Is this a case of child neglect?

[NovaKart]

http://www.salon.com/2014/06/03/the_day_i_left_my_son_in_the_car/

This is a long story so if you don't want to read it I'll summarize. The mom has a 4 year old and left him in the car for 5 minutes while she went in a store. Someone recorded it and she was charged with a crime, although a minor one.

Personally I don't see anything wrong with doing this. My mother often left me in the car when she went in a shop but I don't know if she did it when I was as young as 4. The problem is we have to go by the writers estimate that it was only 5 minutes when it could have been much longer than that. I think if it's like 15 minutes or longer then that's not good parenting although I wouldn't call it a crime.

My sister has decided she's going to let her 10 year old daughter take the subway by herself in New York and I don't know if that's something I would do either.

 

[Wrymouth3]

Don't leave anybody under the age of 5 in a car alone, it's not a good idea.

 

[NovaKart]

Under 15 ? I think a 14 year old could certainly handle it. Or did you mean 5?

 

[Wrymouth3]

Under 15 ? I think a 14 year old could certainly handle it. Or did you mean 5?

I meant 5, I changed it.

 

[nc-1701]

No problem with it whatsoever, I really enjoyed reading the article when I saw it (a few days ago). I find this 'protecting children' helicopter paranoia very bizarre and disturbing. I had a lot of freedom as a child, but looking back all I can say is that I wish I'de had more and been forced to be more independent even when I didn't necessarily want it.

Helicopter parenting is bad, period. And this disgusting individual who videotaped and went to the police? They are the only real criminal in this story.

 

[Farm Boy]

There's so much it depends on. Locked into a 5 point harness in the back seat of a climate controlled car is a pretty safe position on it's own. If the objection is more to do with strangers having access to your toddler when he or she is out of immediate reach, then the playground is just as bad to worse. But I still wouldn't go into a store out of eyesight of the car and leave the little man in it. I will stand at a carryout counter and leave him in the car if I was able to park immediately next to the door and can see it at all times. I figure it's safer than getting him out if I'm going to need to set him down in or near a parking lot to carry things. He's 2, he doesn't always immediately comply with vocal orders and has the tendency to bolt without minding traffic yet. I think that's more dangerous on the whole.

 

[warpus]

I was running late because, like many parents of small children, I often find there just aren’t enough hours in the day.

Whether what she did was irresponsible or not, the above is no excuse.

You have kids, you take care of them. No shortcuts that put them in danger, just because you feel like you have a lot to worry about. You signed up for this, you deal with it responsibly.

 

[salty mud]

http://www.salon.com/2014/06/03/the_day_i_left_my_son_in_the_car/

This is a long story so if you don't want to read it I'll summarize. The mom has a 4 year old and left him in the car for 5 minutes while she went in a store. Someone recorded it and she was charged with a crime, although a minor one.

Personally I don't see anything wrong with doing this. My mother often left me in the car when she went in a shop but I don't know if she did it when I was as young as 4. The problem is we have to go by the writers estimate that it was only 5 minutes when it could have been much longer than that. I think if it's like 15 minutes or longer then that's not good parenting although I wouldn't call it a crime.

My sister has decided she's going to let her 10 year old daughter take the subway by herself in New York and I don't know if that's something I would do either.

Well, I can see both sides. Leaving a 5 year old in a car for even 5 minutes is a bit silly. Anyone could smash the window and kidnap the child. Why couldn't she just take the child in with her?

 

[wolfigor]

it seems a bit of over-reaction.
I agree with Farm Boy that in the correct context, a child inside the car is safe... probably safer than outside.

I remember as a child often I didn't want to go into some shops with my mother and I preferred to remain in the car.
At the time nobody had paranoia about it, and it looks like I survived pretty well.

 

[Kaitzilla]

Well, I can see both sides. Leaving a 5 year old in a car for even 5 minutes is a bit silly. Anyone could smash the window and kidnap the child. Why couldn't she just take the child in with her?

The car was locked, the windows were cracked, and it was 5 minutes on a 50 degree day (10C)
How can it be a crime?

I picture this concerned someone standing beside my car, inches from my child, holding a phone to the window, recording him as he played his game on the iPad. I imagined the person backing away as I came out of the store, watching me return to the car, recording it all, not stopping me, not saying anything, but standing there and dialing 911 as I drove away. Bye now. At this point, almost a year had passed since it happened. I could hear my lawyer shuffling papers. I looked down and saw that my hands were shaking, but unlike before, I wasn't afraid. I was enraged.

"I don't know," I said. "It doesn't sound to me like I committed the crime I'm being charged with. I didn't render him in need of services. He was fine. Maybe I should plead 'not guilty,' go to trial."

His response was instant and unequivocal. "I don't think you want to do that. This is going to be handled in a juvenile court, and the juvenile courts are notorious for erring on the side of protecting the child." I can't remember if he said it or only implied it, but either way, the warning took root. You don't want to lose your kids over this. It was the first time the idea had skulled out of the darkest, most anxious corners of my mind. My lawyer and I said we'd talk later. I thought I was going to be sick.

Ah the police state.
Where every problem is solved by the police.
So much better than in the old days.

 

[salty mud]

The car was locked, the windows were cracked, and it was 5 minutes on a 50 degree day (10C)
How can it be a crime?

Didn't you read what I said? A criminal who knows what he's doing could have the window smashed and possessions stolen or the car stolen in less than five minutes.

 

[Kyriakos]

Depends on what may go on. I recall being left in the car for 10 min, when i was 7, and it was fine, UNTIL a band of creepy kids started to approach the car and hit on the windows so as to scare me. Then it was not fine at all.

 

[Akka]

Well, I can see both sides. Leaving a 5 year old in a car for even 5 minutes is a bit silly. Anyone could smash the window and kidnap the child. Why couldn't she just take the child in with her?

I can't manage to know if you're tongue-in-cheek joking or just insane.

 

[nc-1701]

Well, I can see both sides. Leaving a 5 year old in a car for even 5 minutes is a bit silly. Anyone could smash the window and kidnap the child. Why couldn't she just take the child in with her?

Didn't you read what I said? A criminal who knows what he's doing could have the window smashed and possessions stolen or the car stolen in less than five minutes.

You're kidding right?

 

[Valka D'Ur]

http://www.salon.com/2014/06/03/the_day_i_left_my_son_in_the_car/

This is a long story so if you don't want to read it I'll summarize. The mom has a 4 year old and left him in the car for 5 minutes while she went in a store. Someone recorded it and she was charged with a crime, although a minor one.

Personally I don't see anything wrong with doing this. My mother often left me in the car when she went in a shop but I don't know if she did it when I was as young as 4. The problem is we have to go by the writers estimate that it was only 5 minutes when it could have been much longer than that. I think if it's like 15 minutes or longer then that's not good parenting although I wouldn't call it a crime.

My sister has decided she's going to let her 10 year old daughter take the subway by herself in New York and I don't know if that's something I would do either.

Yes, leaving a 4-year-old alone in a car, out of parental sight/hearing is neglectful. Circumstances/excuses are irrelevant. You just don't do that.

 

[Farm Boy]

Didn't you read what I said? A criminal who knows what he's doing could have the window smashed and possessions stolen or the car stolen in less than five minutes.

Here's the trick. It's the same trick if you've ever been hunting for groundhogs, or varmits, or anything else really. A criminal that knows what he's doing, if he wants a kid: he only has to be in charge for 15 seconds, give or take. He has the luxury of planning. If you're going to stop somebody, you have to be on-game and able to counter at the moment he chooses. In the last 50 years the rates of intentional stranger kidnapping haven't really budged in the States for all the extra care society demands.

If you're talking about a car thief accidentally driving away in a car with a child in it, that happens sometimes. But that 911 call doesn't get put into the same category of police response that grand theft auto does. That creates Amber Alerts, with a known vehicle and license plate. Those guys seem to have the tendency of pulling over and leaving the car when they realize there is a kid in it since they probably don't want the police to have quite that high a probability of shooting them.

We lose about 100 kids a year to this type of intentional evil in the US. How many do we lose in parking lots and on streets in that sort of situation?

 

[Borachio]

I bet Madeleine McCann's parents regret leaving her unattended.

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/753820-madeleine-mccann-latest-search-turns-up-nothing-parents-travel-to-portugal-in-libel-case/

Though she wasn't left in a locked car, nor for just five minutes.

 

[salty mud]

I can't manage to know if you're tongue-in-cheek joking or just insane.

You're kidding right?

I don't see what's so "insane" about responsibly looking after your child.

 

[Narz]

This is a long story so if you don't want to read it I'll summarize. The mom has a 4 year old and left him in the car for 5 minutes while she went in a store. Someone recorded it and she was charged with a crime, although a minor one.

It's fine, unless the windows are rolled up & the kid is at risk of cooking.

If she left her kid for 10+ minutes I might have a problem with it.

I also remember being left alone alot.

Kids nowadays are treated like little retards who will set themselves on fire if not supervised every second.

Article somewhat on topic about shifting attitudes towards childhood autonomy : http://www.npr.org/blogs/krulwich/2...your-children-are-is-that-always-a-good-thing

 

[nc-1701]

I don't see what's so "insane" about responsibly looking after your child.

What's insane is letting media fueled paranoia drive you to fearing very low probability events. And then using that irrational fear as justification for punishing others who are less paranoid than yourself.