King of the World #8: Shaka

re: Luck- Yeah. That was insane. I was happy when one Archer went down, ecstatic when the Impi took out a second, and dumbfounded when the third one crumpled. But we've suffered some slings and arrows this game, so it's nice to catch a break now and again.

re: The Aksum site- I think the weird AI "Why swim when you can walk" bug will keep Aksum safe from Saladin's settlers, at least by sea. And I think I can keep track of Arab homesteaders shleppin' past Memphis. The Settler is halfway built in Ulundi.

re: Saladin- I don't really want to turn this into another bloodlust game (I kind of want to stick to Africa), and Saladin is, at least for now, our friend. And he tends to be pretty loyal to his religious brethren. I'm thinking I can maybe get away with a quick raid to take Madagascar, but more likely I think I'm going to play nice.

re: Hannibal- Good points. I think he lives. He seems to be in a rough spot on this map. North Africa's got some decent city sites, but you almost have your hands full just holding onto your BFC tiles in the face of European culture.

re: Mansa- Yeah, I think he has to go. That'll be our great Elephant/Catapult war, I think, and then it'll be a matter of turtling up and focusing on culture. Ulundi really would be a pain to get to Legendary, and the Jewish shrine would go a long way to financing our economy.

Yeah, I kind of agree with you there. Mansa does need to go before he becomes a superpower and takes Hannibal out, and Hannibal stays, right? Saladin? Who knows? Just take Madagascar before the animals escape. ( lol! ) You were so lucky when you took down that archer. And about Aksum, Salad will attempt to trap you there.
 
Mansa actually becomes a superpower on this map? :lol:

Well, yeah. Just look at all of that room, food, resources. He could take the cannibal out with War Elephants that he gets from the south and Morrocco. On one of the games I played, Mansa eliminated Hatty, and Saladin. Meaning that he became a superpower and 'almost' won. Until I took 9 of his cities in 22 turns.:lol: (Beat that Musa!)
 
Well, yeah. Just look at all of that room, food, resources. He could take the cannibal out with War Elephants that he gets from the south and Morrocco. On one of the games I played, Mansa eliminated Hatty, and Saladin. Meaning that he became a superpower and 'almost' won. Until I took 9 of his cities in 22 turns.:lol: (Beat that Musa!)

I've never seen that before. In 90% of m games, (as I was arguing in a different topic) he ends up getting conquered by the barbs, Russia or Egypt. It's kinda weird, but I've never seen him do well in this game, let alone become a superpower. :eek:
 
I'm thinking I can probably get Alphabet for Aesthetics plus Mathematics, and then go on a tech-trading spree to backfill.

Hi Neal,

Don't do that (too much generous for the AI) :eek:! Put some turns of research in alpha then trade it against aesthetics... The "cheap" HG (stone) could help your empire looking at your numerous but small cities...
Great game and story as always :goodjob:
 
The biggest threat is Saladin. There is nothing Mansa or Hannibal can do to the Zulu, but Saladin has a holy shrine, expands better, and has better land.

Go Zulu navy!

I disagree with this, but OTOH I do think it would be good to take Sal out. What is he a threat to do? He'll never have the :hammers: to be a military threat.

I think the biggest threats in this game will come from either Mao, Stalin or Fred. These are the only civs with room to expand (and good land to expand into) early on this map. Almost everyone else will be playing some version of an OCC. But one of the big 3 will eventually start to vassalize the rest of the world, and you will need good diplo and a strong military to deal with them. But that's pretty long-term. I don't think Neal will face any kind of military threat until around 1400AD.

Regarding India, I'd guess that Surya and Darius will split it. Watch out for Mao taking down Surya, though - that will be the first hint that Mao could be getting huge.
 
madagascar is not a big enough prize to warrant attacking sal. He way be a target long term but mali makes more sense short term.
 
My vote is to take Madagascar.. its close enough to your homeland and has some resources to be useful, will be fairly bloodless, seeing as how its only got that one chariot right now, and you can battle anything Sally sends at you from the north for some experience/promotions. Never said you have to push into Arabia... but Madagascar IS africa, and you own it by right, dernit!
 
In a culture game there's no real point in building a big empire, theoretically, 3 cities is enough, although 9 or 12 would be preferable for shines. Since teching will stop at an early date, that's no reason for a bigger empire as well, actually, bigger will only slow you down early on, and although it would help production and bpt later on, there won't be a bpt or need for production later on.

So, a reason for attacking MM: Shine, good culture city, different religion than rest of the world, more land.
Reasons for not attacking MM: he likes to trade techs, that's pretty much it.
I say go for it.

Reason for attacking Sal: lousy city on madagaskar, more lousy cities in the middle east, shrine.
Reasons for not attacking Sal: He could be your bestest buddy while you're in hinduism, you get diplo penalties because hinduism is big.
So why would you?
 
Civman: My Impis, having taken the last Egyptian stronghold, lustily ransacked the palace, looking for Hatshepsut. All they could find was some ugly dude in mascara who insisted that he was King of the Nile. Disappointed, and more than a little weirded out, they killed him from a safe distance and agreed to never speak of the incident again.
 
Civman: My Impis, having taken the last Egyptian stronghold, lustily ransacked the palace, looking for Hatshepsut. All they could find was some ugly dude in mascara who insisted that he was King of the Nile. Disappointed, and more than a little weirded out, they killed him from a safe distance and agreed to never speak of the incident again.

:lol::lol::lol: Nice.

I still say Ramses looks like he has a dagger shoved upward through his chin, with the just the hilt sticking out.

What about Zara?
 
I say, leave Mansa Musa. At this rate, he'll settle (maybe) Morocco and East Africa. Use him for a nice trading partner, since you'll be focusing on culture, not research. You only need to take the Congo Basin, giving you two cities: one for a nice late-game production, the other for a cottage-spamming Bureaucracy Capital/Legendary City.
 
Shaka brooded on his throne in Ulundi. No one could see past his grass-wreathed bald head and vicious spearfighting vanguard. Everyone considered him little more than a warlord, little better than... than Genghis Khan. Shaka would show them. He would turn the Zulu nation into a shining beacon of culture. Shaka had the heart of a poet. Admittedly, it was in a glass case next to the hands of a sculptor and the scalp of a criminal, but that was a minor detail...

I started the round by hitting Hannibal up for a long-delayed military tech:

Civ4ScreenShot0000-34.jpg


Hannibal is not to be trusted, but Mathematics isn't a gamebreaking military tech. And it's hardly a monopoly anymore.

I also negotiated with Saladin for the finer points of written language:

Civ4ScreenShot0001-38.jpg


So the Zulu tongue uses the Arab alphabet. I wonder how that looks on paper. Anyway, this will allow us to trade with anyone we feel like trading with, which is always a good thing.

In 320 B.C., our German brothers of the faith enlisted us in a crusade against the heathen Russians:

Civ4ScreenShot0003-34.jpg


I always feel a little bit nervous going up against Stalin. He is... intimidating. But, then, Shaka wasn't exactly a limp-wristed milquetoast, either, so bring it, Russkie! It was a fake war, anyway, which was eventually called off.

I even traded Mathematics to our future victims:

Civ4ScreenShot0004-36.jpg


I needed Polytheism to start on the Parthenon in Memphis. And Archery is just one of those backfill techs that I had to grab eventually. So what if Mansa gets Catapults? They're more of an offensive unit than defensive, anyway. Hannibal, bellicose halfwit that he is, demanded Polytheism in tribute. I rolled my eyes and gave it to him. He's lucky that his territory is useless to me.

In 260 B.C., my Scouts discovered the fate of India:

Civ4ScreenShot0007-36.jpg


Babylonia!? Wow. This is the new Southeast Asian Hatshepsut! Oh, and France apparently fell. Probably for the best. de Gaulle is kind of a jerk. Paris is currently in Roman hands. Looks like the Praetorians finally saw some use.

We received the Sports League quest:

Civ4ScreenShot0009-31.jpg


I forget- Is that worth it? Given the tight nature of this map, I don't think we'll have much competition for it, but I don't want to build 11 near-useless buildings if I don't have to.

Drama bought us a boatload of religious techs:

Civ4ScreenShot0010-34.jpg


I dialed up Monotheism and set about building Monasteries and Temples.

Memphis and Thebes finished up their World Wonders:

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Those are decent starts to building our former Egyptian sites up as cultural powerhouses. I still don't have Timbuktu, but I'm building up a force of Catapults and Elephants to make that happen.

I finished up Currency and ended the round. Here's a look at Eurasia as I know it:

Civ4ScreenShot0014-26.jpg


Suleiman is doing a heck of a job curtailing Persia's expansionistic tendencies, and Babylon, with a foothold in India, seems to be turning into quite a power. Sadly, religious differences with Moscow and Constantinople prevent me from checking out Europe.

Here's our quaint little empire:

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I barely beat Saladin to the second Madagascar site.

The incredibly complicated Diplomacy screen:

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:eek:

And a representative sampling of the Tech screen:

Civ4ScreenShot0017-27.jpg


We're not ahead, we're not behind. We're just... different. Our tech path is pretty divergent from everyone else's.

So we have a couple of Elephants and a couple of Catapults waiting to descend upon the Malinesian nation, but they're not enough. I only have Ulundi seriously building units. I think I've focused overmuch on infrastructure.

Thoughts?

The save:
 
Well, if I were you I'd focus on grabbing the Sistine Chapel, you can't afford to lose it.

Then let infrastructure sit aside for a bit and steamroll Mansa and fill out Africa if you feel so inclined.
 
The Colosseum quest will give you a free golden age because you've got the SoZ, and your cols will gain an additional +1 :) and +4 :culture:. GAs are pretty sweet, and the bonus happy from the cols might come in handy since you won't have the world spanning empire necessary to grab all the :) resources you'll want. If you build the cols fast in your top 3 cities you'll also be able to get the doubled culture for having the cols up for 1000 years.

On the other hand, claiming Mali's land is a better immediate use of hammers. You need at least 2 more cities before you can finish the quest anyway though, so maybe grab the Mali land and build col's elsewhere gradually, especially in your big 3. Then when you've killed MM, throw up the last few cols and enjoy the benefits of a GA after all his cities have come out of revolt (and hopefully grown back a bit). I doubt anyone else is going to finish the quest from under your nose (I suspect you have the most cities of anyone), so you can probably postpone finishing it off until your land is better developed and your cities are a bit larger.

Depending on how you play it, you may be able to get a GA from the quest and use the increased GPP generation to pump out another GP, burn them for a GA, and aim towards the Taj for a 3rd GA. Although subsequent cheap GAs are probably better saved for when you've got the Congo developed if possible, and that's a ways off.
 
The Colosseum quest will give you a free golden age because you've got the SoZ, and your cols will gain an additional +1 :) and +4 :culture:.QUOTE]

Not too sure. I think Colosseums would not have the extra bonuses if you take the GA.
 
Options for the Colosseum quest (quoted from the Random Events List, don't read if you consider that a spoiler) -

Spoiler :
Sports League
Prereq: CONSTRUCTION
Obsolete: RADIO or REFRIGERATION or PLASTICS or SATELLITES or ADVANCED_FLIGHT or ECOLOGY
Active/Weight: 25/500
Aim:
Build default number of players for this world size Colosseums (7 for standard)
Result:
1.+1 happy face for every Colosseum
2.+4 culture for every collosseum
3.IF you control the Statue of Zeus wonder trigger a golden age


Worth it if you have 11 cities with half-decent production, not worth founding a couple of crummy cities for.
 
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