Is the US constitution evil?

[Lord of Elves]

"Treason" is crap and should be amended out of the constitution.

I guess I'll go share all those state secrets with international terrorists/those dirty Russkies/insert perceived or actual enemy of the United States here. I'll never understand your predilection for people who people who want to make your life unpleasant.

 

[GhostWriter16]

Why are they telling you those secrets anyway?

(I know they didn't really, but I mean in general, why would they give state secrets to someone who would give them to terrorists?)

 

[bhsup]

Well, since we're being literal, I can't find the words "secession is legal" anywhere either.

Because that isn't how our Constitution works. It doesn't list what the States CAN do, it lists what the Federal government can do. Everything else is automatically a State power unless specifically prohibited. So your awesome example is actually an example of a power a State has specifically because it is not listed.

 

[GhostWriter16]

Just wondering, but how would you interpret the "Or the People" part?

 

[bhsup]

On a case by case basis depending on what you're talking about, so really impossible to give a generic answer to that. Oh, and if there is ever any question about interpretation, just remember that mine is always the correct interpretation.

 

[GhostWriter16]

On a case by case basis depending on what you're talking about, so really impossible to give a generic answer to that. Oh, and if there is ever any question about interpretation, just remember that mine is always the correct interpretation.

You do a better job than the Supreme Court, that's for sure

I always assumed "The People" just meant "The Individual" but maybe not?

In other words, if its not given to the Federal government in the constitution, its either a state decision, or a personal choice.

 

[warpus]

Here, give it a read, it's literally only two pages long. Amendments 1-10, and Amendments 11-27. It will take you 5 minutes.

I'm not even American and I can already see that that isn't the constitution. That's the bill of rights, which IIRC is several of the amendments of the (comparatively lengthy) constitution.

The U.S. constitution is much longer than just 5 minutes of reading! You just clicked on the first google hit that came up.

You'd think you'd know more about your constitution than me

I really hate it act as if it's remained unchanged for 200 years and call it "old and outdated". It isn't. After the first 10 amendments that were added in its founding year, it's been amended 16 times. The most recent one being in 1992, 10 years after your Canadian constitution was rewritten.

It's a long text - the amendments each concern themselves with fairly specific ideas.

A constitution is supposed to be the framework & basis on which a country stands. 200 years ago the world was a totally different place than it is now, which is why I say that it is outdated. I don't mean this in any sort of insulting way - it was just written a long time ago when things were very different.

 

[Joecoolyo]

I'm not even American and I can already see that that isn't the constitution. That's the bill of rights, which IIRC is several of the amendments of the (comparatively lengthy) constitution.

The U.S. constitution is much longer than just 5 minutes of reading! You just clicked on the first google hit that came up.

You'd think you'd know more about your constitution than me

OH DERP

I left out the first page!

Let's make that three

I knew something felt wrong lol. But even with the rest of it, its not that long.

It's a long text - the amendments each concern themselves with fairly specific ideas.

A constitution is supposed to be the framework & basis on which a country stands. 200 years ago the world was a totally different place than it is now, which is why I say that it is outdated. I don't mean this in any sort of insulting way - it was just written a long time ago when things were very different.

Yeah, but the thing is, the way the government is supposed to function really hasn't changed that much in 200 years. And that's the purpose of the constitution, to outline how the government functions.

 

[Ailedhoo]

Free ponies= benefits from the government that are either paid for by the taxpayer base, or funded by borrowing or outright money printing. These range from Sandra Fluke's recreational sex subsidy to subsidies to oil companies. Free ponies are things that are often taken as entitlements but are things we have no right to expect the taxpayer to pay for. And they are not free.

You know family planning is important for ensuring the population does not enlarge too much? Although I can understand the concern to oil companies. However I sense there is a bit more to your statements...

I use it as a term of ridicule because both the government and the people have delved into idiocy to think that we can continue to borrow and print and never face the consequences. There is no such thing as a free lunch and there is no such thing as a free pony. The piper must be paid. But we all want to ride the free pony and hope that the herd lasts as long as we are alive. Or maybe we just think in the short term, instant gratification. One infamous economist, when challenged on his preposterous theories, said, "In the long run we are all dead."

The term only ridicule yourself via the... oddness of the term outside a brony convention.

We Brits have benefited greatly from free healthcare, ensuring the poor do not have to fear losing all their savings due to a serious health issue. It was not the NHS that bought the British ecomony in recession but the reckless acts of the banks.

The ponies have already run a long way. When they topple over it will be on top of us all.

...you are realy obessed with ponies?

Did you ever stop to think what would happen if all government programs had to be paid for by a taxation system that everyone had to pay into? Why, we'd get what we need and not what we want. And we wouldn't be looking at inevitable national bankruptcy.

I know that social structures require fuel. Taxes are the price we pay to life in a civilised society. The current ecomonic problems in America have causes especilly within the deregulation since the 1980s under Reagan.

I have popcorn and will enjoy throwing back and watching everyone saddle up those ponies and try to outrun the tidal wave of ruin that lies just around the bend.

...

There is little cause in that statement.

Free ponies, free ponies, free ponies for all.

O my goodness... YOU ARE MAKING ME LOL BUT NOT WITH YOU! Your obession with ponies is just... wow.

The next American Republic will be a Christian conservative republic. Because only we will have the courage to pick up the pieces, the strength to bear the burden, the common sense and wisdom to find the way, and the character to pay the price without asking "What's in it for me?".

So the solution to all America's problems is to scrap the seperation of church and state via scrapping the right to a person's own religius right of choosing.

What is this republic anyway you want? I heard you describe democracy as "mob rule." I sence that in reguard to your other post in this thread that... well lets just say you will face massive dissent in reguards to your "ideal."

I always assumed "The People" just meant "The Individual" but maybe not?

Forgive me but would not "The Individual" be described as "The Person" than "The People?" One must understand collective order. Society must a collective of individuals as oppose to a individual collective or the chaos that comes without a system of some form.

 

[Leoreth]

The only real protection any nation has against totalitarianism is a strong and living democratic tradition being carried from generation to generation. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't even the Soviet Union have a written constitution that guaranteed freedom of speech?

Exactly. The American constitution (or any constitution) is only a safeguard against oppression as far as the people and institutions are willing to uphold it. This effect can become strong enough to create a positive feedback loop, i.e. people believe the constitution protects democracy because people believe the constitution protects democracy etc. Insofar a constitution can be a useful thing to establish a democratic tradition, but it's far from necessary or the only way to achieve that.

I'm not too familiar with the Soviet Union, but I guess you're right. The East German constitution of 1949 at least guaranteed several democratic rights that were never respected. At least they were honest enough to rewrite the constitution a couple of times to remove these rights.

 

[sophie]

Wow, we actually managed to go 4 pages without traitor talk. Good job guys.

 

[Ailedhoo]

Wow, we actually managed to go 4 pages without traitor talk. Good job guys.

So... is it now time to get into traitor talk?