European Migration Crisis (off-topic discussion from Arab Spring thread)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Do you not know how to use a VPN?
Our current world would look like a dystopia to our forefathers.
Not everyone here uses or should use a VPN connection. For Millennials and GenZers it is pretty common and can seem essential. Non access to video is a common problem and asking for new links or summaries are completely appropriate. Your question is poorly worded and sounds demeaning.

Any of these would have been better:
  • Have tried using a VPN connection?
  • I use a VPN and that solved my video access problem.
  • Are VPNs viable where you live?
  • Would you like help setting up a VPN connection?

As to our current world. I think you are completely wrong. Our forefathers would see our world as astonishingly magical and amazing. I think that dress and lack of it would be the most common objection they would have. Nudity and the more general showing of lots of skin would seem bewildering and likely inappropriate. Everything else would amaze them. Of course the season of the year and the location of their visit would be important too. Drop your Boer ancestors in Beijing in 2019 or London last month or Mauripol today and the experience would be very different.
 
Was the forum always like this, or is this a recent development?

The rise of right-wing nativist parties on the continent speaks for itself.

We are much more similar culturally to you...similar language, both West Germanic cultures, our women don't wear headscarves, etc...
It's not so long ago that to be 'properly dressed ' to go outside men and women would both have head covering.
 
It's not so long ago that to be 'properly dressed ' to go outside men and women would both have head covering.

I think that was more practical/fashion than.. we local clerics will stone you to death if you don't

1665437742244.png
 
if the aim is success/better standard of living countries should generally try to accept migrants who are economically beneficial and tend to assimilate, and reject migrants who bring living standards down for current citizens.

in practice, countries do what they want and improve or decline on those choices.

Should we not aim to be better as a species, not a random collective on one bit of the map in competition with another? If everyone improves, we all improve.
 
That surprises me. One of my favorite things to do in Civ was to right historic wrongs. For example, playing the ACW scenario in Civ 5 and winning as the Confederacy,


So you support evil, when it doesn't even pretend to be anything other than evil....
 
It pretended. Sort of. Not real hard by most measures, tho.
 
Sorry, didn't realise.
Stewart Lee has Paul Nuttall of Ukip going back in history complaining about the Bulgarians, Poles, Indians and Pakistanis etc all the way back to the Beaker Folk, Neo-Lithic peoples and the first fish to leave the sea all coming here, taking our land, (and contributing to our culture).
Thanks.

Since the fish leaving the sea eventually led to our species' existence, this seems like an odd thing to complain about.

That surprises me. One of my favorite things to do in Civ was to right historic wrongs. For example, playing the ACW scenario in Civ 5 and winning as the Confederacy, playing the RFCE mod in Civ 4 and conquering and Christianizing Algeria as France, playing the SOI mod in Civ 4 and keeping Asia Minor an Orthodox Christian and Byzantine land.

Obviously we have vastly different goals in Civ. My games emphasize science and literacy and learning, and religion only comes into it for the Wonders points and to stave off civil disorder long enough to get the forms of government that eliminate it. As soon as they're no longer needed, temples, cathedrals, and arenas get sold.

When in Rome, dress as the Romans do.

In that case, if you were a woman visiting my city in the 1960s, you'd be expected to wear a kerchief when out in public. That said... there was quite a variety of forms of dress in the lands controlled by the Romans. They didn't all dress like senators and soldiers. Funny thing about scarves, though... many of the aristocratic women wore them, or at least some form of head covering.

I'm opposed to those with a cultural connotation in lands that that culture is not really a true part of. I don't care if they want to wear headscarves in their own native lands, I just don't want them to wear them in our lands.

I Googled your "native land". It doesn't appear that you would tolerate Muslims regardless of what they wear.

I'll admit that niqabs give me the creeps, but I think much of that is due to not being able to adequately read facial expressions and body language to verify if what the wearer says is congruent with what she actually thinks. So much of communication and trust depends on this.

Hijabs don't prevent this, so I don't have a problem with them unless the person wearing it is forced.

Do you not know how to use a VPN?

Considering that I have more than one tab open at any particular time and some sites I visit wouldn't work properly if a VPN were detected being used, it's just easier to ask for a summary.

Yes, there is, and headscarf-wearing Muslims praying in Europe in Arabic is not part of European culture.

Wow. "European culture" is one homogenous bloc of customs and traits extending right across the peninsula from west to east and the Arctic to the Mediterranean and even to those two little islands off the coast of Newfoundland. Everyone apparently speaks the same language and values the same things and performs the same activities in the same way. TIL.
 
It didint take that long for Uncle Paul to post Alt-Right dribble…


I think that the European diaspora should get some say in European politics.
Given your viewpoints and screeds, I don't think anyone want you to have a say in anyone's politics.
The Boer Republics will one day be back from "vacation",...

too...although they were taken from us many years ago, we will get them back someday...think of how many centuries Jews prayed to get Israel back when they were in exile, and they got it. By the same token, we will get our Boer Republics back. It was not nice to take them away.
You’re not an ethnoreligious group. Get that delusion that you on the same level as the Jews out of your mind. Your kind are just descendants of Dutch settlers who are salty that the British took over the colony from the Dutch after the Napoleonic War, took away your slaves after the British Empire abolished slavery in her realms, and lost the Second Boer War. You’re no more special than the Lost Causers who want to see the return of the CSA. Like the Confederate States of America, The Boer Republics ain’t coming back.
I'm opposed to those with a cultural connotation in lands that that culture is not really a true part of. I don't care if they want to wear headscarves in their own native lands, I just don't want them to wear them in our lands.

Yes, there is, and headscarf-wearing Muslims praying in Europe in Arabic is not part of European culture.
You do not get to dictate what Muslims can and cannot do in western civilizations. If they wish to wear headscarves on their own accord, let them. If they wish to prey, let them. As long as they are not hurting anybody, they should have the freedom to do as they please. You are no different than Ceaser of Fallout: New Vegas who's chief goal is through enforcing a nationalist, imperialist, totalitarian, homogeneous culture that obliterates the itenties of those conquered.
Multiculturalism brings living standards down for native citizens.
[citation needed]
Migration is not a human right. How about this, I want to migrate into your house. Should I ask for your permission, or should I just break in and then call you bigoted when you try to remove me?
The United Nations very much disagrees with you. Migration is a human right no matter how much you throw a tantrum about it.

The Universal Declaration of Human Rights said:
The Universal Declaration of Human Rights of 1948 asserts, in Article 13, that: (1) Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each State. (2) Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and to return to his country.

I wouldn’t want a white supremacist and a Nazi in my house anyway. You would be given the boot anyway no matter how much you cry about being the victim when you’re being problematic. This is no different when conservatives on Twitter cry about being banned when their tweets breaks TOS.
This is a myth. There was more migration to Britain any year of the 21st century than there was from 1066-1952, combined.
[citation needed]

Can you once post up a source instead of pulling out claims out of your butt?
Let's move to their lands and neighborhoods en masse and see how they like it...
I believe you already did that centuries ago when the VOC dumped you lot at the Cape of Good Hope.
UKIP is pretty good, but the BNP is better...
Well that's a dumpster fire I've not expected to see reignited.
I could just as well say you're so insistent upon "muh multicultural state with no real identity."
Once again, your white nationalist bigotry and ignorance shows no bounds. At least a multicultural state has a unique identity in contrast to your ideal white nationalist fascist state.
The longer they stay, the less likely it becomes they will return home when the war is over...
Why would they return back home when they’ve settled in with better opportunities and formed familiar bonds with the community and have gotten or are going through the process of gaining citizenship in the country they migrated to. Again, why does it matter to you if they're not hurting you. It's as if their existence on your precious "European Culture" makes you feel oppressed despite you being on the other side of the globe. It's quite amazing to see how you melt down when an Arab immigrant migrates to Europe while you're sitting in South Africa.
 
If you wanted to "migrate" into my house, I'd welcome the extra tenant to help share the rent I have to pay :D

You can posit whatever desired theory you want. Nobody is under any obligation to agree with you, or even consider it rational. From what I've read of your posts and general position, I'm certainly not going to.
Great! I can't wait to blast Steve Hofmeyr music at an eardrum-bleeding volume while you are trying to sleep. If you do not tolerate this, you are discriminating against my culture. (This is an analogy for how Islamics in Europe blast their call to prayer obnoxiously loud when Europeans are trying to sleep...can't they at least use a radio or something?)
When we take refugees we assume they're staying forever each one costs the government 80k. Up to them what they do later if they want to return home or NZ becomes new home.

We boycott you because your government was disgusting. We didn't force your government to change you can't force us to deal with you if we don't want to. Funny how that works.
Why is your government wasting money to help people who are neither your kith and kin nor your responsibilty?
Our government had flaws and was unsustainable in the long run, yes, but to call it disgusting is a bridge too far.
The British Nazi Party is utterly dead and gets no more votes than any other ultra extreme. They are barely a party, let alone respectable. They don't even contest most locations due to complete lack of support. You wouldn't be able to vote for them.
BNP = British National Party, not British Nazi Party. I'd appreciate if you didn't accuse me of being a Nazi in the future.
Not everyone here uses or should use a VPN connection. For Millennials and GenZers it is pretty common and can seem essential. Non access to video is a common problem and asking for new links or summaries are completely appropriate. Your question is poorly worded and sounds demeaning.

Any of these would have been better:
  • Have tried using a VPN connection?
  • I use a VPN and that solved my video access problem.
  • Are VPNs viable where you live?
  • Would you like help setting up a VPN connection?

As to our current world. I think you are completely wrong. Our forefathers would see our world as astonishingly magical and amazing. I think that dress and lack of it would be the most common objection they would have. Nudity and the more general showing of lots of skin would seem bewildering and likely inappropriate. Everything else would amaze them. Of course the season of the year and the location of their visit would be important too. Drop your Boer ancestors in Beijing in 2019 or London last month or Mauripol today and the experience would be very different.
Sorry if I came across as demeaning, that was not my intention.
Our forefathers would go to some beach, see all the young ladies wearing skimpy bikinis, and be horrified, thinking that they had walked into an open-air brothel.
Our forefathers would walk down the streets of London and see hidjabs and other articles of clothing, and wonder when Britain lost a war to Somalia and was conquered.
It's not so long ago that to be 'properly dressed ' to go outside men and women would both have head covering.
Hats and bonnets are not the same as a tight hidjab that completely covers all of your hair. Look at my profile photo - it's from 1883, a formal photo of a conservative Christian world leader. Notice that he is not wearing a head covering.
Should we not aim to be better as a species, not a random collective on one bit of the map in competition with another? If everyone improves, we all improve.
I don't see Europe becoming Islamicized or Bantufied as an improvement.
So you support evil, when it doesn't even pretend to be anything other than evil....
No, if George Washington had a right to break away from Britain, Robert Lee had a right to break away from the United States. Let's be consistent here.
Thanks.

Since the fish leaving the sea eventually led to our species' existence, this seems like an odd thing to complain about.
This is not a thread to debate the Darwinistic theory. Please don't drag this thread off topic with that nonsense. Thank you!
Obviously we have vastly different goals in Civ. My games emphasize science and literacy and learning, and religion only comes into it for the Wonders points and to stave off civil disorder long enough to get the forms of government that eliminate it. As soon as they're no longer needed, temples, cathedrals, and arenas get sold.
I don't know which Civ game you play. I mostly play Civ 4, also some 3 and 5.
In that case, if you were a woman visiting my city in the 1960s, you'd be expected to wear a kerchief when out in public. That said... there was quite a variety of forms of dress in the lands controlled by the Romans. They didn't all dress like senators and soldiers. Funny thing about scarves, though... many of the aristocratic women wore them, or at least some form of head covering.
Looking at photos of your leader from the 60s, Lester Pearson, and his wife, shows that women appearing without a headscarf in public was very common in the 60s.
I Googled your "native land". It doesn't appear that you would tolerate Muslims regardless of what they wear.
I would tolerate them just fine in their own homelands.
I'll admit that niqabs give me the creeps, but I think much of that is due to not being able to adequately read facial expressions and body language to verify if what the wearer says is congruent with what she actually thinks. So much of communication and trust depends on this.
So if they won't abide by your society's social contract, what right to they have to live amongst your society?
Hijabs don't prevent this, so I don't have a problem with them unless the person wearing it is forced.
They symbolize a lack of desire to assimilate. This is different from the Amerindian boarding schools, so let's not debate that again. Muslims chose to come to Canada. The least they can do is dress Canadian.
Considering that I have more than one tab open at any particular time and some sites I visit wouldn't work properly if a VPN were detected being used, it's just easier to ask for a summary.
You can turn a VPN on and then off again if it's an issue with some sites.
Wow. "European culture" is one homogenous bloc of customs and traits extending right across the peninsula from west to east and the Arctic to the Mediterranean and even to those two little islands off the coast of Newfoundland. Everyone apparently speaks the same language and values the same things and performs the same activities in the same way. TIL.
No, but all indigenous European cultures have a lot of similarities that they don't have with Islamic culture.
It didint take that long for Uncle Paul to post Alt-Right dribble…
The word you are looking for is "drivel", but you're confusing my posts with yours when you call them drivel.

Given your viewpoints and screeds, I don't think anyone want you to have a say in anyone's politics.
I would say the same of you.
...
You’re not an ethnoreligious group. Get that delusion that you on the same level as the Jews out of your mind. Your kind are just descendants of Dutch settlers who are salty that the British took over the colony from the Dutch after the Napoleonic War, took away your slaves after the British Empire abolished slavery in her realms, and lost the Second Boer War. You’re no more special than the Lost Causers who want to see the return of the CSA. Like the Confederate States of America, The Boer Republics ain’t coming back.
Yes, we are an ethnoreligious group, only a minority of our ancestry is Dutch, we have our own language and culture, our language vastly improves upon Dutch in terms of having a sensible spelling and grammar system, and it sounds better and is better for lyrics, poetry, and literature. Many Israeli Jews can see the similarity between Boers and Jews.
You do not get to dictate what Muslims can and cannot do in western civilizations. If they wish to wear headscarves on their own accord, let them. If they wish to prey, let them. As long as they are not hurting anybody, they should have the freedom to do as they please. You are no different than Ceaser of Fallout: New Vegas who's chief goal is through enforcing a nationalist, imperialist, totalitarian, homogeneous culture that obliterates the itenties of those conquered.
Europe should never have taken them in in the first place. I hope that Éric Zemmour wins in France next time.
[citation needed]

The United Nations very much disagrees with you. Migration is a human right no matter how much you throw a tantrum about it.
You have the right to leave your country, but not necessarily the right to enter any country of your choosing.
I wouldn’t want a white supremacist and a Nazi in my house anyway. You would be given the boot anyway no matter how much you cry about being the victim when you’re being problematic. This is no different when conservatives on Twitter cry about being banned when their tweets breaks TOS.

[citation needed]
OK, thanks for the feedback.
Can you once post up a source instead of pulling out claims out of your butt?
You first.
I believe you already did that centuries ago when the VOC dumped you lot at the Cape of Good Hope.
The Cape had no permanent inhabitants when we landed there. Only nomads that sometimes passed through the area.
Well that's a dumpster fire I've not expected to see reignited.
BNP = British National Party. Some other person in this thread called it the "British Nazi Party", but that is incorrect. It is not a Nazi party. It has renounced antisemitism.
Once again, your white nationalist bigotry and ignorance shows no bounds. At least a multicultural state has a unique identity in contrast to your ideal white nationalist fascist state.
A nationalist state has a unique identity based on heritage. A multicultural state has no identity other than a piece of paper called a "passport".
Why would they return back home when they’ve settled in with better opportunities and formed familiar bonds with the community and have gotten or are going through the process of gaining citizenship in the country they migrated to. Again, why does it matter to you if they're not hurting you. It's as if their existence on your precious "European Culture" makes you feel oppressed despite you being on the other side of the globe. It's quite amazing to see how you melt down when an Arab immigrant migrates to Europe while you're sitting in South Africa.
Because Europe isn't their homeland. I don't understand why refugees are even granted citizenship, it should be understood that their presence is temporary, and they should be discouraged from putting down roots.
 
No, if George Washington had a right to break away from Britain, Robert Lee had a right to break away from the United States. Let's be consistent here.


So you pretend that it is not different?

The American Revolution happened after all available attempts at a peaceful resolution of grievances had been rejected. The American Civil War happened before any available attempts at a peaceful resolution had been attempted. The American Revolution happened because basic liberties were being denied to those who then revolted. The American Civil War happened because those who would deny basic human rights to most of their population could not stand to see even the possibility of those people becoming free. The American Revolution happened to further liberty and humanity. The American Civil War happened to prevent it.
 
So you pretend that it is not different?

The American Revolution happened after all available attempts at a peaceful resolution of grievances had been rejected. The American Civil War happened before any available attempts at a peaceful resolution had been attempted. The American Revolution happened because basic liberties were being denied to those who then revolted. The American Civil War happened because those who would deny basic human rights to most of their population could not stand to see even the possibility of those people becoming free. The American Revolution happened to further liberty and humanity. The American Civil War happened to prevent it.

Because we signed agreements to agree to take refugees/right thing to do.

The money spent is chump change in the grand scheme of things.
 
BNP = British National Party, not British Nazi Party.

I'd appreciate if you didn't accuse me of being a Nazi in the future.
No guaranties. You've already posted your horrid views on this forum. You don't like being called a Nazi, then stop acting like one (Though I highly doubt this will happen). But since you continue to post these alt-right demagoguery, don't be surprised people call you a Nazi.

For the record, @Aiken_Drumn did not call you a Nazi. If you actually read his post you'd see he was describing the BNP and it's infamy of it's topic on this forum back when it was debated about years ago (Hense why I called it a dumpster fire). He wasn't calling you a Nazi. This is the same problem you have when I called your posts white supremacists talking points and took it as me calling you a white supremacist.

At this point, the mask has already flown off your face and people on this forum have already made their judgement based on the views you've posted. And any benifit of the doubt are washed away.
I don't see Europe becoming Islamicized or Bantufied as an improvement.
I don't see Europe scumming to fascism as an improvement.
No, if George Washington had a right to break away from Britain, Robert Lee had a right to break away from the United States. Let's be consistent here.
:lol:

You do realize the Confederate States of America lost right? Besides Cutlass has already have that covered so I won't bother you lecturing on the nuances of American History.
No, but all indigenous European cultures have a lot of similarities that they don't have with Islamic culture.
And How much of European cultures are you aware of? From what I can tell, your presumption of European culture is one big monolithic culture that should be pure.
The word you are looking for is "drivel", but you're confusing my posts with yours when you call them drivel.
LOL, I'm sorry but who's the one posting alt-right Nazi crap? Look yourself in the mirror before you call other people's post "drivel".
Now was that too hard to admit that you're an alt-right white supremacist and white nationalist demagogue?
I would say the same of you.
No, I want to have a say because I don't want authoritarian bigoted fascists like yourself to ever gain power. If you ever set up an white ethnostate in South Africa, I will send my voice to my senator and representatives to push forward a policy to set up sanctions on your Nationalist Afrikaans nation and back the South African government to push back a secessionist state. We've done it before with South Africa after the fall of the USSR when they became an international embarrassment of apartheid and we'll most certainly do it again with your Nationalist Afrikaans nation.
Yes, we are an ethnoreligious group, only a minority of our ancestry is Dutch, we have our own language and culture, our language vastly improves upon Dutch in terms of having a sensible spelling and grammar system, and it sounds better and is better for lyrics, poetry, and literature. Many Israeli Jews can see the similarity between Boers and Jews.
Oh bullfeathers. You just want that sweet sweet victim status. Again, no, you are not an ethnoreligous group no matter how much you stomp your feet on the ground like a two year old. Having a branch derivative of Calvinism does not grant you the same status as Jews, the Amish, nor the Mennonites. Your language is a dialect of Dutch, no different the Quebecois French, Japanese Kansai dialect, Southern American English, &e. You're perhaps the only Afrikaner that I know that ever holds this delusion. You only have the tribalist notion of Afrikaans Nationalism, that is it. Your Afrikaans Nationalist movement are no more special than old racists hicks in the deep south longing for the rise of the Confederate States of America. I've done a deep dive on your claims and there are no claims that Afrikaans are an ethnoreligious group. Even the Wikipedia article that you love to source from states that Afrikaners are a South African ethnic group descended from Dutch settlers and I highly doubt anyone here would entertain your delusional claim.

You have the right to leave your country, but not necessarily the right to enter any country of your choosing.
The United Nations disagrees with your view point. The United Nation's Universal Declaration of Human Rights does not care about your feelings.
You first.
I'm not the one entering in a nice cafe puking out alt-right drivel and taking a dump in the middle of the floor. The burden of proof is on you. Since you refuse to proved sources for claims, I'm just going to presume you're just parroting talking points from an alt-right demagogue or that you're an alt-right demagogue yourself.
A nationalist state has a unique identity based on heritage.
As was Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, The Japanese Showa Statist Military Dictatorship, and Francoist Spain.
A multicultural state has no identity other than a piece of paper called a "passport".
There are a ton of Americans and Canadians, just to list a few, that will very very much disagree with you with that claim. You only see it as having "no identity" because you loathe the idea of people of other cultures and ethnicities co-existing with one another in harmony. You only see the idea of multiculturalism as a degenerate concept that keeps you up at night.
I would tolerate them just fine in their own homelands.

Europe should never have taken them in in the first place. I hope that Éric Zemmour wins in France next time.

Because Europe isn't their homeland. I don't understand why refugees are even granted citizenship, it should be understood that their presence is temporary, and they should be discouraged from putting down roots.

They symbolize a lack of desire to assimilate. This is different from the Amerindian boarding schools, so let's not debate that again. Muslims chose to come to Canada. The least they can do is dress Canadian.
Again, your idea of assimilate is to annihilate one's individual culture and identity. As I said before, Muslims have the freedom to dress as they wish. You on the other hand would restrict a Muslim's freedom to dress the way they want to. They only symbolize a lack of desire to assimilate, to you because you see them as foreigners with a degenerate culture and that you want to take away their freedom of expression. What you are essentially telling these migrants is "conform or else".

It does not matter if Europe (or any part of the world) is not their homeland. What matters is that they fled away from a terrible situation to find a better life in an environment that's more stable. You keep crying "why isint anyone thinking of the Boers!?", yet willing to let migrants and refugees suffer at the hands of fate in a situation not favorable to them shows how much lack of empathy you have for people outside of your group (In this case, a small white supremacist group). You want a humanitarian hand to be extended to you and the Boers while at the same breath don't want to extend that same humanitarian hand to immigrants and refugees and yet sitting on your butt while hosting a pity party and exclaiming "oh woe is me" as you exclaim bigoted remarks towards people of other races, cultures, ethnicities, gender, and sex. But I guess you'd be one of those xenophonic white supremacists that would turn away Vietnamese boat people fleeing Communist Vietnam in the 1970s since they would disrupt the purity of your country's demographics.

You made the statement, "Europe should never have taken them in the first place", where the hell are they suppose to go? If you say "lol, they can just stay in their homeland" just shows how much lack of empathy you have towards people whom aren't white nationalist Boers.
 
The United Nations disagrees with your view point. The United Nation's Universal Declaration of Human Rights does not care about your feelings.
Let's be honest, the only body with any power in the United Nations, the Security Council, doesn't care about the UN Declaration of Human Rights unless they can use a copy to hit someone with for political points.
 
This is a myth. There was more migration to Britain any year of the 21st century than there was from 1066-1952, combined.

It is not a myth that modern Britain is the result of migration down the centuries.
It is true that more people migrate nowadays than in past eras. 2 reasons for that. Modern transport, its a lot more connected world. There are a lot more people in the world now.

As for your specific claim any evidence? How does the number of people migrating compare to the total population in the different eras?
 
Why is your government wasting money to help people who are neither your kith and kin nor your responsibilty?
So if a natural disaster or epidemic happened to your people that was too complex or devastating to handle yourselves, you wouldn't ask other countries for assistance, and if help was offered, you'd stick your collective noses in the air and tell the countries that offered to get lost?

Okay, works for me. Canada has been reasonably generous with helping various nations in Africa with various problems, but there are some lines we don't cross.

Our government had flaws and was unsustainable in the long run, yes, but to call it disgusting is a bridge too far.
No, "disgusting" was exactly the right word.

Sorry if I came across as demeaning, that was not my intention.
Sincere apologies do not contain the word "if." Of course it was intended to be demeaning. That's been your tone with me over the course of however many threads in which we've interacted.

This is not a thread to debate the Darwinistic theory. Please don't drag this thread off topic with that nonsense. Thank you!
Funny, I don't see a moderator badge under your name. AmazonQueen brought up the fish leaving the ocean, not me. I'm just commenting on her point by using a fact that is known to anyone who understands the basics of the Theory of Evolution (theory in the scientific sense, not in the "wild notion" sense).

I don't know which Civ game you play. I mostly play Civ 4, also some 3 and 5.
I play Civ II: Test of Time.

Looking at photos of your leader from the 60s, Lester Pearson, and his wife, shows that women appearing without a headscarf in public was very common in the 60s.
When you looked at his photos, did you happen to notice that he and his wife did not live in Central Alberta?

So if they won't abide by your society's social contract, what right to they have to live amongst your society?
This is actually funny. Back in 2015, a Muslim woman insisted on wearing a niqab to take her citizenship oath. The government at that time was headed by Stephen Harper, and the Minister of Immigration was Jason Kenney (our recently-booted premier of Alberta). Kenney stamped his feet and said no, she could not wear a niqab, as he said that anyone wanting to be a Canadian citizen must show their face while taking the oath.

The woman eventually decided to sue the government for violating her Charter rights. Time was of the essence, as Harper had called an election, but timed it so the writ period would be a grueling 78 days, rather than the usual 35-40 days. This came back to bite both Harper and Kenney, as it gave the woman time to get her case heard in court and the ABC movement to gain traction (Anybody But Conservatives).

In the meantime, the NDP leader, Tom Mulcair, was getting into a bit of a bind over this. His view was that of course her Charter rights had to be respected. However, the riding he represented, and the ridings that many members of his caucus represented were in Quebec - which has become more and more secular over the years when it comes to mixing religious symbolism with government and the courts.

Enough people in Quebec were pissed off at Mulcair for supporting a Muslim woman wanting to wear a niqab at her citizenship ceremony that they decided to vote Liberal, as a protest. The outcome on election night was a majority win for the Liberals, and Stephen Harper resigned his party's leadership.

Oh, and the niqab part of this? The courts said the woman could wear it for her citizenship oath. She got her citizenship in time to vote in the election.

Funny how right-wing intolerance meets up with karma sometimes... This woman indirectly saved us from a continuation of the Dark Decade.

They symbolize a lack of desire to assimilate. This is different from the Amerindian boarding schools, so let's not debate that again. Muslims chose to come to Canada. The least they can do is dress Canadian.
You just don't get it. "Dressing Canadian" means wearing whatever you want to wear, as long as it doesn't violate any laws or is egregiously disrespectful.

I have to ask: What does "dressing Canadian" mean to you? I wonder what you think a "real Canadian" wears.

You can turn a VPN on and then off again if it's an issue with some sites.
I'll keep that in mind, but I've had arguments with some site administrators who lambasted me just for having one on my computer, regardless of whether or not I was actually using it.

No, but all indigenous European cultures have a lot of similarities that they don't have with Islamic culture.
By this point, what are "indigenous European cultures"? They've been on the move for millennia.

A nationalist state has a unique identity based on heritage. A multicultural state has no identity other than a piece of paper called a "passport".
If you hang out much in the Civ forums upstairs, then you might have come across various arguments over whether or not Canada has a culture. We do, but there are lots of non-Canadians who stick their noses in the air and say we don't.

I don't have a passport. I've never needed one, since the border with the U.S. was very easy to cross back in the '70s and '80s (my last trip was in 1987).

Because Europe isn't their homeland. I don't understand why refugees are even granted citizenship, it should be understood that their presence is temporary, and they should be discouraged from putting down roots.
Many refugees decide they like Canada and opt to stay and begin the process to become a citizen. This is fine if they plan to stay. It's not fine if they plan to get it and then scamper back to the place they escaped from.

There's a term for people who do that: Canadians of Convenience. They're not well-thought of.
 
So if a natural disaster or epidemic happened to your people that was too complex or devastating to handle yourselves, you wouldn't ask other countries for assistance, and if help was offered, you'd stick your collective noses in the air and tell the countries that offered to get lost?

Okay, works for me. Canada has been reasonably generous with helping various nations in Africa with various problems, but there are some lines we don't cross.


No, "disgusting" was exactly the right word.


Sincere apologies do not contain the word "if." Of course it was intended to be demeaning. That's been your tone with me over the course of however many threads in which we've interacted.


Funny, I don't see a moderator badge under your name. AmazonQueen brought up the fish leaving the ocean, not me. I'm just commenting on her point by using a fact that is known to anyone who understands the basics of the Theory of Evolution (theory in the scientific sense, not in the "wild notion" sense).


I play Civ II: Test of Time.


When you looked at his photos, did you happen to notice that he and his wife did not live in Central Alberta?


This is actually funny. Back in 2015, a Muslim woman insisted on wearing a niqab to take her citizenship oath. The government at that time was headed by Stephen Harper, and the Minister of Immigration was Jason Kenney (our recently-booted premier of Alberta). Kenney stamped his feet and said no, she could not wear a niqab, as he said that anyone wanting to be a Canadian citizen must show their face while taking the oath.

The woman eventually decided to sue the government for violating her Charter rights. Time was of the essence, as Harper had called an election, but timed it so the writ period would be a grueling 78 days, rather than the usual 35-40 days. This came back to bite both Harper and Kenney, as it gave the woman time to get her case heard in court and the ABC movement to gain traction (Anybody But Conservatives).

In the meantime, the NDP leader, Tom Mulcair, was getting into a bit of a bind over this. His view was that of course her Charter rights had to be respected. However, the riding he represented, and the ridings that many members of his caucus represented were in Quebec - which has become more and more secular over the years when it comes to mixing religious symbolism with government and the courts.

Enough people in Quebec were pissed off at Mulcair for supporting a Muslim woman wanting to wear a niqab at her citizenship ceremony that they decided to vote Liberal, as a protest. The outcome on election night was a majority win for the Liberals, and Stephen Harper resigned his party's leadership.

Oh, and the niqab part of this? The courts said the woman could wear it for her citizenship oath. She got her citizenship in time to vote in the election.

Funny how right-wing intolerance meets up with karma sometimes... This woman indirectly saved us from a continuation of the Dark Decade.


You just don't get it. "Dressing Canadian" means wearing whatever you want to wear, as long as it doesn't violate any laws or is egregiously disrespectful.

I have to ask: What does "dressing Canadian" mean to you? I wonder what you think a "real Canadian" wears.


I'll keep that in mind, but I've had arguments with some site administrators who lambasted me just for having one on my computer, regardless of whether or not I was actually using it.


By this point, what are "indigenous European cultures"? They've been on the move for millennia.


If you hang out much in the Civ forums upstairs, then you might have come across various arguments over whether or not Canada has a culture. We do, but there are lots of non-Canadians who stick their noses in the air and say we don't.

I don't have a passport. I've never needed one, since the border with the U.S. was very easy to cross back in the '70s and '80s (my last trip was in 1987).


Many refugees decide they like Canada and opt to stay and begin the process to become a citizen. This is fine if they plan to stay. It's not fine if they plan to get it and then scamper back to the place they escaped from.

There's a term for people who do that: Canadians of Convenience. They're not well-thought of.

I thought disgusting was Canadian politeness in terms of apartheid era SA.
 
I thought disgusting was Canadian politeness in terms of apartheid era SA.
GenMarshall used the word to describe South Africa's government.
 
Great! I can't wait to blast Steve Hofmeyr music at an eardrum-bleeding volume while you are trying to sleep. If you do not tolerate this, you are discriminating against my culture.
Your "culture" specifically requires "eardrum-bleeding" volumes? Do you have functioning ears? As I'd assume you do this now, presently. You must be blasting that music that loud every day, right? How is your hearing holding up?

And besides, you'd get community complaints. Same as anyone who tried something like that would.
(This is an analogy for how Islamics in Europe blast their call to prayer obnoxiously loud when Europeans are trying to sleep...can't they at least use a radio or something?)
Religion is a separate thing to whatever you mean by "culture", but for sure, no Muslims are deafening people with anything. This is quite an uneducated stereotype you're peddling here :D
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom