DMOC's DEITY Game #3 - Willem van Oranje

Yes, that's an option. However, I prefer the Liberalism - Biology slingshot myself. :goodjob: I have only pulled that off in a game once, and it was immortal, not diety, IIRC.

DMOC, I really am enjoying this thread, and I am just getting caught up. I know this isn't related to the game at hand, but can you explain to a Monarch player the attraction of taking Biology (as opposed to something like Physics) from Liberalism?
 
Biology means you get +1 food on EVERY farm. And typically, on deity, the human player has a lot of farms since a lot of deity is farms/whipping to catch up with other AI's. However, this game was a bit of an exception since I'm financial and had a nice river by my capital and Floodplain City.

Not to mention that Biology is probably more expensive than Physics (I think) and the additional food really can't hurt, as more food opens up a ton of options for you (more whips, more drafts, more viable city spots, etc.). Simply put, becuase of how common farms are, you get more growth, which is one of the best ways to advance your civilization.
 
Round 9: 1360 AD to 1600 AD [49 Turns] Hannibal and Saladin are really becoming advanced, which is probably due to the fact that they get almost all overseas trade routes.

I don´t understand this, why are they getting all overseas trade route?
 
Great read along DMOC, I enjoyed reading it even if what you've pulled off is far beyond what I could ever hope to accomplish as a Prince level player myself.

One question for you though, That's a mighty impressive stack Boudica has built up. If she did decide to war against you, is there anything you could reasonably hope to do to blunt it? Or if she declared would it pretty much be game over at that point?
 
Bah, don't be so harsh. it was quite late in here when i wrote that and somehow I was reading Alex XML values instead of Boudi ;)

Don't worry I understand. :)

I don´t understand this, why are they getting all overseas trade route?

Hannibal and Saladin are on their own island, so they will benefit from nice trade routes from all of us on the large continent.

On the other hand, the people on the large continent (me, Boudica, Peter, etc.) can "use up" all of the overseas trade routes and have to resort to less profitable mainland routes (of course those can be just as profitable too, but usually not).

Great read along DMOC, I enjoyed reading it even if what you've pulled off is far beyond what I could ever hope to accomplish as a Prince level player myself.

One question for you though, That's a mighty impressive stack Boudica has built up. If she did decide to war against you, is there anything you could reasonably hope to do to blunt it? Or if she declared would it pretty much be game over at that point?

If I was at risk of Boudica's DoW, I would have built up defenders a long time ago. However, since I got her up to pleased, there was no concern as Boudica cannot plan a war while at pleased. Plus, she was always annoyed to someone (Sitting Bull, Pete, etc.) and until I beat Tokugawa, she never bordered me via land which meant I would not be a serious land target for her.
 
Don't worry I understand. :)
Hannibal and Saladin are on their own island, so they will benefit from nice trade routes from all of us on the large continent.

On the other hand, the people on the large continent (me, Boudica, Peter, etc.) can "use up" all of the overseas trade routes and have to resort to less profitable mainland routes (of course those can be just as profitable too, but usually not).

To explain further: every city can have "only so much" trade routes, lets say four. When trade routes are determined, every city "tries to connect" with the most lucrative city, on another landmass if possible.

Lets say you have your own island with 10 coastal cities and you have 4 opponents on another big island with 20 coastal cities total. Also lets say every civ has 4:traderoute: enabled (AND you have open borders with all of them AND they are not in mercantilism).
- Your 10 coastal cities will have 40 trade routes.
- Their coastal cities will have 80 trade routes total.
- Your 40 trade routes will target the largest (most profitable) opponent cities.
- To them, your cities will always be the most profitable (you're on another landmass).
- Opponents single largest city may wery well have 4 trade routes to your 4 cities.

That means only realistically 10-15 largest opponents' (out of 20) cities will be connected to your cities. (trade route profits are based exclusively on city sizes). The other 5-10 will be left without an intercontinental trade route. If some of them are in mercantilism, it might even be that only 10 cities on their big island is connected to your island, making you and your trading partner insanely rich in the process.

In a coastal size 18 city with Customs House (under Free Market with 5:traderoute:) you can make 50-ish :commerce: per turn, per city; 60 with UN +1:traderoute:.

It's lucrative (in the long run) to settle on smaller landmasses or on coasts, even if they take away half of the workable tiles.

EDIT: Has anyone tried to make ToA and GLH in the same coastal city that had a trading partner on another island, possibly as Carthage with Cothon? :D
 
Conversely, once you have enough cities, the number of international trade routes you have can cap out. That's why it's a good idea to block the single-currency resolution after you've secured/conquered your continent and are the largest civ in the game. After all, once all the international trade routes are used up, the only ones left are ones to yourself. At that point, passing the single-currency resolution will benefit your civ ~3 commerce/city, while everyone else will get those sweet juicy 10 commerce trade routes.

It's not a total wash if it passes, as that way it'll concentrate the best trade routes onto your best cities with the best beaker/gold multipliers, a rudimentary form of city specialisation. That's one of the reasons why my favourite capitals are those at the end of a bay, as it minimises water tiles yet it benefits from trade route multipliers. Post-astronomy, with well developed populations and cottages, you're looking at ~60 commerce from tiles and ~30 commerce from international trade routes. Add on bureaucracy and oxford, and that's hell yeah.
 
Round 11 1700 AD to 1780 AD [41 Turns] - The Tale That Ends in the Light, Part II


I decide to continue to keep the world occupied in their own wars. In particular, this gives me security against Peter, since Peter can plan a war against me even at pleased. However, since he'll be at war with Saladin, I am safe from both of them for now.

Spoiler :


And, in fact, I was thinking of joining the fight, so that I could take this city away from Saladin. It's stealing my tiles.

Spoiler :


On this turn (1708 AD), I completed the Apollo Program.

  • Peter - 1475 AD
  • Boudica - 1615 AD
  • Saladin - 1640 AD
  • Bismarck - 1708 AD
  • Willem - 1708 AD

When the time was right (and spaceship parts were being produced around the empire), I fired up a Golden Age.

Spoiler :


To my delight, while I was happily building spaceship parts, Boudica kept herself busy.

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Yeah ... sorry Peter. I can't really do anything to help you. In fact, if Boudica asked me to join her in the war vs Peter, I'd gladly do so to keep her "pleased" with me.

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To no one's surprise, Boudica captured Smolensk, giving her 44 cities for the game.

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At Home, my city was frantically trying to get another Great Person (that was NOT an artist or engineer) to get another golden age right after the first one would end. I timed the end of the Golden Age with the Great Person spawn date. And as you can see my warrior is still rightfully defending my capital.

Spoiler :


Seeing the culture removed from me, I couldn't resist founding some extra cities to fill in the gap. Hey, every population point helps for score. The new cities will get their infrastructure built quickly thanks to Universal Suffrage.

Spoiler :


On the last turn of my Golden Age, Boudica's stack continued traversing through Russian territory. Looks like she doesn't need open borders with Bismarck since her army is still doing fine even with the loss of 50 troops stuck in Munich.

Spoiler :


And ... I got my Great Person. A scientist! :goodjob: Time for my last Golden Age of the game! I timed around the builds in my empire so that all the spaceship parts would be completed before this upcoming Golden Age expired. I had to shuffle around some builds for this to work. For instance, one city took 18 turns to produce Thrusters - when a stronger production city was done with its space part, I canceled the Thrusters build in the slower city and put it in the faster city. This allows me to complete the ship in the minimum amount of time possible, and gives me extra gold in hand.

Spoiler :


With Boudica dominating the war, I bribed her to peace. Out of curiosity, I continued the game past 1780 AD and Boudica went on to have 52 cities (and vassalized Peter) before the war between then concluded. Wait ... didn't they just make peace?

(Boudica went back to WHEOOHRN mode the turn after this trade. :crazyeye:)

Spoiler :


Power graph:

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Finally, in 1750 AD (turn 385), I launched my spaceship.

Spoiler :


Peter comes up to me with a demand that I absolutely have to refuse. It's kind of ironic how he's friendly with me even though I subtly caused his demise.

Spoiler :


Aw shucks, Bismarck took the city from me. I was hoping to use the small stack of modern armor I had made for something ... something ....

Spoiler :


As expected, 10 turns after their peace treaty expired, Boudica and Peter were back at war. One thing to notice - every time Boudica attacked a city, she would cause a city revolt (with spies). Looks like she actually did a smart action for once. :goodjob:

Spoiler :


Dang ... Boudica is lightning quick.

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And again ... :eek:

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Oh wait, now I know a use for my modern armor stack! :lol:

Spoiler :


Take that, Peter!

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With Novgorod under control, this was the world map in 1778 AD. You can see some of the "Useless Cities" I put there. The reason was that during one of my turns, I kept trying to reach one city, but was continually promted by 5-6 cities on what to build, so I randomly clicked the first thing there. When I finally got to the city I wanted and adjusted it accordingly, I forgot to alter the builds of the 5-6 other cities, which were all settlers. I was too lazy to reload to the last autosave so I decided to just have several extra cities.

Spoiler :



100 million people.

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And on turn 400, 1780 AD, I achieved my earliest ever space race victory on a randomly generated map! At long last, I got a pre - 1800 AD space race win. Imagine how the USA would be if we were able to do this....

Spoiler :


Willem van Oranje was, paradoxically, both anxious and relaxed for the upcoming ceremony. This was his retirement party; Willem had served as the leader of the Dutch emprie for countless centuries among his immortal life. But now he could see that, for whatever reason, his time on this planet was diminishing. He knew that it was time to cede control of his position and let a fitter, younger leader take over in the new age of the Dutch emprie. This was the space age, where the Dutch emprie would act as worldwide leaders to settle the stars. As such, Willem was, in a way, happy to be able to rest in peace without the empire's demands on him, but he was also worried on the future of the emprie he had raised largely by himself. Would his hopefully competent successor continue his successful leadership - or would the Dutch emprie decay into forgotten territory?

"Come on out here, Willem," his trusty servant told him, The servant had an unusually large grin, and it was clear that he was hiding something from Willem. "They are all waiting for you."

Willem acquiesced, and he forced himself to stride over his throne room and out on the balcony. He knew, from eavesdropping one of the servant's conversations, that a large crowd was expected to be in front of him.

With unusual aplomb, Willem stepped out into the broad balcony, standing up high in front of a crowd of Dutch people. The moment the sun's rays pierced on him, Willem heard a clap unlike any other. The noise was deafening and thunderous. All over the area, the Dutch people rejoiced, applauding harder than ever. A select few were jumping up and down like overly eager kids. There were also a significant amount of people shedding tears. This was their lifelong leader, and he was stating his farewell to them. Willem, too, was overcome with ecstasy. Never before had he had such an incredible feeling of euphoria. Only now, he came to understand the massive impact of his reign of over five thousand years. He led the Dutch empire from their first city into a massive empire with over thirty large cities and countless, countless more towns and villages. He assiduously led them through their early Dark Ages and their more recent Golden Ages. And, most of all, he created a nation that could serve as a model for others in terms of democracy, peace, technology, and happiness. All in all, at this very moment, Willem felt all the weight of his accomplishments lift off of him. He was light again, feeling like a young boy again. The experience was magnificent ....

"Willem!"

The Dutch leader was brought back to mental reality as the cry of his servant reverberated throughout his head. Willem, still standing still, saw the curtains of the balcony in front of him close. Soon, he was concealed from the public. With a sigh of relief, Willem turned around, expecting to taste his first moments of peace and quiet.

But he was mistaken. The moment he turned around, he saw, to his astonishment, a crowd of people standing in front of him. How did they get here? though Willem nervously, trying to see if he recognized those people. He could not see his servant among them. But as Willem scrutinized the people, his jaw dropped. He nearly fainted, and gripped the wall to keep him upright.

In front of him, to his utter astonishment, were fifty two people. They were all leaders of their own civilizations throughout history. Willem's eyes veered over from Mansa Musa of the Malinese empire, to Shaka of the Zulu empire, to Suryavarman II of the Khmer empire, and much, much more. He could see Boudica. He could see Peter - who was smiling despite his civilization's sorry state. And, at the very end of the line, Willem saw - and he almost fainted again - himself. Wait?!? What is this? This is ... me! Willem momentarily panicked. He was not sure if he was seeing things properly .... And in a few seconds, a massive noise filled the room. It was even louder than the one the public crowd had produced. At first, Willem was dazed, wondering if all the leaders would attack him to exact revenge.

Willem was, once again, mistaken. When he sluggishly regained his compsure, he saw applause. All in front of him, the fifty two people were giving him a standing ovation. They were clapping harder than Willem thought was possible. He could not take his eyes off of his own self, standing the furthest right of any leader. Willem - not him, but the leader clapping - was applauding harder than any of the others. He had tears in his eyes.

"What ... what is this?" asked Willem, who thought he was hallucinating and had better hitch a ride to his doctor's office.

"You have done it," a deep voice said. The applauding ceased, and all the leaders turned to look at the other Willem, who had stepped forward from his previously reclusive position.

"You have done what few have thought possible," the other Willem said, smiling at the overwhelmed leader in front of him. "You have done a magnificent job leading your civilization, so it is only reasonable that we all pay you our respects. It is my great pleasure to make a farewell ... to the greatest leader who ever existed."

"My ... my goodness ..." Willem stuttered. A weak grin appeard on his face, and his euphoria and ecstasy finally matched those of the other leaders in the throne room. He was completely speechless. In front of him, he could hear a boisterous Zara Yaqob jumping up and down and loudly announcing: "Let the party commence!"

A fitting end ... Willem thought, kneeling, with tears streaming fast down his cheeks. To a glorious, industrious, magnificient career in civilization ....
 
Great post! So great that after months (years?) of lurking I've decided to create an account just to say that.

Also -- why did you not want a Great Artist?
 
Well done! A truly fun read, pity this is your last one over here.

I feel better now that you've won since forgetting to add in those 2 civs at the start (not counting me sending over the wrong save!).
 
With Boudica dominating the war, I bribed her to peace. Out of curiosity, I continued the game past 1780 AD and Boudica went on to have 52 cities (and vassalized Peter) before the war between then concluded. Wait ... didn't they just make peace?

(Boudica went back to WHEOOHRN mode the turn after this trade. :crazyeye:)

Spoiler :



As expected, 10 turns after their peace treaty expired, Boudica and Peter were back at war.

Spoiler :

Just to note it, there's no peace treaty and mandatory 10 turns of peace after bribery, it's just a cease fire. That's why Boudica was able to enter war mode against Peter immediately and in principle she could have attacked again on the next turn!

I've had that in my games and I've seen it on the forums as well, bribing for peace isn't effective at all.
 
Congratulations on your epic win, DMOC! Now that it's all over, I wonder what would happen if you declare on Boudica just for fun:hammer2: is that the starting-warrior-turned-eternal-capitol-garrison alone at Home? :lol:

Also,
Spoiler :

why the hell does Boudica have to pose that way in her screenshots?!? I see it all the time

 
Great post! So great that after months (years?) of lurking I've decided to create an account just to say that.

Also -- why did you not want a Great Artist?

because he allready had one and you can't start an golden age with same kind of Great Persons
 
Great post! So great that after months (years?) of lurking I've decided to create an account just to say that.

Also -- why did you not want a Great Artist?

I already had a Great Artist. I had an artist and an engineer, and I needed 3 different people to start a Golden Age.

Well done! A truly fun read, pity this is your last one over here.

I feel better now that you've won since forgetting to add in those 2 civs at the start (not counting me sending over the wrong save!).

All right, you are forgiven for the earlier errors. I thought the extra land provided was both challenging and helpful. On the one hand, the AI's got more land than usual. On the other hand, I was able to grab good spots too. Looking at the replay, I'm surprirsed at how much land Boudica and Pericles got.

Just to note it, there's no peace treaty and mandatory 10 turns of peace after bribery, it's just a cease fire. That's why Boudica was able to enter war mode against Peter immediately and in principle she could have attacked again on the next turn!

I've had that in my games and I've seen it on the forums as well, bribing for peace isn't effective at all.

Really? I could have sworn I saw a 10-turn peace treaty between Boudica and Peter. If they really did ceasefire then that means Boudica messed up her game once again. She should have declared right after the ceasfire if she really wanted to win. :crazyeye:

Well done! :clap::clap::clap:

Thank you! :goodjob:

Congratulations on your epic win, DMOC! Now that it's all over, I wonder what would happen if you declare on Boudica just for fun:hammer2: is that the starting-warrior-turned-eternal-capitol-garrison alone at Home? :lol:

Also,
Spoiler :

why the hell does Boudica have to pose that way in her screenshots?!? I see it all the time


She likes you. :goodjob:

because he allready had one and you can't start an golden age with same kind of Great Persons

Correct.

------------------

By the way I found it curious that Boudica would continually cause Peter's cities to go into revolt before she attacked them. That's actually pretty smart. However, I think one time she caused a city to go into revolt the turn before she was planning on attacking. :shake:
 
Great game, congrats on the win. Mighty impressive.

Quick question thought, did you launch your spaceship with every part built? (5/5 for casing, 5/5 for thrusters, etc) or is there a better/quicker way to launch?
 
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