization - an RFC modmod by Leoreth

[Sandmonster1989]

Please don't disable them after medieval, I was going to make La Habana awesome by combining the Great Cothon and the Colossus (excessive much?)

When I play as japan on the 3000 bc start, I can usually get the Light house, colossus, and Cothon all in my capital (with a LITTLE whipping but a LOT of chopping)... And I think Japan's UP is called "honor" and gives half cost for all promotions

Now for more suggestions for Babylon's UP. Ready?
why not have the babylonians get extra turns in their golden ages AFTER code of laws?
additional healthy from all resources (such as wheat, sheep, etc.)
towns provide extra food and/or hammers
after the developement of CoL, give 50% growth to cottages, etc into towns (if I've already suggested that, I'm sorry--I thought about it and wasn't sure if it got suggested but it seemed equeally as appropriate and wouldn't come into play until about the time that Persia spawns, so they can use it if they survive).
they could get a free random great person when they start a golden age, irreguardless of Babylon's GP rate at that time...
workers could build improvements a turn or two faster
SanePerson, please note that your UP would make the UHV's of Babylon too easy... (though my suggestions were the same way, lol.)

 

[Leoreth]

I like the longer golden ages after CoL.

 

[Llama231]

I think that it should have something to do with health in some way, Babylon's is horrible.

 

[Leoreth]

Yeah, and Aztecs need a UP that boosts their tech somehow, they are always behind when the Europeans arrive

 

[dcode147]

Sorry for spamming questions, but does anyone know why Rhye did not allow farms to be built upon floodplains? I tend to associate floodplains most with farms and a lot of the earliest farming communities rose around these features.

I'm not sure if this would require too much rebalancing or not, but what about making flood plains yield only 2 food 1 gold.

Constructing farms on floodplains would only take half the number of worker turns and yield +1 food and +1 gold (or maybe just +2 food) to floodplain. This will force early river valley civs (such as Egypt and Babylon) to take advantage of farming in order quickly grow their cities.

That is to not let ancient Egypt and Babylon grow monster cities. As Rhye didn't want to make changes to terrain features the only way to prevent that was to disable farming on those tiles.

Well what would you guys say about my suggested floodplain changes as a way to weaken Babylon later on then?
-making floodplains yield 2 food, 1 gold
-farms on floodplains constructed in half the number of worker turns
-farms on floodplains yield +1 food, +1 gold (this could be subject to rebalancing)

I think this will help give earlier river valley civs a quicker boost in the beginning but will be able to hinder their future teching rates as floodplains(new) with farms (yields 3f, 2g) is worse than floodplains(old) with cottages (3f, either +1, +2, +3 or +4 gold)



Also, what about placing an autorazed city such as Ur in southern Mesopotamia. It would represent Babylon's required domination of Sumeria before it expanded its empire elsewhere. In the meantime, Ur's culture would disrupt Babylon's initially until Babylon is capable of conquering it.

 

[dcode147]

Also, this is another idea to help civ balance by strengthening Rome and Italy slightly.

Would it be possible to place bonus-resources and/or bonus-improvements (scripted to appear, but cannot be built by players) of sorts that appear and disappear at certain dates? They would add food/production/commerce to certain tiles without throwing the game off balance in terms of amount of strategic and luxury resources available. Also the fact that they are a bonus resource or an improvement would mean we would be able to see which tiles would get the boost.


Examples of possible bonus-improvements:
-Monastery[+1food,+1production,+1gold] to be placed in some tiles of the Alps (to help give cities such as Venice, Genoa and Mediolanum more tiles to work and hence make them more appealing and better cities)
-Silk Route Trading Post[+3gold], several appear spaced out along the Silk Route in locations next to important historic trading cities at ~200BC, disappears ~1500AD, pillage gold ~20gold (this would help out cities such as Samarkand, Merv, Turfan etc... during the late antiquity and the middle ages)
-New World Treasure Fleet[+1 production, +2 gold], a couple appear in the Caribbean from ~1450 to 1800, pillage gold ~20gold (this may be sufficient to make Caribbean cities important enough)

For helping Caribbean cities, I'd rather see solutions such as a capable-of-being-pillaged improvement or something like doubling the amount of trade revenue for first 30 turns because that way piracy would be more encouraged and better replicated.


Examples of possible bonus-resources:
-Food Bonus Resource: +1 food
-Production Bonus Resource: +1 production
-Commerce Bonus Resource: +1 gold

Pretty much these bonus-resources would be placed around non-resource water and land tiles around cities that are weaker than they were historically. California, New York and Mumbai etc... They could also be added and removed at certain dates as well to represent when a certain geographic area (not entire civ) was better or worse at producing food, production and/or commerce.

 

[Beornhard]

I've a question: how does Civic stability work in this mod? Have stability parameters been reworked because of the changes from default RFC? I ask this because I've played this mod a couple of times and I always had negative values for the civic points indicated in the advisor screen, even when they where, in principle, "related" (e.g. Theocracy+Vassalage+Aristocracy+Patriarchate).

Another thing: shouldn't we be able to play with Italy, or that civ is enabled to the AI only?

 

[merijn_v1]

I've a question: how does Civic stability work in this mod? Have stability parameters been reworked because of the changes from default RFC? I ask this because I've played this mod a couple of times and I always had negative values for the civic points indicated in the advisor screen, even when they where, in principle, "related" (e.g. Theocracy+Vassalage+Aristocracy+Patriarchate).

Another thing: shouldn't we be able to play with Italy, or that civ is enabled to the AI only?

If you looked in the folder of this mod, you saw a file called: "Stability Guide for the new civics of Dawn of Civilization.doc". (I don't think I have to say more)

 

[Beornhard]

If you looked in the folder of this mod, you saw a file called: "Stability Guide for the new civics of Dawn of Civilization.doc". (I don't think I have to say more)

Ya, I should have checked before asking. Thank you.

As for Italy, I'm getting the in-game message to change to that civ at the spawn date, in case I start with an earlier civilization, but Italy isn't among the civs available from the main menu, either in 3000 BC ou 600 AD. I'll have to start an earlier game every time I want to play with them?

 

[Sandmonster1989]

If you looked in the folder of this mod, you saw a file called: "Stability Guide for the new civics of Dawn of Civilization.doc". (I don't think I have to say more)

Even after reading this, and applying it, my civics are still usually at at LEAST negative 10!! And that's when I'm lucky. Leoreth, is there a way you chould add MORE bonuses to the civic and city stabilities, because mine are always very VERY far in the negatives, even with all my citizens happy, all healthy, and a courthouse, jail, int agency and the other one (don't remember right now)... or at least have the penalties be less!! I don't know if anybody else has those problems, but my Economy (and ocassionally me expansion) are what pull me along.

The aztecs could get extra commerce from resources, until the Industrial Era? Like +2 without farm/mines, and +4 with. They were agricutural enough for that, right? that could give them an advantage of teching, or they could get a free tech every time they meet a new civ?

EDIT:

I'll have to start an earlier game every time I want to play with them?

Start as the Incas and wait 3 turns. The Italians only spawn when the romans are collapsed. They share the same civ slot... the Incans spawn the closest to the time that the Italians do, without going past...

 

[Orka]

About wonders, I'd rather not see them arbitrarily disappear during the medieval era. If classical Greece is still alive in the medieval era, why shouldn't they be able to build certain wonders, regardless of the year? Is strict historicity so important? Perhaps make the wonders cheaper and weaker.

Even after reading this, and applying it, my civics are still usually at at LEAST negative 10!!

Doesn't the civics stability get hit hardest during normalization? Or something like that. In any case, it shouldn't matter to you what each individual section contains, only the total stability. Like in real life, other factors can compensate for an civil unrest (city category) or unstable/weak gov't (civics category). With that in mind, it's not so unrealistic for your economic stability to be what keeps you afloat; after all, a good economy does do wonders even when major problems (racial tensions, large income inequality, inefficient bureaucracy, etc.) lie in the background.

 

[kairob]

I see no problem with the Vikings building a Great Lighthouse or Spain compiling a Great Library.

 

[Llama231]

Doesn't the civics stability get hit hardest during normalization? Or something like that. In any case, it shouldn't matter to you what each individual section contains, only the total stability.

I think that it is foreign. :/

 

[Sandmonster1989]

In any case, it shouldn't matter to you what each individual section contains, only the total stability. Like in real life, other factors can compensate for an civil unrest (city category) or unstable/weak gov't (civics category). With that in mind, it's not so unrealistic for your economic stability to be what keeps you afloat; after all, a good economy does do wonders even when major problems (racial tensions, large income inequality, inefficient bureaucracy, etc.) lie in the background.

Yes, but when my economy of like 90 or so is keeping me afloat (my stability says like 1 or 2), I get a little worried.... the ONLY time I have ever had a positive stability is when I was using autocracy/whatever beurocracy is called/state property/totalitarianism/free religion/occupation (I was playing as italy a while back)... I was at war with like 7 different civs and kickin' butt!! (totalitarianism gets bonuses when you are at war).

And is there a way to get a positive stability on ur foreign when you are a younger civ and can't sign defensive pacts yet?

 

[SilchasRuin]

does this mod work on BtS for Mac?

 

[KMRblue1027]

does this mod work on BtS for Mac?

No sorry it uses a custom .dll file

 

[Leoreth]

Yes, but when my economy of like 90 or so is keeping me afloat (my stability says like 1 or 2), I get a little worried.... the ONLY time I have ever had a positive stability is when I was using autocracy/whatever beurocracy is called/state property/totalitarianism/free religion/occupation (I was playing as italy a while back)... I was at war with like 7 different civs and kickin' butt!! (totalitarianism gets bonuses when you are at war).

And is there a way to get a positive stability on ur foreign when you are a younger civ and can't sign defensive pacts yet?

Trade resources (even for gold if you don't need happiness or health). But it's really difficult to increase the foreign rating.

 

[Ambassador]

Just started playing your modmod. Very good work, especially the fine-tuning! I enjoy the new flavour and accuracy very much.

Just one thing I noticed: Playing as Arabs you depend more on luck finishing the second UHV than before. The Jewish holy city being gone from Arab Jerusalem is one thing. It can be replaced by building the Zoroastrian shrine if you are able to conquer Persia. Islamic shrine in Mecca is usely no problem. Now the Christian holy city moves from Jerusalem pre-1300, effectively stealing my shrine option there. So I either have to conquer the new Christian holy city which can be anywhere. Or I have to conquer India and use the Buddhist and Hinduist holy cities.
This is quite tough.

EDIT: Just realised that though the holy city moved when the Apostolic Palace was built, my Christian shrine in Jerusalem stayed. Intended?

 

[Jusos2108]

Yes, it is intended. The shrine remains, if already built. But if it hasn't been built, you can only build it in the new holy city.

 

[civ_king]

Just started playing your modmod. Very good work, especially the fine-tuning! I enjoy the new flavour and accuracy very much.

Just one thing I noticed: Playing as Arabs you depend more on luck finishing the second UHV than before. The Jewish holy city being gone from Arab Jerusalem is one thing. It can be replaced by building the Zoroastrian shrine if you are able to conquer Persia. Islamic shrine in Mecca is usely no problem. Now the Christian holy city moves from Jerusalem pre-1300, effectively stealing my shrine option there. So I either have to conquer the new Christian holy city which can be anywhere. Or I have to conquer India and use the Buddhist and Hinduist holy cities.
This is quite tough.

EDIT: Just realised that though the holy city moved when the Apostolic Palace was built, my Christian shrine in Jerusalem stayed. Intended?

India is historical area *hint hint*