Descendants of the Scythians

interesting - I wonder how far back they can trace genography. I suppose they are building it as they go.

Oh man, they'll go all the way back to when your ancestors left Africa. For me that was some 75,000 years ago. I'd recommend anyone who is interested in their own lineages to take the test. It's a life changing experience, in my opinion.

And yeah, they are building it as they go on. They're even going into the completely rural areas and taking samples from people who live in tribal societies or villages etc. Very cool stuff.

Also, I forgot to mention in my previous post that the Scythians (according to scholars) spoke an Eastern Iranian language. Modern Pashto is also classified as an Eastern Iranian language.
 
I know this is an old topic, but I saw it while browsing on Google and just had to reply.

I'm a Pashtun (or Pathan as the South Asians call us) by ancestry and I really do believe that Pashtuns have Scythian "blood" in them. Most scholars now suggest that Scythians were not a homogeneous group of people, but instead were a mix of several different nomadic peoples.

That's not particularly surprising. Steppe states usually rose and fell so easily because they didn't really have to exterminate each other -- the loser in a war would join the winner and the combined tribe would include people from a whole bunch of different "bloodlines". It would really be astounding if a steppe tribe had somehow kept itself unmixed.
 
I've had few time last time and see how horribly old this is only now... Uhhh...
 
Hi guys,

What people present day are the direct descendants of the Scythians, Sarmatians, Alans, Goths, Huns etc.?

So far, I've heard the Pathans of Afghanistan, and the Jatts of Punjab. Any other groups? Anyone ever heard of the Jatts?

Sorry if this discussion has already happend.

regards,

Only Alans have direct descendants, who retain their iranic language: these are Ossetians.
Goths, Scythians, Sarmatians, Huns etc are all extinct and it makes no sense to claim someone is their descendants.
 
Goths, Scythians, Sarmatians, Huns etc are all extinct and it makes no sense to claim someone is their descendants.

I would find it unlikely that they were that completely wiped out.
 
I would find it unlikely that they were that completely wiped out.
Why? They were all political organizations, not ethnic ones. Do you see a Hunnic Kingdom on the world map today?
 
I would find it unlikely that they were that completely wiped out.

Not wiped out, but desintegrated as political entities, and assimilated when it comes to ethnicity. There may be, of course, some genetic descendants of Scythians, but no direct ethnic or political ones.
 
Why? They were all political organizations, not ethnic ones. Do you see a Hunnic Kingdom on the world map today?

The Scythian tribes were not ethnically based? :confused:

Anyway, all this talk of Scythians reminds me of who the real descendants are:

You are millions. We are hordes and hordes and hordes.
Try and take us on!
Yes, we are Scythians! Yes, we are Asians -
With slanted and greedy eyes!

For you, the ages, for us a single hour.
We, like obedient slaves,
Held up a shield between two enemy races -
The Tatars and Europe!

For ages and ages your old furnace raged
And drowned out the roar of avalanches,
And Lisbon and Messina's fall
To you was but a monstrous fairy tale!

For hundreds of years you gazed at the East,
Storing up and melting down our jewels,
And, jeering, you merely counted the days
Until your cannons you could point at us!

The time is come. Trouble beats its wings -
And every day our grudges grow,
And the day will come when every trace
Of your Paestums may vanish!

O, old world! While you still survive,
While you still suffer your sweet torture,
Come to a halt, sage as Oedipus,
Before the ancient riddle of the Sphinx!..

Russia is a Sphinx. Rejoicing, grieving,
And drenched in black blood,
It gazes, gazes, gazes at you,
With hatred and with love!..

It has been ages since you've loved
As our blood still loves!
You have forgotten that there is a love
That can destroy and burn!

We love all- the heat of cold numbers,
The gift of divine visions,
We understand all- sharp Gallic sense
And gloomy Teutonic genius...

We remember all- the hell of Parisian streets,
And Venetian chills,
The distant aroma of lemon groves
And the smoky towers of Cologne...

We love the flesh - its flavor and its color,
And the stifling, mortal scent of flesh...
Is it our fault if your skeleton cracks
In our heavy, tender paws?

When pulling back on the reins
Of playful, high-spirited horses,
It is our custom to break their heavy backs
And tame the stubborn slave girls...

Come to us! Leave the horrors of war,
And come to our peaceful embrace!
Before it's too late - sheathe your old sword,
Comrades! We shall be brothers!

But if not - we have nothing to lose,
And we are not above treachery!
For ages and ages you will be cursed
By your sickly, belated offspring!

Throughout the woods and thickets
In front of pretty Europe
We will spread out! We'll turn to you
With our Asian muzzles.

Come everyone, come to the Urals!
We're clearing a battlefield there
Between steel machines breathing integrals
And the wild Tatar Horde!

But we are no longer your shield,
Henceforth we'll not do battle!
As mortal battles rages we'll watch
With our narrow eyes!

We will not lift a finger when the cruel Huns
Rummage the pockets of corpses,
Burn cities, drive cattle into churches,
And roast the meat of our white brothers!..

Come to your senses for the last time, old world!
Our barbaric lyre is calling you
One final time, to a joyous brotherly feast
To a brotherly feast of labor and of peace!
 
Well its not like the Huns, who clearly had a leadership different from their troop bodies. The Scythians presumably lived in the same area for at least a thousand years.
"The Scythians" is such a horrendously imprecise term that it makes it hard to tell what you're talking about. There are three possibilities:
  1. An individual political group of some kind, associated with Herodotean Skythoi
  2. An ethnic construct transcending tribal structure to encompass all groups who presumably spoke one Scythian language
  3. The subset of pastoralist groups referred to by various Greek authors as Skythoi
If you are talking about 1), then "it depends"; while individual pastoralist groups on a very small scale may have had some kind of ethnic connection with one another, virtually all of the individual groups that we see as military protagonists were not ethnically/linguistically unified, from the Sakarauka to the Issedones to other, further afield groups such as the Manju or the Mongols or the Huns. And even then, I would not be too sure about alleging ethnic ties too much. Because while individual families might have lived vaguely in the same-ish area for a very long time, individual tribes or other political groups rarely existed for any appreciable length of time, frequently breaking up and re-coalescing around different figures in different configurations.

If you are talking about 2), then of course an ethnic construct like "the Scythians" is an ethnic construct. (Although I have no idea to what it would refer.) It doesn't refer to anything particularly useful, if it refers to anything at all, of course, but it's there.

If you are talking about 3), then it is not an ethnic construct; for instance, Saka and Saurometai groups were both lumped in by Greek authors as "Skythoi", and Greek authors themselves acknowledged this. Literary pretensions after the Hellenistic period led ethnographers and historians to continue using the term "Scythians" for people who liked riding horses up to the Mongols and beyond. But you know this.
 
When he said

it makes no sense to claim someone is their descendants.

I took that to mean that he was saying that there aren't people descended from Scythians, et al. I wasn't claiming that there are recognizable successor states to these groups, but there are individuals who had them for ancestors - and those individuals may be concentrated in certain regions.
 
When he said



I took that to mean that he was saying that there aren't people descended from Scythians, et al. I wasn't claiming that there are recognizable successor states to these groups, but there are individuals who had them for ancestors - and those individuals may be concentrated in certain regions.

my post clearly doesn't say they have no descendants, but that it makes no sense to claim someone is their descendant, because - apart from genetics - they have nothing in common with them, politically, culturally etc.
 
Why "apart from genetics"? Isn't all that matters when talking about descendants?

Whatever.

If genetics was what mattered, then the only people that mattered would be the indigenous paleolithic poples. That's the vast majority of the gene pool in all populations.
 
I agree with Dachs. It sounds a lot like trying to figure out who the Keltos (Celts) were.
 
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