Egypt - Cleopatra Thread

[dexters]

Civ3 Cleo was meant to evoke the Liz Taylor Cleo. I read or heard that somewhere a long time ago. And thinking about it now, there are similarities.

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[GenyaArikado]

Honestly i believe Civ3 Cleo should have been Hapshetsut with that lool. But im not a big fan of the other 2 looks either.

CivOnline Cleo looks like Monica Bellucci

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Although Asterix & Obelix is probably the worst place to look for Cleopatra looks im rather fond of this one. Looks both greekish and egyptianish

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And while id like her to look more or less like this (with better clothes tho)

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She'll probably look either like that Liz Taylor pic or like this

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[dexters]

ROME Cleo.

I had a crush on her for a long time

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[GenyaArikado]

I did too but after looking at other pics i didnt anymore XD

 

[ehecatzin]

If they go for the hot actress look I'd rather they go with Monica Bellucci with accurate clothing.

 

[nunor]

Apparently the opinion I conveyed in my last post was not fully understood so I'll rephrase: I find those depictions abysmal, especially the last two, and I hope not to find a gratuitously sexualized Cleopatra in Civ6.

 

[Spartan_X]

Well, my opinion is that Cleopatra shouldn't look sexy, but instead she should have the refined beauty of a queen, she should look elegant. I believe the Liz Taylor look captures that look perfectly. Of course Liz was one of the ( if not -the- ) most beautiful actresses in Hollywood ever ... so that wasn't that hard to accomplish with her in the role ...

 

[GenyaArikado]

Apparently the opinion I conveyed in my last post was not fully understood so I'll rephrase: I find those depictions abysmal, especially the last two, and I hope not to find a gratuitously sexualized Cleopatra in Civ6.

No, everyone who read it got it. It just no was answering to you lol.

Anyway, i gotta feeling they will go for this. It's the most popular depiction of Cleopatra.

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[Monado]

Please, no incredibly fair skin Liz Tailor-esque Cleopatra.

Though I have zero faith in this company's art team to do anything but that, or an incredibly over sexualized Civ Rev/Online Cleopatra.

 

[nunor]

No, everyone who read it got it.

That's what I thought, until I was accused of 'spamming'.

Anyway, a model based on Liz Taylor wouldn't be too bad, I guess. But they should at least get the nose right.

 

[GenyaArikado]

Please, no incredibly fair skin Liz Tailor-esque Cleopatra.

Though I have zero faith in this company's art team to do anything but that, or an incredibly over sexualized Civ Rev/Online Cleopatra.

I was talking about the clothes. Body wise i'm expecting Theodora's sister.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I was talking about the clothes. Body wise i'm expecting Theodora's sister.

I am too.

But anyone want a new Egypt topic? War Chariot has been hinted. Can anyone think of another potential Unique Unit?

 

[Novu]

I am too.

But anyone want a new Egypt topic? War Chariot has been hinted. Can anyone think of another potential Unique Unit?

The Egyptians also invented the composite bow by laminating animal horns onto the wooden structure of normal bows.

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Excerpt from a NOVA documentary on the Egyptian bow.

Link to video.

Egyptians also tended to mix their units. Here a Spearman and a bowman would work together on a single tile.

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Going back to the topic of Cleopatra. This is look I would support:

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[ehecatzin]

I'd like to see Nubia as its own Civ, but I think its rather more likely Egypt could get Nubian Spearmen as its second UU.

 

[Verified_Confection_Being]

I'd like to see Nubia as its own Civ, but I think its rather more likely Egypt could get Nubian Spearmen as its second UU.

I think Egypt is long overdue Mamluk cavalry as a second UU tbh and it would bring Egypt out of being a purely ancient era civ. It'd be less of a stretch than Nubian spear men too, since Nubia was distinct from Egypt

 

[Novu]

I think Egypt is long overdue Mamluk cavalry as a second UU tbh and it would bring Egypt out of being a purely ancient era civ. It'd be less of a stretch than Nubian spear men too, since Nubia was distinct from Egypt

I agree with this. Mamluk cavalry would be a good choice to represent Medieval Egypt as a replacement for the mounted Knight or Lancer replacement.

Note: The Mamluks were the ones who preserved much of the history of Egypt including the records of Cleopatra's reign.

 

[poom3619]

I think Egypt is long overdue Mamluk cavalry as a second UU tbh and it would bring Egypt out of being a purely ancient era civ. It'd be less of a stretch than Nubian spear men too, since Nubia was distinct from Egypt

Hmm, I think Civ 6 is unlikely to break the common misconception that Egypt ended with Cleopatra or Persia ended by Alexander.

Saladin (who is a sultan of medieval state of Egypt) even end up being leader of "Arabia" in Civ 4, and if actual Caliph is a leader of Arabia in Civ 6. I really doubt we will see him and anything from Ayyubid-Mameluks time from Firaxis.

Anyway, i gotta feeling they will go for this. It's the most popular depiction of Cleopatra.

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Well, then. Thanks for Civ 5 mod community. We already got this Janboruta's leaderscene if anything gone "wrong".

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[Thormodr]

The Egyptians also invented the composite bow by laminating animal horns onto the wooden structure of normal bows.

Spoiler :

Excerpt from a NOVA documentary on the Egyptian bow.

Link to video.

Egyptians also tended to mix their units. Here a Spearman and a bowman would work together on a single tile.

Spoiler :

Going back to the topic of Cleopatra. This is look I would support:

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I had never heard of the Egyptians inventing the composite bow. I don't believe that jives with the historical record.

The composite bow appears to have developed in separate regions but at roughly the same time, in cultures in Mesopotamia, Anatolia, and the Eurasian Steppes. The earliest surviving examples of composite bow is western Asian angular bow that appeared during 3rd Millennium BC.

In 1992, from among the Egyptian artifacts in Tutankhamun’s Tomb, Howard Carter recovered 32 angular composite bows along with arrows, quivers, and bow cases (Knecht). These bows are an earlier form that made a shallower angle and had shallower recurve limbs. Replicas of these suggest that the angular composite bow provided Egyptian archers with a smooth accurate and high powered shot. The short length of these bows made them lightweight and maneuverable, highly suited for chariot-borne archers. (Knecht)The introduction of composite bow, stronger and more effective than the simple bow, was part of a striking change in military technology at the beginning of the Pharaonic New Kingdom. This modernization was to keep pace with the military innovations of neighboring countries and prevent any recurrence of a foreign incursion like that of the Hykso, who had possession of composites, in the second intermediate period (1650-1550bc).

http://https://legioilynx.wordpress.com/2012/04/19/composite-bows-weapon-of-ancient-nomadic-equestrian-cultures/

 

[Staler87]

If you think Cleopatra caused the collapse of Egypt your sorely mistaking. She seduced Julius Ceaser and convinced him not to annex Egypt. She was incredibly intelligent (able to speak nine languages I believe) and definitely deserving of the role as a leader in a civ game. Plus her son was technically the last Pharaoh of Egypt not her. And it is actually only a popular myth that she killed herself. Historians are unsure whether she was assassinated or did herself in.

 

[sukritact]

If you think Cleopatra caused the collapse of Egypt your sorely mistaking.

Not sure what else to call the fact that Egypt was annexed into the Roman Empire. Even if she did not cause it she was not up to the task of ensuring Egypt's continued independence.

She seduced Julius Ceaser and convinced him not to annex Egypt.

This statement just make me want Hatsheput even more; I'd rather not women in history be reduced to sex symbols. I pray Civ VI's depiction of Cleopatra be somewhat more reasonable that Civ Rev's or Civ Online's.

Plus her son was technically the last Pharaoh of Egypt not her.

That's just being impractically pedantic. Caesarion lived on for less than a month before being caught and executed by Octavian, and besides that was only 17 years old at the time. He was never a ruler in his own right (Cleopatra retained the power although they were technically co-rulers since he was 3).

She is perhaps a middling ruler who was in a very bad spot and did the best she could. I do not think she was a horrible ruler, but I do think that in either case she pales in comparison to the greater Pharaohs of the New Kingdom, and the great pyramid builders of the Old Kingdom, or Narmer: I've had a soft spot for Narmer since my mod. I'm just glad nobody went crazy and chose Tutankhamun; now that would've been an unforgivable outrage.