Israel admits forcing birth control shots on Ethiopian women

[emzie]

I've been here for over 4 years.

Well if you don't consider Roma or Muslims people, then yes, he's certainly not a bigot.

So, a few doctors might have wanted to prevent Ethiopian women to have too many children. Even if the motive of some of them indeed were racist, I still don't think it is a reason to denounce the entire State of Israel, especially considering that the government actually took action against it.

So again, what is the big deal?

The government took action to stop a program they were running after they were called on it publicly. That's kinda at the feet of the government, not independent doctors.

And the big deal is the deception. If Israel had said, "hey, while you're waiting to be settled and integrated, we need you to be on birth control" this would be a very different story.

 

[Agent327]

from my google dictionary app!

eu·gen·ics Noun (plural) /yo͞oˈjeniks/
The science of improving a human population by controlled breeding to increase the occurrence of desirable heritable characteristics. Developed largely by Francis Galton as a method of improving the human race, it fell into disfavor only after the perversion of its doctrines by the Nazis.

You seem to miss the quoted fact that birth control does not equal any "controlled breeding... etc".

So no eugenics. Let's stick to the facts, shall we?

What did they think they were taking?

A drug, obviously. What else woud you get from a trusted doctor?

But since you didn't bother to read the linked article here it is again, in full:

After Israel was accused of forcing Ethiopian women to accept injections of the contraceptive Depo-Provera in an attempt to lower birth rates among black immigrants, an official has for the first time admitted use of the drug among Ethiopian women.

In a letter to the Israeli Health Ministry Director General Prof. Ron Gamzu, Sharona Eliahu-Chai of the Association of Civil Rights in Israel, demanded that the Israeli health authorities stop administering the injections immediately. The letter also demanded that the authorities conduct an investigation into allegations stemming from the practice.

The Association of Civil Rights in Israel is a group that represents several women’s rights and Ethiopian immigrants’ groups.

The National reports that Hedva Eyal, project coordinator of a women's rights research group, said in Haifa: "I believe there is a deliberate targeting of these [Ethiopian] women."
According to The National, Eyal and other activists say that the birth rate in the Ethiopian community in Israel has halved in the past 10 years. Eyal's civil rights group and six others have asked the Israeli health ministry to explain the widespread use of Depo-Provera injections among Ethiopians.
Haaretz reports an Israeli government official has for the first time acknowledged the practice of injecting women of Ethiopian origin with the long-acting contraceptive Depo-Provera.

Haaretz reports that the Health Ministry Director General Prof. Ron Gamzu, has instructed the four health maintenance organizations in the country to stop the practice immediately. The Israeli ministry and other state agencies have for long denied allegations that the government-funded health facilities were targeting Ethiopian women for selective use of the contraceptive.
Gamzu’s directive instructed "all gynecologists in the HMOs not to renew prescriptions for Depo-Provera for women if for any reason there is concern that they might not understand the ramifications of the treatment."
The drug is given by injection every three months, The National reports. Doctors consider it a birth-control method of last resort because of the side effects associated with its use.

Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/342250#ixzz2JUdKr5iL

So, in short, these allegations have been confirmed by government officials.

Or maybe it's just that Ethiopia has serious problems with overpopulation, having tons of kids is standard there, and so -- if it indeed happened -- they wanted to prevent continuation of such lifestyle in Israel. I don't blame them.

You seem to have little knowledge of how birht rates eveolve. I do blame you.

 

[caketastydelish]

Well if you don't consider Roma or Muslims people, then yes, he's certainly not a bigot.

Roma? Does this mean people from the city of Rome in Italy? Anyway, it would be hilarious to presume I don't consider Muslims to be people. I'm Iranian and have Muslims in my family, which I get along with just fine. I've seen Winner go on anti-radical Islam rants, but this doesn't mean he hates Muslims on general. Unless you have any examples to prove otherwise?

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Roma means gypsie.

 

[caketastydelish]

Other than Crezth's out-of-context quote from Winner which was not only satirical but also over five years old, I haven't noticed any anti gypsie post by Winner.

edit: Let me be clear that personally I DO NOT approve of what Israel is doing here. The point is, I would rather debate the issue with anyone who disagrees rather than just shout "you're a racist".

 

[El_Machinae]

So, scuttlebutt is that these were prescriptions given to women in refugee holding camps, and that these camps were run by (American) NGOs and employed their own doctors. The refugees were told that their claim for refugee status was much more unlikely if they didn't take the Depo.

These women were then being given prescriptions, and then 'normal' Israeli health officials were merely filling and/or maintaining them once the ladies entered the country. This is the step that the Dept of Health officially terminated.

So, there're still large concerns regarding informed consent and coercion, obviously. There's also a continued concern about how much of this policy was known to the Dept of Health. The primary actors, though, appear to be NGO workers at refugee camps.

 

[History_Buff]

Other than Crezth's out-of-context quote from Winner which was not only satirical but also over five years old, I haven't noticed any anti gypsie post by Winner.

And you say you've been here how long? Clearly haven't been hanging around OT much.

 

[caketastydelish]

And you say you've been here how long? Clearly haven't been hanging around OT much.

edit: as usual, this is how you all are treating him. Honestly, I'm surprised he even still uses this site.

 

[useless]

Perhaps he could go to Stormfront where his opinions on eugenics for ethiopians might be judged in a more positive way

 

[caketastydelish]

Stormfront hates jews just as much as ethiopians, so I doubt that.

 

[Neomega]

Stormfront hates jews just as much as ethiopians, so I doubt that.

I wonder how they feel about Ethiopian Jews.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: Let's end the off topic discussion of other posters. If you feel mods need to act on a post because of its content, then just report it and move on. Thanks.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Formaldehyde]

So, scuttlebutt is that these were prescriptions given to women in refugee holding camps, and that these camps were run by (American) NGOs and employed their own doctors. The refugees were told that their claim for refugee status was much more unlikely if they didn't take the Depo.

These women were then being given prescriptions, and then 'normal' Israeli health officials were merely filling and/or maintaining them once the ladies entered the country. This is the step that the Dept of Health officially terminated.

So, there're still large concerns regarding informed consent and coercion, obviously. There's also a continued concern about how much of this policy was known to the Dept of Health. The primary actors, though, appear to be NGO workers at refugee camps.

I'd like to see some reputable source that this was done by Americans NGOs. Stating so-called "scuttlebutt" is claiming this is true just doesn't cut it, since it flies in the face of all the facts which have been posted so far.

 

[History_Buff]

I wonder how they feel about Ethiopian Jews.

Maybe it's like a double negative, and they come a long lost Master Race.

 

[Lone Wolf]

So, Winner's position on that issue is already known. Everyone should be subjected to some sort of forced birth control, so even if it is applied, misleadingly and under duress, to a particular (sub)-ethnicity, it's no big deal. Better applied to some people then to no people at all.

Any other Israeli defenders here care to comment?

I don't think that Ashkenazi supremacist sentiments reflect some kind of historical trauma, except maybe really indirectly.

 

[Winner]

A drug, obviously. What else woud you get from a trusted doctor?

But since you didn't bother to read the linked article here it is again, in full:

I read it thrice now and I still don't see a clear statement that they were mislead as to the effects of the drug. What were they told they were taking, vitamins?

You seem to have little knowledge of how birht rates eveolve. I do blame you.

I understand it pretty well, thank you very much. You should know that first generation migrants do tend towards higher than average birth rates, especially if coming from countries as poor and underdeveloped as Ethiopia. Limiting the number of children these people have can only help improve their social standing and speed up their integration into the society.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

You probably shouldn't have used the words 'can only' in that last sentence if you want people to agree with the rest of it.

 

[Azale]

You seem to miss the quoted fact that birth control does not equal any "controlled breeding... etc".

Wait...what? That's exactly what birth control is! Controlled breeding isn't necessarily sinister though unless it's paired with power and racism like is being alleged in this case.

 

[Formaldehyde]

Googling "controlled breeding" only brings up references to livestock since eugenics was completely debunked long ago as being pseudo-science.

 

[Winner]

I see my question still hasn't been answered...

eugenics was completely debunked long ago as being pseudo-science.

Nope. This has nothing to do with the topic at hand, but what was 'debunked' were the crude and inhuman methods that were applied in the past. Eugenics is not a science per se but rather a philosophical approach.

Eugenics will have a huge comeback once genetic screening/manipulation becomes commonplace, simply because parents want to have healthier and smarter kids.