Is Britain about to leave the EU?

[bathsheba666]

She was killed by a person with mental health issues.

Yes. He claimed to believe in 'Britain first'

 

[Mega Tsunami]

I don't think it's very democratic nor moral to advocate for a system which intentionally blocks a significant minority of people from having power, simply because one doesn't like what those people think...

I repeat, UKIP would not have been significant in the first place if we had not been forced to use PR.
Our democracy nips the extremists in the bud, so that the weak minded, the ‘don’t knows’ or the ‘mutton-heads’ as Arakhor called them, don’t join in the momentum, carried along by the eloquence of extremists like Farage. Give people like him a cause plus PR and you have nothing but trouble.
Without PR I just wonder if the name Farage would have been mentioned on these boards much.

Imperfect though our system is, I would rather keep the extremists out thank you.

 

[Lohrenswald]

I can't speak for people in Britain who voted to leave, but if I were in their place, my concern wouldn't be to keep parliament free from EU, but the people and the country.

In Norway, most representatives are for EU membership, even though like 80 % of the population is against

 

[Kyriakos]

I repeat, UKIP would not have been significant in the first place if we had not been forced to use PR.
Our democracy nips the extremists in the bud, so that the weak minded, the ‘don’t knows’ or the ‘mutton-heads’ as Arakhor called them, don’t join in the momentum, carried along by the eloquence of extremists like Farage. Give people like him a cause plus PR and you have nothing but trouble.
Without PR I just wonder if the name Farage would have been mentioned on these boards much.

Imperfect though our system is, I would rather keep the extremists out thank you.

That is how any system designed to ensure 1 or at most 2 parties get to power "explain" the inherent and ludicrous blocking of anything else, as in FPTP. In essence it means that if both parties suck you just have to pick one which sucks. It also means ukip (which imo sucks) got millions of votes and only one seat due to how non democratic the system is.

If you want to make it impossible to have such parties elect mps, you either go the dictatorial way and ban, or have so unfair an electoral system that it doesn't matter what people vote if not party a or party b.

It is similar to the different method used (eg) in Turkey, when a party must get at least 10% of the vote to be in parliament! Set so in the hope it would prevent any kurdish party in the first place, and only recently was not enough.

 

[Cheetah]

I repeat, UKIP would not have been significant in the first place if we had not been forced to use PR.
Our democracy nips the extremists in the bud, so that the weak minded, the ‘don’t knows’ or the ‘mutton-heads’ as Arakhor called them, don’t join in the momentum, carried along by the eloquence of extremists like Farage. Give people like him a cause plus PR and you have nothing but trouble.
Without PR I just wonder if the name Farage would have been mentioned on these boards much.

Imperfect though our system is, I would rather keep the extremists out thank you.

Then I'll repeat what I said: Keeping people from being represented in parliament because you don't like their opinions sounds undemocratic and immoral.

If 10% of the public thinks that UKIP has the correct policies, then those 10% should be represented in parliament, where the national policies would start responding to some of the concerns of those 10%.

Trolls should always be dragged into the daylight -- those that survive might have something to contribute. Letting them fester and agitate while shrouded in darkness is a really bad idea.

 

[Arakhor]

FPTP is certainly the pragmatic option, but even AV would have been more representative. That way, you could vote for your minor parties if you so chose, but if they didn't get in, your back-up vote for one of the major parties would then kick in.

 

[Takhisis]

I repeat, UKIP would not have been significant in the first place if we had not been forced to use PR.

Nah. UKIP/BNP/NF have existed for a long time, usually as part of the underlying sentiment in the Conservative & Unionist Party, with all that drivel about England standing it alone, 1066, etc. etc. that makes people, to this day, pretend that the British Empire wasn't an organised system for pillaging as much of the world as possible while massacring any resistors, who still believe that WWI was fought in the name of something good instead of just conquering more places, that Churchill did not give away Eastern Europe to Stalin (after the Western Betrayal, of course), and so on… UKIP is just the final corporisation of that movement.

 

[Ajidica]

In which Boris Johnson makes a surprisingly apt analogy for Brexit:

In the words of our great prime minister... I understood that Brexit means Brexit and we are going to make a Titanic success of it."

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37858143

 

[Takhisis]

It gives a new meaning to the idiom ‘smash hit’.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Good news Brexiters !
Free trade agreement with India ....... in exchange for more Indian immigrants.

Next UK can sign a free trade agreement with EU in exchange for more EU immigrants

Theresa May finds free movement for trade an issue outside EU as well

India, with its historic and cultural ties to Britain, is exactly the sort of country that “hello world” Brexiters claimed the UK could do business with after leaving the European Union.

one important factor was unquestionably linked to migration. India wanted more of its skilled professionals to be able to enter EU countries on six-month visas.

May’s comments on returning Indians who “have no right” to remain in Britain, Indian journalists huddled together comparing notes, asking whether she had really used those words.
May wanted India to hand over trade liberalisation in return for little else. She said the Delhi press pack had expected to hear something warmer, and were surprised by what felt like a somewhat hostile tone.

backlash from some business voices over the issue underlined the complexity of the task ahead. India would love to sign up to a trade agreement with the UK, but only if it is in its economic and social interest. Like the EU example before, the challenges facing Britain in India underline the mountain May has to climb as she attempts to reach the opportunities of a post-Brexit world. Free movement in return for trade isn’t a concept that is limited to the European project that British voters rejected in June.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...y-free-movement-for-trade-an-issue-outside-eu

 

[Arakhor]

In a stunning surprise to absolutely no one, free trade comes with large strings. RIP the Torygraph's ridiculous idea of rebuilding the British (trade) Empire.

 

[Snerk]

In the long run, do workers usually benefit from free trade deals anyway?

 

[Arakhor]

I have no idea. I assume that would be linked to the specific agreement.

 

[really]

In classical economic theory workers should benefit. increasing specialisation should improve wages, lower prices and increase the economy in general. In practice there will always be winners and losers - it is the reason the EU has structural funding - to even out those differences and prepare the workers for different jobs.

 

[Oerdin]

Kndia will sign a free trade agreement without unlimited immigration.

 

[Arakhor]

Quite possibly, but the PM is insistent on lowering immigration, not raising it.

 

[Snerk]

Is Britain as dependant on immigration for a sustained labour force as Germany is?

 

[Kyriakos]

In which Boris Johnson makes a surprisingly apt analogy for Brexit:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37858143

BOJO is a disgrace, as usual..
Remember that londoners voted for him as their mayor.

 

[Arakhor]

Is Britain as dependant on immigration for a sustained labour force as Germany is?

For certain careers, yes, especially the low-end jobs that apparently few self-respecting working-class Britons want to take. But then, we have lots of Schroedinger's Immigrants: they're simultaneously too lazy to work, taking our jobs and doing the jobs we don't want.

 

[Cheetah]

That conundrum is easily solved by having -- at a minimum -- three individual immigrants...

The first one is stealing money from the public, the second is outcompeting low-skilled workers and depressing their wages and benefits, and the third one is doing real hard work and deserves to be treated better than currently.