How Far Will the Woke Mob Go?

[Arwon]

I don't think anyone was asking for HBO to do that, it just reads like some out of touch manager at HBO trying to either anticipate things or get some positive publicity and failing horribly.

Also much easier than, say, changing their hiring, funding and production practices.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

Lately I am surprised by how far along cancel culture has advanced.

A New York Time's editor has been fired for publishing an opinion piece from a Republican Senator.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/07/media/james-bennet-new-york-times-resigns/index.html
The CEO of CrossFit is done after being insensitive about George Floyd all week.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/10/business/greg-glassman-zoom-call/index.html
One UCLA accounting professor has police protection now after refusing to give out special treatment for the final exam which counted for 100% of the grade.
https://nypost.com/2020/06/10/ucla-suspends-professor-for-refusing-leniency-for-black-students/
NBA announcer fired after saying "All lives matter, every one of them"
https://nypost.com/2020/06/02/nba-announcer-grant-napear-fired-over-all-live-matter-comment/

It used to be one would be fired for saying something racist, but now it is being fired for doing nothing much or being insensitive, and an apology means nothing.

Is doing nothing racist now?
I'm worried about this since I am very good at doing nothing.
https://medium.com/the-partnered-pe...e-dont-get-defensive-get-informed-fa7c05270fa

Hurk
https://www.npr.org/2020/06/09/8733...le-can-still-be-complicit-in-a-racist-society

Gah

Well, I guess this one is ok, just unsettling.


East Seattle is now under warlord rule.
https://www.city-journal.org/antifa-seattle-capitol-hill-autonomous-zone

Looks like the cops got canceled in east Seattle.


So did the TV show Cops after running 33 years.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/09/business/media/cops-canceled-paramount-tv-show.html
Live PD canceled
https://deadline.com/2020/06/live-p...nst-police-brutality-george-floyd-1202956175/
Gone with the Wind will now have a read-aloud editorial denouncing the bad parts of it before people can watch it on HBO Max, which is OK I suppose.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/10/entertainment/gone-with-the-wind-history/index.html

How far is cancel culture going to go?


Here is the next step.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/stockwell-day-systemic-racism-canada-1.5597550

TRIPLE FIRED!!!

Conservatives have a deep persecution complex that is very disturbing to witness, even as they do their very best to keep everyone else who doesn't remotely resemble them down.

 

[Kaitzilla]

There are issues with Tom Cottons op ed

1) The language used such as "leftwing radicals"
2) False narrative used such as Antifa "infiltrated marches"
3) False comparisons to 1968 race riots after MLK was killed which saw massive rates of arsons, arrests and many deaths.

Public perspective by Republicans whom were given a voice in the NYT is a noble objective. Allow them a platform to gaslight and spread false narrative is irresponsible of any media network.

Why fire the editor though?
Why not write a rebuttal making all these points and saying Senator Cotton is full of crap?

Op-eds from Putin, Iran, and Hamas have all been run in the past.
This one was somewhat objectionable too.
https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/06/opinion/pedophilia-a-disorder-not-a-crime.html
Aftermath:
https://www.nytimes.com/times-insider/2014/10/13/discussion-of-pedophilia-turns-heated/


https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/52-...ry-control-violent-protests/story?id=71097167

A slight majority of Americans support deploying the U.S. military to intervene where there are violent protests, according to a new ABC News/Ipsos poll released Sunday.

The "Send in the Troops" sentiment actually enjoys majority support.

hey by the way that "opinion piece" from that Republican Senator was calling on the President to use live ammo on peaceful protestors.

Any idea what sentence he said that says this?
I'm having trouble finding the op-ed text that isn't behind a paywall.

 

[Kaitzilla]

Conservatives have a deep persecution complex that is very disturbing to witness, even as they do their very best to keep everyone else who doesn't remotely resemble them down.

Heh, is conservatism a cult I wonder?
So much indifference, so little empathy.

Here is an article claiming that wokeness has acquired some of the features of a cult.
https://newdiscourses.com/2020/06/cult-dynamics-wokeness/

Now, does conservatism have the traits required to become a cult?

Once this vulnerability has been successfully manufactured in the mark (or identified and inflamed, if already present), cult doctrine is given as a potential resolution to the emotional distress.

The hook for conservatism hmm.
Tradition cures all ills?

The vulnerability being preyed upon...
Insecurity of some sort.

Once the doctrine is initially accepted by the cult’s mark, the next step is to make the mark feel (morally) welcome and good.

Lot of self-congratulation for being sane, check.

I. Cult Initiation

...Once the person feels morally welcome and the feeling of vulnerability gets its first hit of calming resolution through the doctrine, the cult indoctrinator will start to increase the depth of the doctrine, usually a little at a time. With a cult, this will involve beginning to teach the “quieter” parts of the cult worldview that would scare off potential new recruits. And this is where we can find the first clear sign that we’re dealing with a cult rather than something healthier, though there is still much overlap and some ambiguity. They will deepen the doctrine while informing their mark that they’ll be surrounded by temptation, especially from broader society. This gets us to the surest first sign that a cult initiation is taking place, though. It is when this warning starts being applied to friends and family who will be described as failing to understand the depth and value of the cult’s doctrine and, in fact, the mark themselves.

Mainstream media are out to get you!

II. Cult Indoctrination
Thus, the next step in cult indoctrination is to get people more fully committed. This is actually rather easy, as we tend to commit to new groups fairly quickly under certain well-known conditions. Usual cult-deepening methods include public pronouncements of faith before the in-group community, which bonds the mark to them socially and emotionally. This will often involve rituals such as group prayers, singing, or outright initiation rituals, which dramatically deepen commitment to a group very quickly. There will also be requests to make costly personal sacrifices to be considered a full part of the new group.

Might be some of that going on.

III. Cult Reprogramming
Once the mark is properly indoctrinated, the objective becomes to reprogram the mark to get them to think differently. The goal is no longer to indoctrinate on what is “rightthink” and “wrongthink.” It is to make the mark’s thinking be completely in line with the view of the world described by the cult doctrine This will let the mark see the “truth” of the doctrine for themselves everywhere in the world.

Conspiracies everywhere!

IV. The Cult Mentality
It’s very important to stress just how difficult it is to break someone free from a cult mindset once they have adopted the relevant cult consciousness. Once reprogrammed, they will think the way the cult doctrine views the world. They will have put on the cult-colored glasses of whatever cult they have joined, and they will see everything in the world through that lens. Everything will be construable as supportive of the cult’s doctrinal claims about the world, including where the cult doctrine gets things right and also where it identifies the evils in the world that would challenge its existence. People who have been reprogrammed into a cult mentality will perceive all attempts to free them from the cult as malicious attempts to drag them away from their community and, crucially, back to the Bad Emotional Place that they have come to strongly associate with that awful feeling of vulnerability that was used to initiate them into the cult in the first place. The doctrine is the opium that dulls their emotional pain, one might say with, given the context of the present discussion, a bit of tongue in one’s cheek.

Wow, cults suck.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

Heh, is conservatism a cult I wonder?
So much indifference, so little empathy.

Here is an article claiming that wokeness has acquired some of the features of a cult.
https://newdiscourses.com/2020/06/cult-dynamics-wokeness/

Now, does conservatism have the traits required to become a cult?

The hook for conservatism hmm.
Tradition cures all ills?

The vulnerability being preyed upon...
Insecurity of some sort.

Lot of self-congratulation for being sane, check.


Mainstream media are out to get you!


Might be some of that going on.


Conspiracies everywhere!


Wow, cults suck.

You're unironically quoting and propogating beliefs from a website that engages in a level of hysteria similar to McCarthyism, all the whilst insinuating wokeness is a cult.

An amazing level of cognitive dissonance.

 

[Zardnaar]

Wokeness isn't a cult but they carry stuff to far such as Gone With the Wind. As I said what are you gonna do destroy everything from 10+ years ago.

Movies from 1939 (and boring). It's a product of it's time. It's going to fail badly at all sorts of modern values.

It's actually closer in time to the Civil War than now.

 

[Kaitzilla]

You're unironically quoting and propogating beliefs from a website that engages in a level of hysteria similar to McCarthyism, all the whilst insinuating wokeness is a cult.

An amazing level of cognitive dissonance.

Scratches head.

I thought I was insinuating that conservatism was a cult.

I just think the woke stuff is going too far these days.

 

[Zardnaar]

Scratches head.

I thought I was insinuating that conservatism was a cult.

I just think the woke stuff is going too far these days.

It will go away eventually either when Trump gets turfed out or when sane people get annoyed and join the conservatives in telling them to F off en masse.

They'll score an own goal eventually.

 

[Cloud_Strife]

I just think the woke stuff is going too far these days.

They said that about civil rights and social justice back in the day, do you agree with them now?

 

[Zardnaar]

They said that about civil rights and social justice back in the day, do you agree with them now?

Right message, wrong way of going about it perhaps.

40 years of no progressive presidents (1968-2008). Rioting in the streets, waving North Vietnamese flags etc. Blowback came at the electoral level.

Liberals ceased to exist electorally and the trade unions were gutted.

 

[Kaitzilla]

They said that about civil rights and social justice back in the day, do you agree with them now?

Looking back decades later, no.
Most of the excesses were corrected and the good stuff got left behind.

King examines the history of the civil rights struggle, noting tasks that future generations must accomplish to bring about full equality, and asserts that African Americans have already waited over three centuries for civil rights and that it is time to be proactive: “For years now, I have heard the word ‘Wait!’ It rings in the ear of every Negro with piercing familiarity. This ‘Wait’ has almost always meant ‘Never.’ We must come to see, with one of our distinguished jurists, that ‘justice too long delayed is justice denied.’”

I can see the appeal of cancel culture.

Companies care about money,
Being fired can feel like dying, so get people fired for social justice and everyone will scramble to learn about it and how to act/talk to not get fired.

But every day the list of demands grows longer.
And the purity tests more stringent.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-Former-president-says-good-people-flaws.html

 

[Hrothbern]

And the purity tests more stringent.

The US character is often a combi of hubris and self-chastise

 

[Zardnaar]

The US character is often a combi of hubris and self-chastise

Blind optimism and mercenary.

 

[Hrothbern]

Blind optimism and mercenary.

That self-chastise IS an important cultural element of the US I think

"a loving father chastises his children"

Also: doing something stupid and then much is forgiven because "we are all sinners".... that is a very resilient culture that indeed offers optimism for the future

It is all very much a Christian culture of the religious strict pioneer settlers together with so many adventurers looking for their future and fortune in the US.

 

[Zardnaar]

That self-chastise IS an important cultural element of the US I think

"a loving father chastises his children"

Also: doing something stupid and then much is forgiven because "we are all sinners".... that is a very resilient culture that indeed offers optimism for the future

It is all very much a Christian culture of the religious strict pioneer settlers together with so many adventurers looking for their future and fortune in the US.

Heh maybe. Generally they're easy enough to get along with, bit higher strung than NZers.

That applies to most of the world though.

 

[Gorbles]

What a funny thread this is. We have, in-order:

1. Complaints about an op-ed being pulled that the OP doesn't even have access to and therefore hasn't read.
2. Portraying racist behaviour as merely "insensitive".
3. Complaints about the suspension of a member of university staff that made the university look terrible in email exchanges with a student.
4. Complaints about some dude saying "all lives matter" as an explicit response to being asked about the George Floyd protests, thus making his employer look bad.

Two of these are "actions have consequences". One is outright racism. Another is a sitting senator getting preferential treatment in a mainstream newspaper. Given that we don't ever see threads like "how far will the conservative mob go", it really begs the question of how much conservative or otherwise anti-"woke" people will blame the consequences of their own actions on anyone but themselves.

And don't get me started on the Canada thing. Trudeau is rightly being held to a high standard given past behaviour (blackface), and people are criticising him for using the current events for easy PR points . . . but his opposition are claiming that there's no racism in Canada? No systematic racism at all? Really?

* gestures vaguely at the Indigenous Canadians and their persecuted history in Canada *

Wokeness isn't a cult but they carry stuff to far such as Gone With the Wind. As I said what are you gonna do destroy everything from 10+ years ago.

Movies from 1939 (and boring). It's a product of it's time. It's going to fail badly at all sorts of modern values.

It's actually closer in time to the Civil War than now.

Very little about corporate decisions has anything to do with being "woke". If a private business wishes to remove an item from their catalogue, they can do so at any time for any reason. It's their prerogative.

But then again, Gone With The Wind wasn't even permanently removed. It will now have a preface that lets the viewer understand that it does, in fact, reflect the views from the time it was created. So it's really funny again that this is apparently "carrying stuff too far". What about this is "destroying" Gone With The Wind?

 

[Patine]

Lately I am surprised by how far along cancel culture has advanced.

A New York Time's editor has been fired for publishing an opinion piece from a Republican Senator.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/07/media/james-bennet-new-york-times-resigns/index.html
The CEO of CrossFit is done after being insensitive about George Floyd all week.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/10/business/greg-glassman-zoom-call/index.html
One UCLA accounting professor has police protection now after refusing to give out special treatment for the final exam which counted for 100% of the grade.
https://nypost.com/2020/06/10/ucla-suspends-professor-for-refusing-leniency-for-black-students/
NBA announcer fired after saying "All lives matter, every one of them"
https://nypost.com/2020/06/02/nba-announcer-grant-napear-fired-over-all-live-matter-comment/

It used to be one would be fired for saying something racist, but now it is being fired for doing nothing much or being insensitive, and an apology means nothing.

Is doing nothing racist now?
I'm worried about this since I am very good at doing nothing.
https://medium.com/the-partnered-pe...e-dont-get-defensive-get-informed-fa7c05270fa

Hurk
https://www.npr.org/2020/06/09/8733...le-can-still-be-complicit-in-a-racist-society

Gah

Well, I guess this one is ok, just unsettling.


East Seattle is now under warlord rule.
https://www.city-journal.org/antifa-seattle-capitol-hill-autonomous-zone

Looks like the cops got canceled in east Seattle.


So did the TV show Cops after running 33 years.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/09/business/media/cops-canceled-paramount-tv-show.html
Live PD canceled
https://deadline.com/2020/06/live-p...nst-police-brutality-george-floyd-1202956175/
Gone with the Wind will now have a read-aloud editorial denouncing the bad parts of it before people can watch it on HBO Max, which is OK I suppose.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/10/entertainment/gone-with-the-wind-history/index.html

How far is cancel culture going to go?


Here is the next step.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/stockwell-day-systemic-racism-canada-1.5597550

TRIPLE FIRED!!!

It really amazes how much traction terms coined by wacko, unhinged, delusional, tin-foil hat conspiracy theorists have gained in the parlance lately. David Icke's "woke," and Lyndon LaRouche's "deep state," or two very big examples. Are people REALLY becoming THAT braindead to believe this crap? Have you listened to a lot of the other utter hokum Icke, LaRouche, Bannon, (Alex) Jones, Chomsky, and others of their tin-foil-hat-wearing ilk actually spout off, for those you love to use their more ubiquitous terms?

 

[Hrothbern]

Heh maybe. Generally they're easy enough to get along with, bit higher strung than NZers.

That applies to most of the world though.

What I said in those posts was intended as an as such neutral characterisation !

And from personal experience... yes, easy enough to get along with.... and I did always enjoy the mostly vibrant optimism to find new solutions and way forwards.
European culture is in general imo much more backward looking and pessimistic.

 

[Zardnaar]

What I said in those posts was intended as an as such neutral characterisation !

And from personal experience... yes, easy enough to get along with.... and I did always enjoy the mostly vibrant optimism to find new solutions and way forwards.
European culture is in general imo much more backward looking and pessimistic.

Depends what part of Europe.

They tend to lack the easy going mates/p al/buddies thing you get in AngloSaxon nation's.

We're not perfect ourselves and our attitude can drive tourists nuts lol. Might take a few more days to get things done waiting for parts.

 

[Arwon]

It really amazes how much traction terms coined by wacko, unhinged, delusional, tin-foil hat conspiracy theorists have gained in the parlance lately. David Icke's "woke," and Lyndon LaRouche's "deep state," or two very big examples. Are people REALLY becoming THAT braindead to believe this crap? Have you listened to a lot of the other utter hokum Icke, LaRouche, Bannon, (Alex) Jones, Chomsky, and others of their tin-foil-hat-wearing ilk actually spout off, for those you love to use their more ubiquitous terms?

David ... Icke? The term came from Black activist culture, "stay woke" is even grammatically constructed using the habitual structure common in colloquial Black American English.