LINES-World of Magic

[Kal'thzar]

An Idea

ok trade routes cost 3 eco points to create

first eco point you get after 3 turns (i.e. On the thrist turn)

second eco point you get after two turns (i.e. on the second turn or 5th overall)

thereafter 1 eco point a turn.

 

[TerrisH]

that sounds.. good. thouhg I personaly would up the first set to 4 instead. , rounding the total number of to 10. I'd vote for that, or the original version Kel sugested.

 

[Lord_Iggy]

TerrisH, this is how it will be if we change. It's similar to what Kal'Thzar said. If you, for example, start a trade route with Atlantis, it's medium distance so you'd pay 4 economy points over 4 turns. Then you'd gain an economy point every turn.

If that's what you want, vote for the change.

 

[Erik Mesoy]

I vote AGAINST superpowered trade, and seriously, the post quoted here should be considered a negative vote because of the irrationality shining out of it...

Counter: Gamebalance is boring, [snip]

Here's a shiny red button. Press it and it'll close your internet window, saying "YOU WIN!" in large shiny letters. No more game balance and everything becomes much easier. Now tell me what's boring...

For those who don't know what stat-bundling is it's when a successful warmonger kills two-three-five of his neighbors and absorbs anything between the damaged foundations to a complete and fully healthy vibgrant super-economy many times his own ecnomy and all he gets is +1 spending point. RGHHHH!!!" A

HHH my brian HJURGIFGHG
WER
TR
WET
GR

TH

DRH
g

Anyways we never argued realism; as Cleric said it would be hyperpowered trade with diminishing returns as economies grow but more as transportation improves. The thing is it would be really easy to manage and empires would rise and fall.

Uhh... you're being wierd, and nobody ever mentioned realism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verisimilitude
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_consistency

Internal consistency is distinct from realism.

Now will you kindly stop trying to break the system??

ok trade routes cost 3 eco points to create

first eco point you get after 3 turns (i.e. On the thrist turn)

second eco point you get after two turns (i.e. on the second turn or 5th overall)

thereafter 1 eco point a turn.

I'd support this idea, because IT MAKES SENSE. Trade routes become profitable without being instant payoffs and they require a reasonable investment.

Oh, and there should be a cap on the number of trade routes you can have, so nations can't be profitable off raw trade and nothing else. *cough*bronze age*cough*

 

[Disenfrancised]

An Idea

ok trade routes cost 3 eco points to create

first eco point you get after 3 turns (i.e. On the thrist turn)

second eco point you get after two turns (i.e. on the second turn or 5th overall)

thereafter 1 eco point a turn.

I'd also be happy with this. It will really favour peace however - not sure how I feel about that

 

[TerrisH]

An Idea

ok trade routes cost 3 eco points to create

first eco point you get after 3 turns (i.e. On the thrist turn)

second eco point you get after two turns (i.e. on the second turn or 5th overall)

thereafter 1 eco point a turn.

cool. I vote for this also then, brining the total number of votes for it to 4.

 

[Toteone]

Superpowered trade some way or another, not necessarily the ones I mentioned and I think we're winning Erik; so there. ;-) *blah*

okie dokexz now I'll answer your questions...

 

[Toteone]

First of all I uhm well I respect you, but I don't respect some of the arguments. Let's GO!

1) Tell you what, the irrationality shining out of it is SUCH a profound argument (you say it makes sense later); too bad the MoD doesn't carry negative votes.

2) Comparing my preferred style of game to an internet pop-up is not worth answering; suffice to say there are good games the way I suggested and they are not internet-pop ups; this question was prolly not worth my time.

3) Now if you had been part of GoobNES instead of w00sing out the first round cuz' you felt some random player said something slightly offish at you, you might know why I feel quite bad about stat-bundling. It makes my brain hurt literally, just a wee bit. Also the MoD just said something about upping the rates for conquest so I'm happy, maybe I should keep the uppity-talk level down.

4) Break the system, hmmm? There is no system. We can get closer to a perceived and partially factual holy grail of realism but we can never fully duplicate a game; I think you mentioned something about games being games earlier but I'm answering your post part by part and cutting it away to make my reply faster; it's a game and it's how we decide to make it that we play it; if the majority finds it a funny game and the MoD sanctions the changes then that's the way it's going to be.

5) Huh, you agree with me? What're we having the discussion about. If my ranting or slightly uneloquent arguments is mixed in with a good idea and it annoys you then just extract the core and ignore the rest. I'm not going to put half my online personality through a filter to please a few people. That said I guess it's a good thing to have a debate on stuff to uh make things better, go through arguments whatever.
But right 'ere I'm getting the feeling we're on the same line and it's slightly confusing after more then half a post of hammering at the argument for ... oh whatever maybe you were qouting someone else.
Yes I know I'm being messy right now, it's not a big deal to me.

6) Perhaps there should be a cap, but once again we have different kinds of magic producing different types of good, the magic trade in itself and normal trade supported by magic and so and so on. This isn't really a bronze-age society; there are far too many consistant and mighty empires around the world made up of a small amount of people. In In D&D there is a LOT of magic trade. We've got Penguins with a vibrant economy... I really think we humans would rock the boat with genuine imitation geomancy necro-dolls by now, even if they're made of stone.

7) I respect you for discussing with me and I promise not to take anything personal. That said I want to do something funny now that will no doubt annoy you and lead you to the dark side because annoyance leads to anger: 'Nyah, nyah we're winning the vote!!!!! HAHAHAHA!" Lol
's a joke, a cyber-poke of the real life joke ^_^

I think we're 5 to 6 votes vrs. 2-4 or something like it right now.

 

[Disenfrancised]

Oh, and there should be a cap on the number of trade routes you can have, so nations can't be profitable off raw trade and nothing else. *cough*bronze age*cough*

Maybe not a cap per say (which wouldn't make that much sense), but instead the econmony you get from trade in a turn can never be more than half your 'normal economy' to represent that you only have a finite amount of goods to sell/money to buy with after all.

For example:
A 'growing' econmony (+4) has 3 fully developed trade routes giving +3 a turn but this is reduced to +2 as thats all your econmony can support, but you can still have a spare trade route (incase one goes somehow ).

Rounding up or down at the mod's preference.

 

[Toteone]

Mages should add to that, they're a vital part of the economy bet. Hmmm or maybe those guys are just the battlemages and common&basic magic is part of the economy; nevermind then.

 

[Lord_Iggy]

Six votes for a long term profitable trade route.
2-3 votes for HYPERTRADE.
2 votes for the old system.

I think we almost have a majourity.

And about capping trade routes, I'll just start giving people with too much trade problems, like disease and decreased national unity because of all the foreign things they are presented with.

 

[The Strategos]

Now if we could just have a system where the number of infantry/archers/calvary that you could buy with one eco point was dependent on your population so that having a big population actually meant something...

 

[Lord_Iggy]

And Dis' idea sounds good too.

 

[Lord_Iggy]

I had an idea a while ago about how to make population relevant:

You need high population to increase economy (true in real life). I'd take population minus military, then minus a variable amount to represent teachers and entertainers and the like. The remainder is the working population, who determine your economy. On top of that, there's trade. But if we ever get around to changing the economy system, it won't be for at least a week. I'll change the trade system before doing ANYTHING about the economy. Don't wanna be too drastic.

 

[Toteone]

Oooh, that sounds like something I've been pottering on about now and then for a while Lord Iggy. Sounds good to me! Wohoo

 

[das]

When should we send orders?

 

[Toteone]

now doofus!! now! Lest ye be eaten by the giant man-shark that devours NESers alive!

 

[Erik Mesoy]

Short time; too much to answer; sorry.

I support Kalthzar's idea (post 661) and Disenfrancised's idea (post #669) as nice balancing factors.

Disenfrancised, write what you like, here's an idea for how Chaosiers can help on the voyage: Calm storms (which are chaotic, after all). There should be somewhere to put this chaos, so bringing spare handiwork (e.g. wooden cubes that Chaosiers can distort) is a good idea.

Copypasting some stuff you may want:

Spoiler Notes on the Elgovian military troops that are arriving :

Elgovian soldiers are relatively disorganized. As military units, they are bound by comradeship to an unusual extent, rather than direct subordination to a commander. They are an enthusiastic bunch of rabble, usually a bit more bright and thoughtful than most soldiers. They have no real uniform, rather they are required to wear the Elgovian seal and sigil at least three times on their clothes and it must be larger than an outstretched hand. Men outnumber women by about four to one.

A sample squadron of numbered soldiers and their equipment:
1: Leather chest padding, hide leggings, (wood) staff, throwing spears
2: Leather upper body padding, no leggings, (bronze) greatsword, throwing spears
3: Hide armor, hide leggings, longsword and shield, bow and arrows
4: Hide strips, no leggings, spear and longsword, throwing spears
5: Thick leather armor, leather leggings, staff, bow and arrows
6: Hide armor with bronze 'scales', no leggings, spear and shield, bow and arrows
7: Leather chest padding, leather leggings, greatsword, throwing spears
8: Hide armor with bronze bars, leather leggings, longsword and shield, bow and arrows
9: Hide strips, hide leggings, spear and shield, bow and arrows
10: Hide armor with bronze rings, hide leggings, spear and longsword, bow and arrows

^^STORY POST!^^

Read the construction story a while back to hear about the mages.

My orders are in, as everyone can see.

Gotta go. When's update?

Also, here's a map of how Elgovia currently views the world: (light blue line indicating one stubborn galley's exploration voyage to Hyperborea; they left before the last bit of diplomacy happened and wanted in on the great voyage. The others, as you know, took the more direct route.)

 

[Kozmos]

too tired to sned orders,back hurts walked for miles st00pid buses dont work,family visiting arrgh,will try o make an efort to snned ordes.if not send orders npc pliz.

thx sincirly Cleric *kolappses*

 

[Israelite9191]

I am changing my vote, I vote forthe curent system or only a slight modification.