Fall Further 0.51 Balance Discussion Thread

[WarKirby]

I might be able to adjust things so that if it has no units who are flagged for defense it is willing to flag ANY unit for that purpose who has a combat strength, and if it has none for exploration the same (only if already defended). But I'm not sure that section of the code is easily manipulated in such a simplistic manner.

Instead of just for defence, would it be possible to flag a unit as "inadequate defence", so that it will do defensive duty, but the AI will see that it's not fit for that job (ie, a scout), and will make replacing it with something better a top priority.

 

[far_wanderer]

Scouting promotions line for GC seems strange. GC cannot get faster than two movement, while most scouts will pick mobility, and even more get one more movement point from Scouting II.

Possible solution would be to make scouting promotions give GC additional movement or allow GC access Mobility. Otherwise having scouting promotions doesn't make much sense because GC can't follow the recon units fast enough.

This was my thought when I saw the scouting command promotions as well. On a related note, Commanders can't be Hasted either.

 

[WarKirby]

oh, and scion commanders don't get hauntstalk in haunted lands.

Such are the myriad problems of adding a new unitcombat.

 

[far_wanderer]

Xienwolf: back on the subject of a civilopedia upgrade, one MAJOR thing that is lacking is a display of the damage limit for ranged units.

 

[xienwolf]

That would be of some considerable use. Do you think it would look good placed next to their strength? ie - 6 (90%)

Obviously if ranged it would be the ranged symbol, but I would also set it up for the melee. Hrm.. actually it would be easier to do as: 6 (90%) come to think of it.

 

[far_wanderer]

That would be of some considerable use. Do you think it would look good placed next to their strength? ie - 6 (90%)

Obviously if ranged it would be the ranged symbol, but I would also set it up for the melee. Hrm.. actually it would be easier to do as: 6 (90%) come to think of it.

That sounds far better than what I had been thinking of, which was just to add it into the box with all of the other info in it. Putting it right next to the strength icon like that would be easy to see and (hopefully) intuitive to figure out as well.

 

[Andvare]

Holy Malakim nerf Batman!

Seriously, they weren't quite balanced, but now it's back to the ol' days were Malakim don't really benefit from deserts. Plains are always better (except for next to rivers, them floodplains are good). No more massive terraforming, which I find a bit sad, as that was one of the fun things with Malakim.

 

[Lemminkäinen]

The random event that gives you a Great Prophet for fifty gold is insane. Seriously. I got three Great Prophets in my last game before I had researched Ashen Veil and I was almost beelining it (got Mining and Writing as extra) as the Infernals who have crazy tech rate.

Another thing is that the Austrin expedition is far quicker to make than Settlers after some point in the game. As it is far better than making Settlers, perhaps that should be looked at.

 

[Monkeyfinger]

Yeah the Malakim should really get the final stage of the bedouin sit back. Right now, they're worse than plains cottages, take longer to build, and cost money to build.

If they were viable again, it might once again become worth it to make a 3x3 square of desert with an oasis in the middle.

 

[Breez]

The random event that gives you a Great Prophet for fifty gold is insane. Seriously. I got three Great Prophets in my last game before I had researched Ashen Veil and I was almost beelining it (got Mining and Writing as extra) as the Infernals who have crazy tech rate.

That is not typical. You hit that one in a thousand game.

 

[Lemminkäinen]

That is not typical. You hit that one in a thousand game.

True that, but a Great Prophet for fifty gold is still completely insane. Who in their right mind wouldn't take it?

 

[Iceciro]

Someone who didn't put any effort into maintaining a treasury balance.

I could see the cost escalating as the game goes longer, though. 50 gold is a lot more at turn 25 than turn 250.

 

[Lemminkäinen]

Someone who didn't put any effort into maintaining a treasury balance.

Still, if you have the 50g you are going to buy the Prophet. Doesn't seem like a fair price if it is a complete no-brainer.

I could see the cost escalating as the game goes longer, though. 50 gold is a lot more at turn 25 than turn 250.

That would be a very welcome addition! OTOH a settled Great Person is far more beneficial in the beginning stages so the Prophet is a very, very powerful thing to get on turn 25.

 

[far_wanderer]

Why is there a single option that produces either blighted forests or Daikonos? Why not make a separate option for each?

 

[WarKirby]

Still, if you have the 50g you are going to buy the Prophet. Doesn't seem like a fair price if it is a complete no-brainer.

The point is HAVING that 50 gold. The event happens at a stage of the game where your income is zero (jotnar aside) unless you lower your science slider. There is the tradeoff, and why it's not a no-brainer.

 

[Lemminkäinen]

The point is HAVING that 50 gold. The event happens at a stage of the game where your income is zero (jotnar aside) unless you lower your science slider. There is the tradeoff, and why it's not a no-brainer.

Well I usually have some money from huts/dungeons/random events. Honestly, I have the 50g in 90% of the cases when I get that event.

 

[readercolin]

On the note of commanders. Right now I find them fairly useless. It seems the only way to level them up even somewhat quickly is to take, spam warriors, and throw them at the enemy until some of them finally win. Then you get another GC before your first even gets 2-3 levels. The whole processes is annoying and repetative. The only one that this isn't the case is the bannor, and even then its a bit... meh.

Overall, I see the GC system as having a lot of potential, but at the moment I don't like how they are implemented. I'll see about changing them once I get my amurite enhancement working.

-Colin

 

[2Hydroclopse]

Not knowing the statistics and data for fall further is an obstacle for making balance calls; but, I think peaks are to dangerous/underpowered.

Not only do peaks waste a square of your workable cross, but they also have a decent chance of making a volcano.

The occasion that prompts me to post this would be when I had built a city with two peaks in it's workable cross. Within 50 turns or so, both of the peaks turned into volcanoes, they were the non-damaging versions, but the increased chance of damage was a bit upsetting.

Perhaps if there were a practical event. For instance: "Dwarfs have infested one of your mountains! +1 commerce +1 hammer" or something.

 

[UNIT 666]

Not knowing the statistics and data for fall further is an obstacle for making balance calls; but, I think peaks are to dangerous/underpowered.

Not only do peaks waste a square of your workable cross, but they also have a decent chance of making a volcano.

The occasion that prompts me to post this would be when I had built a city with two peaks in it's workable cross. Within 50 turns or so, both of the peaks turned into volcanoes, they were the non-damaging versions, but the increased chance of damage was a bit upsetting.

Perhaps if there were a practical event. For instance: "Dwarfs have infested one of your mountains! +1 commerce +1 hammer" or something.

Volcanoes are something other than cosmetic?

But, with peaks, you trade off a workable plot for UNPARALLELED PROTECTION. The Orbis 'Expert Miner' Trait (gives yields to peaks) was a nice addition, though. So was mushroom mines. For your yield wants, though, acquire specialists for the city.

On the note of commanders. Right now I find them fairly useless.

I beg to differ.

 

[2Hydroclopse]

Hm, I know in FFH2 volcanoes[started off as normal peaks and] occasionally damaged your city or blew up nearby improvements, its possible that is not the case in FF. (Drat my unknowledge.)