A lib in each city would mean approximately 8 turns per core city, which would delay the declaration by this much. I think speed is essential here when we want tro stay up in speed with the big guys. Right now we shoudl be able to declare about 10-15 turns after my Set has ended, and probably need to churn oout a few more horses during the first 10 turns of the war. So getting Lit in 25 turns is mostly the same as getting Lit now. What we could do is get Construction, research Lit ourselves (The AI is very slow getting it) and then research Monarchy with the support fo Libs. But this would add another 10 turns to the point of Monarchy I think.
LK148 - WM, farewell to Greece
- Thread starter LKendter
- Start date
A lib in each city would mean approximately 8 turns per core city, which would delay the declaration by this much. I think speed is essential here when we want tro stay up in speed with the big guys. Right now we shoudl be able to declare about 10-15 turns after my Set has ended, and probably need to churn oout a few more horses during the first 10 turns of the war. So getting Lit in 25 turns is mostly the same as getting Lit now. What we could do is get Construction, research Lit ourselves (The AI is very slow getting it) and then research Monarchy with the support fo Libs. But this would add another 10 turns to the point of Monarchy I think.
We are on target for that one. I am pretty sure that Greebley can lead us into Hambug and maybe Nuremberg in his turnset already.
ARRRRRGH France got Poly the turn after we got Philo.
we are still up Construction to all and CoL to most., but I traded around Philo for the worlds money.
RIght now we are running min to Monarchy as max had the same effect.
We are holding at 7 Horses, 1.9 Cats and 3 Curraghs
we are still up Construction to all and CoL to most., but I traded around Philo for the worlds money.
RIght now we are running min to Monarchy as max had the same effect.
We are holding at 7 Horses, 1.9 Cats and 3 Curraghs
Spoiler :
Ok now I have time to add my thoughts about the situation:
Tech
As I wrote Max on Monarchy takes 50 turns so i Set it to min. Of course we can also go max on lit (23 turns) and wait for the AI to find Monarchy for us. We could also gift poly to everybody and hope somebody finds it fast, but we are talking emperor AIs here.
Army
My idea of an attacking army would be 10 Horsefor the SOD, 2 Cats+ 2 Hopl + 3 Horses in Pharsalos. Hamburg will be gone in the first turn so I would not see the need to defend Thermopylae in force. Additionally we should build a settler in Corinth to place a new city in the area of Hamburg (plus another 2hoplites). I would keep the hoplites as far as possible in the background, because Id rather lose an extra horse to a stray attacker that lose my golden age.
War Goals
I moved the first Cat to Pharsalos, believing that we want to go after germany first.
Do we want to eliminate them or only raze the three cities bordering Pharsalos, which might give us room for 2 more cities at current spacing. OF course we could also shift focus to Babylon which would mean tougher opposition. but we could buy in Russia and Persia for the immediate destruction of one civ. Unfortunately both of them are Scietifics, so we lose one trading partner for the era change, unless its a very fast war.
Libs
Once we can cash rush, we can actually rush a lib in all core cities in 1 turn, which is another reason to get Monarchy fast. (ok and get Lit too)
Tech
As I wrote Max on Monarchy takes 50 turns so i Set it to min. Of course we can also go max on lit (23 turns) and wait for the AI to find Monarchy for us. We could also gift poly to everybody and hope somebody finds it fast, but we are talking emperor AIs here.
Army
My idea of an attacking army would be 10 Horsefor the SOD, 2 Cats+ 2 Hopl + 3 Horses in Pharsalos. Hamburg will be gone in the first turn so I would not see the need to defend Thermopylae in force. Additionally we should build a settler in Corinth to place a new city in the area of Hamburg (plus another 2hoplites). I would keep the hoplites as far as possible in the background, because Id rather lose an extra horse to a stray attacker that lose my golden age.
War Goals
I moved the first Cat to Pharsalos, believing that we want to go after germany first.
Do we want to eliminate them or only raze the three cities bordering Pharsalos, which might give us room for 2 more cities at current spacing. OF course we could also shift focus to Babylon which would mean tougher opposition. but we could buy in Russia and Persia for the immediate destruction of one civ. Unfortunately both of them are Scietifics, so we lose one trading partner for the era change, unless its a very fast war.
Libs
Once we can cash rush, we can actually rush a lib in all core cities in 1 turn, which is another reason to get Monarchy fast. (ok and get Lit too)
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,617
750 BC (0)
I am happy to report that I got Civ Multitool to work, and the VP option is gone.
I can tell I'm to use to playing this at deity. It seems very odd to be the tech leader.
(IT) The Mongols complete the Oracle.
China completes the Great Lighthouse.
Russia completes Mausoleum of Maussollos.
710 BC (2)
(IT) Germany auto boots are exploring horse to Scandinavia.
690 BC (3)
We meet the clueless Zulu.
(IT) India builds Statue of Zeus.
Summary:
Sugar hill is building up the attack force. 8 horses, 3 cats are there. I freed up the horses on MP duty by building more warriors.
There is one settler in the stack. We should build a some more when holes appear from the war.
The Galley in Therm is to get across to America.
ROSTER:
LKendter
Todd Marshall (indefinite skip)
I've not heard anything from Todd, so jumping right to Greebley.
Greebley (up)
CKS (on deck)
Kulko (just played)
I am happy to report that I got Civ Multitool to work, and the VP option is gone.
I can tell I'm to use to playing this at deity. It seems very odd to be the tech leader.
(IT) The Mongols complete the Oracle.
China completes the Great Lighthouse.
Russia completes Mausoleum of Maussollos.
710 BC (2)
(IT) Germany auto boots are exploring horse to Scandinavia.
690 BC (3)
We meet the clueless Zulu.
(IT) India builds Statue of Zeus.
Summary:
Sugar hill is building up the attack force. 8 horses, 3 cats are there. I freed up the horses on MP duty by building more warriors.
There is one settler in the stack. We should build a some more when holes appear from the war.
The Galley in Therm is to get across to America.
ROSTER:
LKendter
Todd Marshall (indefinite skip)
I've not heard anything from Todd, so jumping right to Greebley.
Greebley (up)
CKS (on deck)
Kulko (just played)
Ok, I got it.
I am in the Northeast of the US which is getting hit by snow. It might take out the power lines, so if I vanish it may be I lost power. I will post when I finish or on Monday to say I am still working on it. I think though I can finish this weekend.
I am in the Northeast of the US which is getting hit by snow. It might take out the power lines, so if I vanish it may be I lost power. I will post when I finish or on Monday to say I am still working on it. I think though I can finish this weekend.
Preturn: Looks pretty good.
IBT: We are trespassing.
530 BC: We have a settler already, so I may try a gambit. There is iron which we might reach first if we try. Unfortunately, mountains block settling right next to it, but we could consider a colony arrangement or a temple. Swords would be nice to add to the mix so I will spend some resources towards this and build up some Warriors. Even if we don't own the square we could attack that way and gain it long enough to upgrade. There is open land though its a bit of a squeeze with the AI, its not bad (not within 2 of an AI city with is almost equivalent to declaring war).
IBT: Kicked out of Germany.
510 BC: Looks like France is going for the same site. Not sure we can win the race as their settler is close (but on mountains)
490 BC: No the settler is North bound.
470 BC: Settler is in place. Going to try to send our ship to North America. It needs to survive one turn.
IBT: Nope the ship sinks.
450 BC: Knossus founded. Looks like our chances are good on the Iron. France will need a big expansion to get it in their territory. Move workers onto the Mountain square we must road.
430 BC: Roading mountain. Using 3 Workers so 3 turns.
410 BC: Starting to move to attack Germany. Want to wait for Swords.
390 BC: Raised Lux to 30% due to bigger city size.
370 BC: Move Worker onto Iron. Build last round of Warrior.
IBT: Egypt demands Construction. I do NOT want to give that one up, and we will be strong with the swords next turn (and Everyone is broke, so I risk saying no and they Declare. They can't get to us fast enough to slow our German attack.
350 BC: Iron connected. We have 14 Sword and 14 Horsemen. We are ready to take Hamburg which we pressed up against.
Seems the AI have Construction so I may have made a mistake there. We can trade our remaining 304 gold, polytheism, and 6 gpt for Currency. This leaves us broke, so I trade around techs including Currency and gain back 664 gold and 1 gpt.
Our unit costs are high and we now have a sizable Army so I switch to some Markets and Aqueducts instead.
Notes:
We are ready for war next turn and can capture Hamburg in 2 turns. Knossus needs a sword or two. I would use the Hopolite for stack defense and move the Swords next to Hamburg. There will be a road under the stack near Hamburg if you would rather move on to Leibzig. I feel we are ready for our GA, but the Sword can go on the hills with defense 2 so they are not necessary if you want to delay it.
Egypt will send units, but we should be able to finish the Walls in 3 with Hopolites and a few swords, I think we will be ok. We may want a few more Sword or Horse though.
IBT: We are trespassing.
530 BC: We have a settler already, so I may try a gambit. There is iron which we might reach first if we try. Unfortunately, mountains block settling right next to it, but we could consider a colony arrangement or a temple. Swords would be nice to add to the mix so I will spend some resources towards this and build up some Warriors. Even if we don't own the square we could attack that way and gain it long enough to upgrade. There is open land though its a bit of a squeeze with the AI, its not bad (not within 2 of an AI city with is almost equivalent to declaring war).
IBT: Kicked out of Germany.
510 BC: Looks like France is going for the same site. Not sure we can win the race as their settler is close (but on mountains)
490 BC: No the settler is North bound.
470 BC: Settler is in place. Going to try to send our ship to North America. It needs to survive one turn.
IBT: Nope the ship sinks.
450 BC: Knossus founded. Looks like our chances are good on the Iron. France will need a big expansion to get it in their territory. Move workers onto the Mountain square we must road.
430 BC: Roading mountain. Using 3 Workers so 3 turns.
410 BC: Starting to move to attack Germany. Want to wait for Swords.
390 BC: Raised Lux to 30% due to bigger city size.
370 BC: Move Worker onto Iron. Build last round of Warrior.
IBT: Egypt demands Construction. I do NOT want to give that one up, and we will be strong with the swords next turn (and Everyone is broke, so I risk saying no and they Declare. They can't get to us fast enough to slow our German attack.
350 BC: Iron connected. We have 14 Sword and 14 Horsemen. We are ready to take Hamburg which we pressed up against.
Seems the AI have Construction so I may have made a mistake there. We can trade our remaining 304 gold, polytheism, and 6 gpt for Currency. This leaves us broke, so I trade around techs including Currency and gain back 664 gold and 1 gpt.
Our unit costs are high and we now have a sizable Army so I switch to some Markets and Aqueducts instead.
Notes:
We are ready for war next turn and can capture Hamburg in 2 turns. Knossus needs a sword or two. I would use the Hopolite for stack defense and move the Swords next to Hamburg. There will be a road under the stack near Hamburg if you would rather move on to Leibzig. I feel we are ready for our GA, but the Sword can go on the hills with defense 2 so they are not necessary if you want to delay it.
Egypt will send units, but we should be able to finish the Walls in 3 with Hopolites and a few swords, I think we will be ok. We may want a few more Sword or Horse though.
They were fast turns so I finished right away. The war turns for the next player will be a bit longer, but more fun. It turned out the end of my turn and the best time to start the war were the same, so we can dive in next turn vs Germany.
We are Average vs Egypt, but with Hopolites and Swords, I think we will outclass them The wall fortified Hopolites on a hill in Delphi will defend like 7 which should handle the attack 2 units that Egypt will likely have. A few Catapults could also help out so send two for pinging annoying units. We have strength to spare so sending a few more swords that way isn't a bad idea - 2-3 I would guess would be plenty (not needed yet though as Egypt has to get to us).
I forgot to mention the war happiness from Egypt was great. I went from 30% to 10% Lux, needing only one scientist to do so. This allowed us to have enough to buy Currency, so even some losses vs Egypt, we still come out ahead.
Note that we got some resources from Songhi for a tech, but I don't think that they will last past the German war so be careful about going to 0% lux since we may lose 2. I think you can check after the war - click on the center square to readjust???
Edit: 10 swords are in Thermoplae.
We are Average vs Egypt, but with Hopolites and Swords, I think we will outclass them The wall fortified Hopolites on a hill in Delphi will defend like 7 which should handle the attack 2 units that Egypt will likely have. A few Catapults could also help out so send two for pinging annoying units. We have strength to spare so sending a few more swords that way isn't a bad idea - 2-3 I would guess would be plenty (not needed yet though as Egypt has to get to us).
I forgot to mention the war happiness from Egypt was great. I went from 30% to 10% Lux, needing only one scientist to do so. This allowed us to have enough to buy Currency, so even some losses vs Egypt, we still come out ahead.
Note that we got some resources from Songhi for a tech, but I don't think that they will last past the German war so be careful about going to 0% lux since we may lose 2. I think you can check after the war - click on the center square to readjust???
Edit: 10 swords are in Thermoplae.
Puppeteer
Emperor
Beware the river when attacking Hamburg. Not sure 2 turns will do it with acceptable losses. (Is there a lurk/delurk tag or smiley? I thought I recall seeing that.)
Get well Todd Marshall!
Get well Todd Marshall!
Swords?
Hoplits near the frontline?
No Settler to resettle?
So after wasting 7 turns on the attack on germany we also want to waste our golden age too?
14 horses will have a 80% chance of taking Leipzig and Hamburg in one turn even when defended by 3 spears. We can then use the swords on marching for berlin while the horses heal.
Nice about the war happyness from egypt, but maybe we should sign Babylon into that war to keep them occupied?
Hoplits near the frontline?
No Settler to resettle?
So after wasting 7 turns on the attack on germany we also want to waste our golden age too?
14 horses will have a 80% chance of taking Leipzig and Hamburg in one turn even when defended by 3 spears. We can then use the swords on marching for berlin while the horses heal.
Nice about the war happyness from egypt, but maybe we should sign Babylon into that war to keep them occupied?
I never resettle - not worth the loss of population in our cities. I keep cities unless the AI is really dumb - settling on wheat for example. They will also have improvements.
I also think we are ready for the Golden age. Any war made that inevitable in any case. Actually with the def 2 swords we might avoid it a little while, but I doubt it. Seems a waste to try to avoid it and then fail. It seems best to minimize losses by using our high defense.
Different style of play I guess.
I also think we are ready for the Golden age. Any war made that inevitable in any case. Actually with the def 2 swords we might avoid it a little while, but I doubt it. Seems a waste to try to avoid it and then fail. It seems best to minimize losses by using our high defense.
Different style of play I guess.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
- Messages
- 19,617
If it is a resource we need - I replace it with our own cities. I refuse to risk a flip there. That French wine city (as an example) is a replace.
If the city is to choked by AI culture, I simply raze it.
Hamburg IMO is a raze because to many of our cities already overlap that area.
I like the idea of Babylon and Egypt at war. Get to of our close neighbors to burn units.
If the city is to choked by AI culture, I simply raze it.
Hamburg IMO is a raze because to many of our cities already overlap that area.
I like the idea of Babylon and Egypt at war. Get to of our close neighbors to burn units.
I think we are building a settler for that kind of thing now
I wanted to get the Warriors built before the iron connected so there wasn't opportunity for settlers before this.
I probably wouldn't move Hamburg if I was playing it alone, but it is a bit crowded there so I am fine with things like that.
Pulling in Babylon is kind of nice. We could keep the war happiness a long time that way.
I wanted to get the Warriors built before the iron connected so there wasn't opportunity for settlers before this.
I probably wouldn't move Hamburg if I was playing it alone, but it is a bit crowded there so I am fine with things like that.
Pulling in Babylon is kind of nice. We could keep the war happiness a long time that way.
I dont resettle very often too, but I assumed, that given the location of hamburg that we would need to resettle it one space N or NW. Especially after we put Knossos also in that area too.
Leipzig and Berlin fit nicely than, but they would open up space for another nice city on the baltics next to that deer. So that should be two settlers ready.
Also I would stop the german war after we conquered poland and east germany , as scandinavia is quite complicated to reach, especially as long as we use our galleys in the north sea for scouting (which is more important). But we can easily turn our forces westward from there and roll through the rest of germany and italy. This should give us a nice rounded core of 15 cities, which should be enough with the emperor AI.
Leipzig and Berlin fit nicely than, but they would open up space for another nice city on the baltics next to that deer. So that should be two settlers ready.
Also I would stop the german war after we conquered poland and east germany , as scandinavia is quite complicated to reach, especially as long as we use our galleys in the north sea for scouting (which is more important). But we can easily turn our forces westward from there and roll through the rest of germany and italy. This should give us a nice rounded core of 15 cities, which should be enough with the emperor AI.
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
I'm back home and should be able to play moving forward.
That is very good to hear.
ToddMarshall
Maniac - Stellar Wingman
That would actually be Lee's call, but I'm fine waiting my turn
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