Is Britain about to leave the EU?

[Mega Tsunami]

But we all know the real, real reason Sturgeon is calling for indyref2 and that is because she is petrified that Brexit might actually work, that the Scots might quite like the results and she will have lost her chance for independence.
And she wants to put the biggest spanner she can in the talks to ensure Brexit does not work. She will do her best to scupper the negotiations as much as possible.

She is even talking about calling a Holyrood election right in the middle of the Brexit talks thereby making sure Scotland cannot take part in them. Yet more of the victimhood cards the Scots are so good at playing.

One of her biggest problems is that Euroscepticism is alive and well in Scotland. She cannot play the ‘Look at the evil sassenachs, they are taking us out of our beloved EU’ card anymore. Instead she plays the ‘the are taking us out of the single market’ card.
What if the UK comes to an agreement to have some sort of access to the single market (for a price of course). She will be well and truly kippered.

No, she wants desperately for Brexit to fail. If she actually thought they were going to fail she would simply bide her time and then call for indyref2.


From the Guardian a couple of days ago:
Eurosceptic views in Scotland pose dilemma for Nicola Sturgeon

A majority of Scottish voters have strong Eurosceptic views following last year’s referendum campaign, with nearly half complaining that the EU has too much power.

The Scottish Social Attitudes survey, an authoritative annual study of public opinion, found high levels of Euroscepticism at the same time as the highest level of support for independence it had recorded since it was established in 1999.
The publicly funded survey, done late last year by the social research institute ScotCen, said that more than two-thirds of voters were critical of the EU: 25% wanted to leave the EU entirely while another 42% wanted to reduce its powers.

The survey also found that 46% of Scots wanted independence – the highest level this study had recorded, and closely mirroring the findings of commercial opinion polls. But it showed that 21% of those pro-independence voters still wanted to quit the EU, while 41% wanted its powers cut, suggesting a majority of yes voters were unhappy with the EU’s influence and reach.


https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-in-scotland-pose-dilemma-for-nicola-sturgeon

 

[Arakhor]

But we all know the real, real reason Sturgeon is calling for indyref2 and that is because she is petrified that Brexit might actually work, that the Scots might quite like the results and she will have lost her chance for independence.

I very much doubt that. Not even the PM has any idea about what's happening with Brexit, so...

 

[Mega Tsunami]

True (no one knows), but the SNP very much expected Brexit to have worked for them by now and it hasn’t. That must seriously bother them.
Their cries of the wicked Tories kicking them out of the EU has pretty much fallen on deaf ears.
Polls are very similar to indy1, but I saw one poll this week (YouGov I think) which had it just 43 for and 57 against independence.

Stories this week like Toyota announcing a £240m investment in their Derbyshire plant do not help the SNP cause at all.

 

[Arakhor]

Toyota investing in an English facility won't mean anything to the SNP. All that means is that the Tories are willing to invest in big business (and grammar schools).

 

[Lillefix]

True (no one knows)

But had she been a competent prime minister she'd know more than she knows now. They don't seem to have done any preparation for Brexit.

 

[Takhisis]

And she wants to put the biggest spanner she can in the talks to ensure Brexit does not work. She will do her best to scupper the negotiations as much as possible.

Maybe we could pay some attention to John Major, who pointed out that the only way to make a ‘hard Brexit’ work is to dismantle public health and education? (not that the Tories would disagree with such a policy in any era anyway)

 

[EnglishEdward]

Toyota investing in an English facility won't mean anything to the SNP. All that means is that the Tories are willing to invest in big business (and grammar schools).

Correct, many in the Scottish National Party probably won't understand it.

But many other Scots voters will recognise that it means that Brexit does not necessarily mean an end to Japanese
investment in Britain, but they may consider which part of Britain? If the Japanese are listening to the SNP, they
may well be wondering whether Scotland will be in the UK, in the EU or what, and which currency it will be using?

As a vote Leaver, I freely admit that the Referendum and Brexit result has created uncertainty (not that remaining in the
EU would have been without its own uncertainties) but alas Nicola Sturgeon's hysterical approach merely compounds it.

When the UK leaves the EU, it will regain powers lost to the EU; and therefore be better able to delegate to Scotland and Wales
(who understand this); but by trying to sabotage that process, the SNP risks losing the trust of the UK parliament and lessens the likelihood.

But had she been a competent prime minister she'd know more than she knows now. They don't seem to have done any preparation for Brexit.

Her priority has been overcoming political opposition from priviledged Remoaners.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-leave-eu-european-union-latest-a7632826.html

Much work has been undertaken by others, but it has not been headline news.

http://www.lawyersforbritain.org/int-trade.shtml

Maybe we could pay some attention to John Major, who pointed out that the only way to make a ‘hard Brexit’ work is to dismantle public health and education? (not that the Tories would disagree with such a policy in any era anyway)

John Major is one of those who created the problem of this divisive refereundum in the first place by having his government sign the
Treaty on European Union on 7 February 1992 in Maastricht, Netherlands; without obtaining proper approval from the British peoples.

Public health and education were not invented by the EU, they existed in the UK long before we joined the EEC in 1973.

And as healthcare in other EU countries is in comparison with the UK, to a greater extent funded by insurance companies rather
than the state; EU membership can not be reasonably equated with ensuring the future of the UK's National Health Services.

 

[Verbose]

But we all know the real, real reason Sturgeon is calling for indyref2 and that is because she is petrified that Brexit might actually work, that the Scots might quite like the results and she will have lost her chance for independence.

More like the prospect of another twenty years of Conservative governments...

 

[Arakhor]

Her priority has been overcoming political opposition from priviledged Remoaners.

Of course it has. Now kindly leave Express comments in the gutter where they belong.

 

[EnglishEdward]

Of course it has. Now kindly leave Express comments in the gutter where they belong.

Look in the mirror.

 

[Traitorfish]

It is up to Westminster to give the necessary authority for a binding vote – nothing directly to do with Holyrood.

It's a two-stage process. A motion to hold another referendum must first past Holryood, then Westminster. What's important, here, is that May has no direct roll in this process.

But we all know the real, real reason Sturgeon is calling for indyref2 and that is because she is petrified that Brexit might actually work, that the Scots might quite like the results and she will have lost her chance for independence.
And she wants to put the biggest spanner she can in the talks to ensure Brexit does not work. She will do her best to scupper the negotiations as much as possible.

3/10, no Rothschilds, no ancient astronauts, would not theorise again.

As a vote Leaver, I freely admit that the Referendum and Brexit result has created uncertainty (not that remaining in the
EU would have been without its own uncertainties) but alas Nicola Sturgeon's hysterical approach merely compounds it.

So that's an interesting phrasing. Before the referendum, the leadership of every major party was saying "it will be a disaster", and most economists seemed to agree. Sturgeon is unusual only in that she has continued to say that. The common sense of early 2016 has become the raving madness of 2017, and not because the objective circumstances have changed, but simply because a factional shift within the Conservative Party has exchange an half-heatedly Europhile government for a half-heatedly Eurosceptic one.

Sturgeon was opposed to Brexit and remains opposed to Brexit, on the same grounds and in the same terms, so she is a hysteric and a saboteur. May remained neutral around Brexit, Davidson actively opposed it, but both now thump their chests and bellow "Brexit means Brexit", so they are firm-handed and clear-sighted leaders. That's a powerful calculus.

Shouldn't expect more, I suppose, of a country that mythologised one of their most erratic and directionless premierships as the "Iron Lady".

 

[EnglishEdward]

So that's an interesting phrasing. Before the referendum, the leadership of every major party was saying "it will be a disaster", and most economists seemed to agree. Sturgeon is unusual only in that she has continued to say that. The common sense of early 2016 has become the raving madness of 2017, and not because the objective circumstances have changed, but simply because a factional shift within the Conservative Party has exchange an half-heatedly Europhile government for a half-heatedly Eurosceptic one.

Yes, but that factional shift change reflected the UK majority Leave vote.

And the way I see it, most senior economists got to be senior economists by kow towing to their seniors in their youth and the powers that be throughout.
When the UK government policy was to remain in the EU, they nearly all obediently agreed with them and when UK government policy is to leave the EU,
they mostly changed their minds to agree with that; but some of them find it a little difficult to 'u' turn because it means eating their own words and within a year.

Sturgeon was opposed to Brexit and remains opposed to Brexit, on the same grounds and in the same terms, so she is a hysteric and a saboteur. May remained neutral around Brexit,
Davidson actively opposed it, but both now thump their chests and bellow "Brexit means Brexit", so they are firm-handed and clear-sighted leaders. That's a powerful calculus.

I am unaware as to whether Nicola Sturgeon has formally written to Theresa May or the speaker of the House of Commnos politely requesting that the UK
Parliament consider approving a second Scottish referendum. What it comes across is that Nicola Sturgeon is ordering Theresa May as if the latter is her servant.

For what it is worth, I think that Theresa May is correct; the UK should negotiate terms with the EU or, failing that, leave without any agreement.
Once that is known, you Scots should have the opportunity to vote again, for (i) true Independence, (ii) re-joining EU directly or (iii) staying in the union with England.

What I am saying is that the outcome of the UK Referendum is that there are now clearly three, not two, future paths for Scotland.

Shouldn't expect more, I suppose, of a country that mythologised one of their most erratic and directionless premierships as the "Iron Lady".

Not sure if you are talking about England or Scotland or both. But I know what you mean. Maggie Thatcher only showed clear direction on five big occasions
(a) supporting Geoffrey Howe's monetrism (probably a mistake), (b) Falkland's war (she had little alternative), (c) miner's strike (Scargill forced her hand)
(d) handbagging Ronald Reagan (when he wanted to completely nuclear disarm) and (e) stiffening up G Bush (senior) to bounce Saddam out of Kuwait.

 

[Arakhor]

Look in the mirror.

Don't make comments worthy only of the Express then (and whilst you're at it, find some better retorts too).

Sturgeon was opposed to Brexit and remains opposed to Brexit, on the same grounds and in the same terms, so she is a hysteric and a saboteur. May remained neutral around Brexit, Davidson actively opposed it, but both now thump their chests and bellow "Brexit means Brexit", so they are firm-handed and clear-sighted leaders. That's a powerful calculus.

Steady on now. You're one of Edward's "elitist Remoaners" for daring not to pound your chest along with the others.

I am unaware as to whether Nicola Sturgeon has formally written to Theresa May or the speaker of the House of Commnos politely requesting that the UKParliament consider approving a second Scottish referendum. What it comes across is that Nicola Sturgeon is ordering Theresa May as if the latter is her servant.

No one is saying that either of them is behaving reasonably, but equally May does not get to dismiiss Sturgeon like that, as such a referendum is granted by Parliament, not the Prime Minister.

 

[EnglishEdward]

Steady on now. You're one of Edward's "elitist Remoaners" for daring not to pound your chest along with the others.

I was previously unaware that Traitorfish is a member of the House of Lords.

 

[Arakhor]

I was previously unaware that Traitorfish is a member of the House of Lords.

You're also seemingly unaware that that phrase is slung around incessantly, usually to dismiss anyone who espouses any view other than the meaningless "Brexit means Brexit".

 

[Takhisis]

I also cannot overlook Edward's choice of the word ‘hysterical’ to refer to a female leader, especially after 2016 when we saw Hillary Rodham Clinton habitually referred to as ‘Shrillary’.

 

[EnglishEdward]

I also cannot overlook Edward's choice of the word ‘hysterical’ to refer to a female leader, especially after 2016 when we saw Hillary Rodham Clinton habitually referred to as ‘Shrillary’.

You are deviating, what others said about Hillary Rodham Clinton has nothing to do with this thread.

 

[JohannaK]

It has everything to do when it points that this act of misogyny is not isolated.

 

[EnglishEdward]

It has everything to do when it points that this act of misogyny is not isolated.

What act of misogyny?

 

[JohannaK]

Calling Sturgeon hysterical.