Leftists

[GhostWriter16]

Really, this isn't a thread trying to deny anyone the right to be liberal, insulting anyone for being liberal, exc.

However, I find it odd, that while in the US liberals/conservatives are evenly split pretty much, on this forum most people (And even most Americans) are pro-big government, pro-large welfare state, pro-many government programs, anti-Iraq war, anti-Israel, exc. (Could name more, but you get the picture.)

I understand more posters than not differ on a couple of these points, but overall, posters fit the mold of above. Why?

Please don't take this thread to somewhere it isn't supposed to go. This is not the place to debate whether liberals or conservatives are "Better" or anything like that, just to find out why there are so much more of a percentage of liberals here than in the real world.

Also, by conservative here, I don't mean conservative to the extent I am. I'm talking about even moderate conservatives, or even moderates, like those who waver between the GOP and dems. Why are so many posters, including Americans, liberal?

 

[Narz]

Because the American-right is so dumb (not saying individuals on this forum who are right-leaning are just the general populace, many of them for example believe that Jesus cohabited the Earth with dinosaurs & that Sarah Palin was competent).

 

[ColdClimate]

You don't want to insult liberals, but just don't understand why anyone (or any significant number of people) would consider themselves liberals? And you don't want to discuss why one might consider one point of view to be better than the other?

You might want to tidy up that thought process, I'm not sure what you want people to debate...

 

[Mango Elephant]

I used to be conservative until I came here. It's just that the liberals are so good at argueing their point that I switched left.

 

[civver_764]

Define 'big government'. If you mean a government that provides for its citizens, then yes I support that, or at least as long as the screwed up system that is capitalism persists.

 

[sophie]

Internet goers in general tend to be more lefty. This is because IN GENERAL, younger people lean to the left while older people lean to the right, and most of the tech-savvy, internet using, forum frequenting individuals tend to be young (15-25). Just look at the polls about age distribution on OT if you don't believe me.

And even the views of the "leftists" on this forum tend to differ wildly. There really isn't much of a thing as a "leftist" group, in the same way that there really isn't such a thing as "rightist". For example, I am a socialist who believes in democratic running of business, while other posters might be more pro-capitalist, but still deemed "lefty" because of their stance on social issues such as gay rights and abortion.

 

[Perfection]

Because all he republicans are grumpy seniors who don't play video games.

And of course, because the few conservatives who are around sure as heck aren't gonna try to save you from the liberal dogpile.

 

[madviking]

"Left" and "Right" =/= "Conservative" and "Liberal". Those terms do not compute with each other.

Left and right are terms dating back to the French Revolution. Leftists wanted to execute the king (initially, then things went to pot) and the rightists were the monarchists.

Liberal was a term created during the early 1800s describing people such as Adam Smith, Herbert Spencer, etc who supported Social Darwinism and Capitalism.

Just food for thought: I'm a "right-winger" but a liberal (no quotes needed). Shocking ain't it?

Please stop plastering labels.

Regards,
madviking

 

[Ajidica]

Lets see how your political '5 deadly sins' stack up.

>are pro-big government: How is a large government bad? A large good government is better than a small bad government.
>pro-large welfare state: At least the tax money is going back into the system rather than into a Military-Industrial COmplex that most hope will never have to be used. Eisenhower warned us about the dangers of a MIC.
>pro-many government programs: And? Something good is better than nothing good. How are government programs bad?
>anti-Iraq war: Bush tricked the nation into an unessecary war and used up our (and Powels) PR points. BEsides, the footage he used of 'WMDs' all dated back to the First Gulf War.
>anti-Israel: I'm not anti-Israel. While I feel its creation was a bit shady, its here to stay. I just feel we shouldn't align ourselves so closely with Israel as they aren't as necesary to ME peace as removing Hamas/Hezbollah is.

So why are our 'liberal' policies actualy bad? Please back up your arguments.

EDIT: Madviking, minor point but in the French Rev the right weren't monarchists, they just felt he shouldn't be executed.

 

[Integral]

This is a forum for a strategy game.

It attracts middle-class, educated people. That demographic tends to lean left, everything else equal.

 

[Kerozine]

Because the term can refer to either centre-left or centre-right inclinations on economic matters. Both disagree with social conservatism.

 

[GhostWriter16]

Because the American-right is so dumb (not saying individuals on this forum who are right-leaning are just the general populace, many of them for example believe that Jesus cohabited the Earth with dinosaurs & that Sarah Palin was competent).

They were very rare at that time but they did exist.

A dictionary in the 1500's defined dragon (That age's word for dinosaur) as an extremely rare but still existing species.

You don't want to insult liberals, but just don't understand why anyone (or any significant number of people) would consider themselves liberals? And you don't want to discuss why one might consider one point of view to be better than the other?

You might want to tidy up that thought process, I'm not sure what you want people to debate...

My point isn't against liberals, but simply as to why the vast majority here are liberals, whereas in real life it is more equal. That is all.

Lets see how your political '5 deadly sins' stack up.

>are pro-big government: How is a large government bad? A large good government is better than a small bad government.
>pro-large welfare state: At least the tax money is going back into the system rather than into a Military-Industrial COmplex that most hope will never have to be used. Eisenhower warned us about the dangers of a MIC.
>pro-many government programs: And? Something good is better than nothing good. How are government programs bad?
>anti-Iraq war: Bush tricked the nation into an unessecary war and used up our (and Powels) PR points. BEsides, the footage he used of 'WMDs' all dated back to the First Gulf War.
>anti-Israel: I'm not anti-Israel. While I feel its creation was a bit shady, its here to stay. I just feel we shouldn't align ourselves so closely with Israel as they aren't as necesary to ME peace as removing Hamas/Hezbollah is.

So why are our 'liberal' policies actualy bad? Please back up your arguments.

EDIT: Madviking, minor point but in the French Rev the right weren't monarchists, they just felt he shouldn't be executed.

I didn't say that they were bad points (Though I disagreed with them) I simply asked why such a large majority here were liberals.

"Left" and "Right" =/= "Conservative" and "Liberal". Those terms do not compute with each other.

Left and right are terms dating back to the French Revolution. Leftists wanted to execute the king (initially, then things went to pot) and the rightists were the monarchists.

Liberal was a term created during the early 1800s describing people such as Adam Smith, Herbert Spencer, etc who supported Social Darwinism and Capitalism.

Just food for thought: I'm a "right-winger" but a liberal (no quotes needed). Shocking ain't it?

Please stop plastering labels.

Regards,
madviking

My point was still made.

Also Owen, forgot to quote you, but you said here you were a socialist, but you said somewhere else you are a social democrat. Acknowledging they are the same?

 

[madviking]

My point was still made.

Consider what you said: "Liberals are ... stupid" (oversimplification yes, but this is a chance for you to learn from your mistakes).

Consider what I said: "Liberals... such as Adam Smith".

Common consensus on Adam Smith is that he's the first "capitalist" (note: such a term was not around Smith's time).

Just some substitution...

"Adam Smith... is stupid"

------------------------------------------------

Ball's in your court.

 

[GhostWriter16]

Consider what you said: "Liberals are ... stupid" (oversimplification yes, but this is a chance for you to learn from your mistakes).

Consider what I said: "Liberals... such as Adam Smith".

Common consensus on Adam Smith is that he's the first "capitalist" (note: such a term was not around Smith's time).

Just some substitution...

"Adam Smith... is stupid"

------------------------------------------------

Ball's in your court.

I was talking about liberal in the American sense, aka: those who support much of the things that the democratic party does.

Also, if the forum was predominately republican, that wouldn't change the question. My point wasn't that there's anything wrong with their views, just shocking how their are so few on the political right.

 

[Zelig]

Check the political compass thread, there are lots of moderates and libertarians on here.

 

[madviking]

I was talking about liberal in the American sense, aka: those who support much of the things that the democratic party does.

Also, if the forum was predominately republican, that wouldn't change the question. My point wasn't that there's anything wrong with their views, just shocking how their are so few on the political right.

If you are going to debate this, I suggest using more accurate, descriptive terms. "Political right" tells me nothing. If anything, it tells me that you and I do not want to kill the king.

Useful terms include "free marketeers", "fiscally loose", "non-constitutionalists", "authoritarian rule", "collectivism", etc.

 

[scherbchen]

a) am European so I actually have a grasp of what constitutes a "left". our definitions are probably very different. hint: US Democrats aren't leftish as a rule. centrist at the best of times.
b) got an education. this is no jibe. I started out as a moron and then got some general sense knocked into me. I was your typical 14-year-old homophobe. met some gay guys and learned about what our people did to them.
c) moved to another country and learned about what others thought of us. now that is an eye-opener and made me rethink what I thought was true.

 

[GhostWriter16]

If you are going to debate this, I suggest using more accurate, descriptive terms. "Political right" tells me nothing. If anything, it tells me that you and I do not want to kill the king.

Useful terms include "free marketeers", "fiscally loose", "non-constitutionalists", "authoritarian rule", "collectivism", etc.

You live in Europe, maybe in Europe what you are saying makes sense. In the US, my statement makes sense.

Internet goers in general tend to be more lefty. This is because IN GENERAL, younger people lean to the left while older people lean to the right, and most of the tech-savvy, internet using, forum frequenting individuals tend to be young (15-25). Just look at the polls about age distribution on OT if you don't believe me.

And even the views of the "leftists" on this forum tend to differ wildly. There really isn't much of a thing as a "leftist" group, in the same way that there really isn't such a thing as "rightist". For example, I am a socialist who believes in democratic running of business, while other posters might be more pro-capitalist, but still deemed "lefty" because of their stance on social issues such as gay rights and abortion.

Again, you've said you are a social democrat and a socialist. Admitting their the same thing are we?

 

[Cheezy the Wiz]

You live in Europe, maybe in Europe what you are saying makes sense. In the US, my statement makes sense.

None of your statements make sense anywhere.

Again, you've said you are a social democrat and a socialist. Admitting their the same thing are we?

Aww crap Owen you exposed our secrets!

 

[Red Door]

None of your statements make sense anywhere.

Combine this with the fact madviking lives in Northern Virginia (which according to some people - Joe McCain, looking at you - is communist Europe).