Kooky beliefs: Why?

[warpus]

I don't disagree with any of it. I don't share your view, but that isn't disagreement, as views aren't facts.

Since when can we only disagree about facts?

But fair enough, if you agree with everything I've said, then there is really nothing left to add.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Since when can we only disagree about facts?

But fair enough, if you agree with everything I've said, then there is really nothing left to add.

I'm in no position to dispute your view...it is yours after all. One of the big differences in our views is that I acknowledge that.

 

[warpus]

You make it sound as if my view is completely removed from reality, something other humans are unable to comment on even if they wanted to.

Isn't this why we're on a message board? To discuss each other's views and positions on things?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

You make it sound as if my view is completely removed from reality, something other humans are unable to comment on even if they wanted to.

Isn't this why we're on a message board? To discuss each other's views and positions on things?

Your view isn't completely removed from reality, it's just different from mine. We've pretty thoroughly explored the boundaries of those differences more than enough. In fact, I think your views are probably much closer to "reality" as long as we measure reality by agreement, ie more people hold views similar to yours than to mine. That's why when I say something about people in general and you come along and provide a near perfect example I always find it amusing...stressing that I'm not laughing at your views, just that they are such a perfect prototype for "normality."

 

[warpus]

I'm weird, quit trying to prove the opposite. I'm a weirdo. I wear socks on my hands.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I'm weird, quit trying to prove the opposite. I'm a weirdo. I wear socks on my hands.

I never said you weren't. Just that on this particular subject it was totally predictable that when I said what I said about why most people are compelled to contest, demean, and extinguish beliefs that don't mesh with their views you would come along and represent most people so perfectly...even though typing with socks on your hands must be really challenging.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

To elaborate:

They are devoted advocates of Trump's "some people say" brand of journalism. They will write a whole article about the fact "some people say" that in all respects reads like it is covering whatever it is the people are saying. "Some people say that Bigfoot roams the north woods" can turn into a four hundred word testimonial that Bigfoot was seen with when and where.

They make no pretense regarding balance. If you are on their hit list you are dead to them, period, and facts are purely a luxury, not a necessity.

They are willing to assign any bad situation, real or imagined, to any combination of liberals, democrats, or leftists, depending apparently on a roll of the dice. For example, I'm not sure whether today it is the liberal media that controls the leftist polls, or the democrats that control the liberal leftist polls, but they don't feel any need to be consistent.

Speaking of polls, while they refuse to acknowledge any poll that shows Trump behind as a construct of <name enemy here>, their poll, which uses the tried and true "if you happen to be on our website click your preference" methodology they report results of extensively.

For them taking a statement about not watching seven part videos out of a conversation about a YouTube clip and making wild inferences about network series television would be mild, hence the reference.

I really don't care about American polls that talk about an American election.

As for your video preferences, I stand by what I said. You stated that you don't watch 7-part video series, period. You didn't specify the subject matter or genre. Therefore, my comment (an admittedly sarcastic one) was valid.

A lot of these things you cite seem to have some truth in them.

The Noah's Ark is a nice story if only mostly a symbolic but may have some truth behind it. But I seem to face the same difficulty when telling people that there is something terribly wrong with 9/11 official narrative. Bush said as an excuse that they couldnt stop the attacks becouse they couldnt imagine that terrorist could fly planes into the buildings! and the day after attack he admited that explosives has been used to bring down the buildings! Bush and half of his administration should have been in jail. But just like in the instances with the Bible there are reason why people cling to the less rational...

There's not a shred of evidence to support the Noah's Ark story. None. As for 9/11, it's fascinating how truthers focus on explosives in the towers, but ignore the fact that four airplanes were hijacked by terrorists and three of those made it to their targets. What about the one that the passengers crashed themselves?

If I grew up in a community of young earth creationists, I would probably be one too. It's easy to say that they are "obviously false", even if they are. If you grow up with your parents, teachers, role models, etc. believing in something, it will be a lot easier to embrace it yourself. There is always some level of peer pressure to "be one of us" as well. A lot of these communities shun members who disagree, such behaviour is usually heavily discouraged. Plus how could your parents, teachers, and other role models all be wrong? To admit that they are, even in the face of overwhelming evidence, might be too much for a lot of people. It would be admitting that not only your entire life has been a lie, but also the lives of your parents, and other people who you look up to or used to look up to. It's far easier to just go with the program and continue the belief system and structure.

I don't disagree with you, but would like to point out that it is possible to conclude that the prevailing attitudes with which one grows up are not only factually wrong, but really rather despicable. That was one reason why I had so many bitter arguments with my grandfather in my teens and early 20s - I was meeting more people, reading more varied news and nonfiction, and coming to the conclusion that so much of what he'd tried to instill in me was just plain wrong. I could have avoided arguments with him and later with my mother, could have avoided standing up for myself, but I'd have become a person who would be racist, bigoted, and the sort of person my present self despises.

Anti-vaxxer morons do form communities, too. Online forums, facebook groups, friends who hold similar beliefs, etc. There's a reason why such idiocy is so widespread these days, the internet makes it easy to form virtual communities with likeminded people. 20 years ago you might have thought to yourself: "What if vaccines are evil?", and that would have been the end of that. Today you can google it and find other idiots who believe the same thing. It might make you think: "Hey, maybe that wasn't such a stupid idea after all, if there's other people out there who also believe it"

They also band together to gang-flag and run smear campaigns against people who cite real science to prove that the anti-vaxxer position is nonsense. Yes, there have been people who reacted badly to vaccines. But it's nowhere near the numbers that the anti-vaxxers claim, and the vaccine-leads-to-autism notion has been debunked.

I wish I had a dollar for every time an anti-vaxxer has called me a "shill for Big Pharma" or "vaccine priestess." Big Pharma hasn't paid me a cent. Maybe I should sue for my nonexistent wages.

I'm weird, quit trying to prove the opposite. I'm a weirdo. I wear socks on my hands.

There is nothing at all weird about that if you're doing the dusting, or your hands are cold and you don't have mitts or gloves handy. Socks are also handy when you don't have oven mitts around (though obviously the thin ones aren't as useful in those situations).

 

[Timsup2nothin]

<---snip--->

Since you never back down no matter how wrong you are I expect you to always stand by whatever you said.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I accept corrections when I'm wrong. In this case, I'm not wrong.

 

[warpus]

I said about why most people are compelled to contest, demean, and extinguish beliefs that don't mesh with their views you would come along and represent most people so perfectly

Okay, so you took something I said personally, fair enough. You gotta stop beating around the bush in such a vague way and be more upfront about which posts you are talking about, though, took me long enough to get this out of you.

By the way, I am respectful of beliefs that don't mesh with my own worldview. As long as they're not stupid, like for example the whole anti-vaxxer movement, which is what seems to have triggered you. You don't have to agree with me that the movement is stupid, but you also don't have to take it personally. Didn't you yourself in your post say that you aren't a part of this movement? Or did I misinterpret what you wrote in that post?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Okay, so you took something I said personally, fair enough. You gotta stop beating around the bush in such a vague way and be more upfront about which posts you are talking about, though, took me long enough to get this out of you.

By the way, I am respectful of beliefs that don't mesh with my own worldview. As long as they're not stupid, like for example the whole anti-vaxxer movement, which is what seems to have triggered you. You don't have to agree with me that the movement is stupid, but you also don't have to take it personally. Didn't you yourself in your post say that you aren't a part of this movement? Or did I misinterpret what you wrote in that post?

I didn't take anything personally. The anti-vaxxer thing is a great example though. It has absolutely no way to make any difference to you, but like so many people your response to people who disagree with you is they must be "stupid" or somehow defective and you go to war over it. I find such an insecure footing to be amusing...always have. Especially from someone I deem to be pretty smart who really doesn't have anything to be insecure about on that front.

Though the socks on the hands make me wonder if I was giving you too much credit there...

 

[tetley]

I'm weird, quit trying to prove the opposite. I'm a weirdo. I wear socks on my hands.

That doesn't make you weird, that makes you Norwegian. Although, you can ask the Swedes what's the difference.

 

[Terxpahseyton]

@OP
Everything we do and believe gives us something we want.
Just had to point that out

 

[warpus]

I didn't take anything personally. The anti-vaxxer thing is a great example though. It has absolutely no way to make any difference to you, but like so many people your response to people who disagree with you is they must be "stupid" or somehow defective and you go to war over it.

I have two nieces now, one of them is 18 months old and the other one is 3 and a half. I love them very much.

Anti-vaxxers put them at risk, so when I see such idiocy being spread on a public forum, I speak out. It is nothing personal, it is me responding to people being irresponsible with the lives of others.

So yes, it does affect me personally, which is why I make a point to speak out against it when I can. And yes, I agree that labelling such beliefs as "stupid" isn't going to convert anyone, but this is a thread about "kooky" beliefs after all, and stupid and kooky are interchangeable in this context.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Bull. The math doesn't work. Anti-vaxxers pose no measurable threat to your nieces. They just offend your "science rules" sensibilities.

 

[warpus]

Bull. The math doesn't work. Anti-vaxxers pose no measurable threat to your nieces.

If there's enough of them, they sure can. It's already happened in some parts of the world.

Heard immunity can break down, if enough people opt out of vaccinations. Look it up. Like I said it's already happened, multiple times, in multiple places.

They just offend your "science rules" sensibilities.

Great that you're assuming things instead of actually listening to what I have to say about why I oppose such nonsense.

You might have a beef with science or whatever, but I don't really care about ideology.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Herd immunity can break down...if there were VASTLY more anti-vaxxers than there actually are...leading to a chance...minutely small...of contracting a disease...that has an infinitesimal mortality rate.

Pardon me for doubting the motives behind your heartfelt concerns.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

I have two nieces now, one of them is 18 months old and the other one is 3 and a half. I love them very much.

Anti-vaxxers put them at risk, so when I see such idiocy being spread on a public forum, I speak out. It is nothing personal, it is me responding to people being irresponsible with the lives of others.

So yes, it does affect me personally, which is why I make a point to speak out against it when I can. And yes, I agree that labelling such beliefs as "stupid" isn't going to convert anyone, but this is a thread about "kooky" beliefs after all, and stupid and kooky are interchangeable in this context.

Bull. The math doesn't work. Anti-vaxxers pose no measurable threat to your nieces. They just offend your "science rules" sensibilities.

What's next - accusing pro-vaccine people of being shills for "Big Pharma"?

All it takes is for a person with a weakened immune system, or is too young to be vaccinated, or has been vaccinated but too recently for the vaccine to take effect, to be exposed and get sick.

There have been outbreaks of measles in Canada in recent years, and the reason for those is mostly due to selfish people who refuse to have their children vaccinated. They prattle about autism and whine about their Charter rights (some schools are refusing to accept children whose parents can't produce proof of up-to-date immunizations), and their little darlings scamper around spreading measles, whooping cough, chicken pox, flu, and whatever else to people with weakened immune systems or who are otherwise unprotected. This has sometimes resulted in tragic outcomes - there was a news article on CBC.ca last year about this, how a young couple took a chance on allowing their newborn baby to visit family, and at some point the baby was exposed to whooping cough (I think it was whooping cough) - and died.

Herd immunity can break down...if there were VASTLY more anti-vaxxers than there actually are...leading to a chance...minutely small...of contracting a disease...that has an infinitesimal mortality rate.

Pardon me for doubting the motives behind your heartfelt concerns.

It seems to me that the motives are crystal-clear. Are you really going to sit there and call someone a liar when he states that he loves his nieces?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

It seems to me that the motives are crystal-clear. Are you really going to sit there and call someone a liar when he states that he loves his nieces?

No, because I respect him.

 

[warpus]

Herd immunity can break down...if there were VASTLY more anti-vaxxers than there actually are...leading to a chance...minutely small...of contracting a disease...that has an infinitesimal mortality rate.

Pardon me for doubting the motives behind your heartfelt concerns.

Like I said it's already happened.

You can put your fingers in your ears if you want, if your ideological needs regarding this are more important than people's lives, but it's kind of offensive to be honest.