GR12 - AWM vs 30 civs, Pangea

1600AD:
13th kills a knight and a pike at Incensify and 12th kills knight and captures the place. (3-0).

Put clowns back to work. Kultepe switch from CH to a market as it had only 3 happy faces.

I see someone has given our contact to China, so I declare.

3rd kills musket (4-0).
2nd kills Greek K (5-0) and Korea one (6-0). 3 cavs kill Korean K all yellows or reds (9-0).
6th kills one also (10-0). 6th kills Az sword and MDI (12-0).
5/5 cav kills Mongol pike, 5th kills 2 (15-0).
19th kill Mongol MDI (16-0). Cav kill Mongol MDI (17-0).
17th kills 2 Mongol MDI (19-0). Cav kills Mongol musket (20-0).
Cav kills Port horse (21-0).
20th kills German K and EW, it only has 2 units. (23-0)
21st kills a Swiss Merc (24-0).
16th kills dutch K, kills Egyptian sword (26-0).
14th kill Greek K and Dutch LB (28-0).
7th kills 2 knights (30-0).
22nd kills AZ MDI (31-0), kills 2 Korean pikes (33-0).
4th kills 2 Korean MDI (35-0).
3rd kills EW (36-0)
19th kills 2 Mongol MDI (38-0)
21st kills swiss (39-0)
16th kills Egytian sword (40-0) [84-2]
15th kills Inca scout and Sumerian K (42-0) [86-2]

IBT:
lots of movement now.

1605AD:
3rd kills EW (1-0)
2nd kills 2 Az units (3-0). Cav kills Az swords goes wlite (4-0).
9th kills 3 Swiss (7-0).
11th kills 3 Egyptian mdi (10-0).
10th kills 2 Swiss and LB (12-0)
Cav1 kills dutch lb (13-0). Cav kills dutch LB (14-0).
16th kills 2 more LB (16-0).
18th kill 2 Iroq knights, LB and a pike (20-0).
5th kills Iroq LB (21-0)
Cav kills Korean K, cav kills another K (23-0).
14th kills Roman MDI and a Az mdi (25-0).
7th kills Az pike, Korean Knight (27-0).
6th 2 Korean crusaders and a pike (30-0).
22nd kills 3 Jorean pikes (33-0).
cav kills pike and another cav kills crusader (35-0).
12th kills 2 sumerian K (37-0)
cav kills Port pike (38-0). [124-2]

IBT:
Egyptian K attacks Iron Creek and retreats. The ibt changed on this turn and I am not sure why. Germany and Egypt and Summeria had some units in the roads that the Inca used to get next to New Hattusas originally. So they had to turn back and we now have mostly German units around that town, but a much smaller number. One is a settler combo, must be heading for the salt patch. I had considered dropping a town there just to up our count.

I am guessing the fact that I now did not have contact with Persia and hence a war, some of the civs ended up not being at war with someone and could send units our way, that blocked the Inca. I am now seeing a lot more Egyptian unts near Iron Creek.

I also had a few more combats with Iroqs than before so a few more kills and who knows what impact.

1610AD:
cav kills Port LB (1-0)
Found New Hattusha.
2nd kills Korean cav and is disband to a cav. (2-0)
2nd Cav formed and one unit moved into it a Babylon.
cav kills korean mdi (3-0).
3 more cavs each kill korean mdi (6-0).
All added to 2nd and it kills a pike (7-0).
4/5 cav kills redlined korean K (8-0).
14th kills Az pike and captures settler (9-0).
7th kills Az sword and Greek K 11-0).
2nd kills korean pike and mdi (13-0).
4th kills korean pike (14-0).
cav redlines, but kills dutch LB (15-0).
9th kills Swiss (16-0).
11th kills 2 egyptian pike (18-0).
10th kills egyptian K (19-0).
5/5 K kills rdline Iroq K (20-0)
5th kills one also (21-0)
cav kills Port redlined pike (22-0)
18th kils one too (23-0), kils spear and LB as well (25-0).
13th kills redline German pike and captures settler (26-0).
it kills 2 redline german K (28-0). [152-2]

Note:
20th is still not full.
1st is forted, but you won't miss it as 4 workers will pop up.
8th in Lake Tahoe not used, could kill redline Sumerian K, I was afraid to leave the place with a lone pike.

Troops around New Harran and Iron Creek. If they do not attack Harran, things should be ok as Iron has plenty to defend now.

Workers are just being kept busy and out of the way right now.

Oh I forgot to go around and reset beakerheads, if any could be to taxmen. Also I think we could sell off some barracks that were hand make.
 
The more I thought about the replay the more I felt the alterations had nothing to do with the contacts and everything to do with the log I had.

I thought it was pretty detailed, until I I tried to follow it. I then saw several omitions and errors. A few times I came to a combat and it did not list the civ that was attacked. Som of them it was easy to figure out and others I was not sure off. It would say something like killed a pike, but whose and where?

I also had two entries for the 6th army, where it would have been killing 4or 5 or 6 units, so that was wrong. I did not see that until I came to the second entry and the 6th had used all its moves.

So I am pretty sure I used the 6th out of order and maybe against different units.

Anyway the big thing was that in the South Fort I ended up with an army on the opposit side of town than the first pass. The lead to units moving differently up there and that is why I saw the settler combo.

Well it could have been it was visible, but I failed to notice the first time. So that lead to extra combats.

Where the Iroq were, I now realize I must have returned one of the cav armies to town the first time. As in the second I ended up next to a wound MDI and this time I killed it and the one next to it.

Now I finsihed the turn with two armies out of town and that caused lots of units to appear in a different pattern. So I think I ended up with more kills there as well.

I miss clicked the returning Mace army and it took a different path home. That meant it never got back in time to free other units where the Dutch and Egyptians were coming.

Now that lead to an army being outside of town and both civs units turn back toward Iron Creek this time.

I am not sure what impact any of this may of had on the New Harran area, but one egyptian unit end up moving onto the tile that the Inca use to get next to New Hatt... They were now forced to turn back and we have soem Germans and Summerians instead.

All in all it is pretty hard to redo 3 turns with so much movement and fighting and I ended up with some units not being exactly where they were and I had more fights in that area as well.

Again I am sorry I messed up and should have double checked the rules, I hope it has not damaged the game for anyone. The minutia will have been altered, but in the end the experience should be pretty much the same. :sad:
 
ThERat said:
I was the one planting those 3 cities in the north. During my turns, we could easily hold those cities and advance. I didn't know there would be more units turning up. I had hoped we can raze cities there to create a buffer.

Let me be sure to make it clear that nothing I have said was intended to reflect anything negative about anyone's play. I have the utmost respect for everyones game.

So if any thoughtless remark could be construed as a slight, be confident that it was not meant that way.

Also for Mark, I had no problem with your turns or my situation. In this game every set is going to be hard with lots of pressure, mine no worse than others and my setups no better. We are only making 1 or 2 units per turn and face at least 15 civs.

I feel badly about what I have to turn over as I know it will be loaded with hard choices.

My perspective on the choke is just that, mine. It could be all wrong and I can see some big advantages to breaking out.

I just figure that we cannot get into much trouble if we hold the choke till we either get 2 more cav armies up there or get rails. That cost us letting the AI have more towns, but it prevents any break throughs. It also lets us send nearly all the units to the east where we have a long front and lots of land that could be used to shorten the front.

We now have 4 hot spots, instead of 6 and that is what I was looking to get. I am not sure anyone can know what exactly to expect in a game like this as few have played one on pangea of 250x250 with max civs.

You guys come close as I know you did a contients one, so I would defer to your experience. Anyway I just tend to put out my idea and I am happy to be corrected. How else can I learn, unless I speak up and get shot down or get concurrence?
 
Even better kill ratio. :goodjob:

Fully to duplicate such complex turns would be impossible, so don't worry about it. What you did is fine.

I've got it.
 
About creating that buffer up NorthWest, I think we could use a bit of culture to push up the borders of the backyard towns. These hills are roaded so they're wicked places to fight on, since the AI gets speed and def bonuses, but if we can trail them to our in-borders plains, we'd get a neat advantage.
 
Looks good to me. The number of units the AI is sending varies. I suspect we can start advancing fairly soon. We are just too big not to.

vmxa - Just played
NP - Up
Beorn - On Deck

Then it is back to our standard roster.

Roster:
Greebley
ThERat
Northern Pike
Beorn-eL-Feared
markh
Vxma
 
vmxa said:
So if any thoughtless remark could be construed as a slight, be confident that it was not meant that way.

Also for Mark, I had no problem with your turns or my situation. In this game every set is going to be hard with lots of pressure, mine no worse than others and my setups no better. We are only making 1 or 2 units per turn and face at least 15 civs.

No problem for me. Criticism is always welcome. Only by that I can learn more.

I am quite astonished that the city limit is still not reached at this stage of the game. IIRC we had this much earlier in our previous game.
 
I was thinking the same thing and had expect to see if come up soon. The fact that frigates must be close at hand may warrent our getting a work crew back along the path that the other ships have use. Maybe one on the south side as well.

The core cities cannot afford to have tiles cut for long as they are without extra tiles in many cases. Maybe a couple of cavs could be used to shadow firgates in an attempt to absorb any bombardment.

I do not know how many they will be massing on us as I tend to see this mostly in Sid games and then it is often stacks 4 to 7. Even a few could be painful if they elect to not bombard the towns.

Greebly I think you are correct, their are a number of settlers in the east and some opportunities to expand should come up soon.
 
I finished playing more than twenty-four hours ago, but for reasons known only to my ISP I haven't been able to get online until now. :mad: Anyway:

1610 (0): I see at least six gaps well within our own lines where we should have cities. I'll try to fill them in this round.

Beorn is right that a cultural expansion would help in the northwest. I switch South Fort to a library, which completes immediately, since we'd rushed a cav there.

I use armies with some movement left to start hammering the big Dutch stack. We defeat two Swiss and five LB (7-0).

In the southeast we account for an NM and an Ir pikeman (9-0).

In the NW we pick off a French knight (10-0).

A Dutch cav appears out of nowhere to cut down one of our cav (10-1).

Astronomy --> Physics, due in eight turns at 70% and a modest surplus.


1615 (1): After a fifteen-minute interturn:

We found the fill-in towns of Milan and Vinho Verde.

In the NW we set up a funnel of death, so that enemy units will only be able to advance through the ZOC of our armies in South Fort. We destroy sixteen enemy units (9 Ko, 2 Fr, 2 Ro, and 3 Gk; 26-1).

We found Lewisville, pushing our borders forward in the eastern hills.

We raze Mayan Cuello, held by two spearmen and a JT (29-1).

In the eastern hills we crush one Mayan and five Ir units (35-1).

In the central grasslands we eliminate one Inca, one German, and six Dutch units. We lose a cav attacking a redlined knight (43-2).


1620 (2): We found the fill-in towns of Lebanon, Martinsville, and Carmel.

In the NW we smite eight enemy units (1 Eng, 2 Ko, and 5 Gk; 51-2), and capture a settler.

We can see twenty-three Inca AC--115 turns' worth. Is this their first war, for ___'s sake?

On the central front we strike down 16 enemy units (8 Inca, 7 Eg, and 1 Su; 67-2), seven of them Inca AC.

In the hills we obliterate nine units (4 Ir, 3 Mon, 2 Ger, 2 Inca; 76-2).

We barely hold Suburbian Dye against the attack of Eg knights, slaying two and losing a cav (78-3).


1625 (3): Hmm, the Dutch are in the Industrial Age. I assign more scientists and cut a turn off our time to Physics.

We can now see twenty-four AC, though we've expunged seven. So that's 155 turns' accumulation.

In the NW we deal with twenty-one units (16 Ko, 3 Az, 1 Gk, 1 Ro; 99-3), capturing a settler.

We found New Castle in the eastern hills.

We auto-raze Portuguese Rio Janeiro [sic], held by a spearman (100-3).

In the hills we liquidate fourteen units: five Carthaginian cav, five Ir knights, two Inca horsemen, one Inca AC, and a German knight. (114-3).

On the central front we smash five Dutch and two Eg units (121-3).

The English are building Shakespeare, the French Magellan, the Romans Newton, and the Indians Bach.


1630 (4): We sink a Sumerian galley, and its unknown contents, with a newly built caravel (122-3).

We found the fill-in town of Anderson.

We can see seven enemy ships off the South Fort-Babylon-Nippur coast, so perhaps the landings are about to get more serious.

The Koreans are in the IA.

About half of the main Inca force emerges onto the flatlands between Incensify and New Hattusas, and the slaughter begins--thirteen AC and five horsemen (140-3).

We found Marion and Frankfort, pushing our borders forward in the central grasslands, where we shatter seven Dutch and two Eg units (149-3).

In the eastern hills we wipe out seven Ir and two Carth units (158-3).

In the NW we annihilate nine units (2 Fr, 1 Eng, 4 Ko, 2 Az; 167-3) and capture a settler.

Heavy Mongol cav attacks cost us a cav and a musketman in the hills, while we strike down four attackers (171-5).


1635 (5): We ride down seven Roman and two Carth units landed next to Babylon--this although we're fighting the Carths in the east (180-5).

Elsewhere in the NW we liquidate three Korean units (183-5).

On the flatlands around New Hattusas we exterminate another nineteen Inca units, nine of them AC, along with two German knights. Somehow we lose a cav attacking a horseman (204-6).

In the eastern hills we slay six enemies (5 Mon, 1 Ir; 210-6), generating the GL Huzziya, who immediately forms our twenty-third army.

In the central grasslands we kill fourteen foes (6 Eg, 3 Sum, 5 Dutch; 224-6), and found Franklin.

Another two Mongol cav perish attacking New Castle, while we lose a pikeman to the attack of a Dutch LB (226-7).

Twenty-three elite victories this round generated one Great Leader.
 
We're holding our lines easily enough, and pushing forward where we can. We have a settler in place, at site 1 on the screenshot, to found a town which will give us control of most of the mountain pass to Germany. So we should be able to resume razing major enemy cities soon.

There are enemy units slightly within our lines all over the map, but it's nothing we can't handle. The stack of twelve Sumerian knights near Franklin will require careful treatment. The stack of eight Eg units next to Suburbian Dye can be ignored for the moment, as long as we get a reasonably healthy army into the town at the end of the turn.

With a lot of enemy cav units in play, it's become harder to maintain complete control of what the AI will attack, and our armies in cities are at greater risk. The Mongols, in particular, have been quite willing to attack armies in cities with cav.

I assume everyone here knows how to handle the funnel we have set up in the NW. Normally our armies there can move, attack, and then return to their places in the wall. The main thing is not to get greedy and make attacks which could leave wall armies at less than 50% health.

The AI civs have been compulsively landing units next to Babylon, and haven't been making more dangerous landings farther behind the front line. So we should be sure to leave Babylon open, to encourage them in this pattern.

We have a homeland defense force of three cav in Hattusha, to deal with landings there when they come.

We've accumulated some skimmed-off native workers in our core, either to repair bombardment damage as Vmxa suggests, or to start railing from that end when the time comes.

Our assignment of scientists at the moment represents a compromise between research and continued population growth in our corrupt towns. We can assign quite a few more if the team decides it's necessary. We're at least two techs, not counting Physics which we'll discover in two turns, behind some AI civs.

Our builds in corrupt towns are just suggestions, and should be adjusted as necessary. In particular, we should advance quickly enough in the central grasslands that the wall builds there can be changed.

To repeat, the save represents the beginning of the 1640 AD turn, not the end. One slave near New Harran and eight slaves near Eastern River have used their movement to complete roads, but otherwise all our units are uncommitted.

Our empty army is next to Eastern River, under a cav.

We have one caravel off our east coast, with which to start sinking redlined galleys, and we're building a couple of others (which can be switched to frigates eventually) in the NW.

Our unit costs are down to 2 gpt.
 
The mountain pass:

GR12-1640ADi.JPG


The funnel:

GR12-1640ADii.JPG
 
excellent kill rate NP, that sounds really like crazy fighting. Once we get RR, we should be able to start really dominating with many more scientists and fater movement. I am surprised that the city limit is still not reached.
How many cities do we own?
 
Will read and play this through by tomorrow night.
 
It must be around the low 90's. So there is a bit more than 400 for the rest of the world. I would have thought they would be there by now, especcially since they seem to have not had a great deal of intercine warfare.
 
ThERat said:
How many cities do we own?

We had 22 armies at the beginning of my round and I founded eleven towns, so 99 cities is the absolute minimum--probably more like 104.

vmxa said:
they seem to have not had a great deal of intercine warfare

To put it mildly--we seem to have faced every unit the Incas ever built, and they're normally very aggressive.
 
We have 100 towns now. I wonder if that massive amount of mountians is playing a role in the number of towns in the game. That is a lot of land that cannot be settled. If there is any other range around in the fog that could impact the places they have to found upon without crowding.

Also they are likely to be slow about clearing any swamps.
 
I think the more land we own and settle via CxxC, the higher the chance we hit 512 cities.
Then we will start to create a buffer between us and the enemy.
I also suggest to wait until the limit is hit to get rid of those Island cities. Else, the opponent will simply refound them.
 
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