Lone Wolf
Deity
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- Dec 4, 2006
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This actually makes sense, as opposed to your previous post.
Oh, and I always misread that title as "radical Islamist Winner".
Meanwhile in the Middle East: "Arab Spring can turn into radical Islamist Winter"
- Thread starter Winner
- Start date
Oh, and I always misread that title as "radical Islamist Winner".
RightIn a dense urban environment, where they can be ambushed and fired upon from practically every direction.
And of course, then the anti-Israel brigade would be crying here that Israel "occupies" Gaza again, since it has boots on the ground.
Well, we can't have our cake and eat it too, can we?
Seriously, the problem isn't occupation, it's more or less subjugation. Israel want's Palestine to continue to be their "vassal-state," pardon the EU3 reference.
Well, I'm OK with such stance, but you've previously expressed it in a way which, as far as I'm concerned, overshadowed and polluted its meaning.
Anyway, I don't claim these people of european descent were persecuted after the independance. Sometimes they actually were (in Libya they were simply expelled once Qadhdhafi assumed power, that counts as a persecution for me), but I really don't know about their conditions in other countries. Actually, I think it's a great material for a historical study. I must check into that, I'm sure something's been written in this subject.
I'm actually pro-palestinian (not because of some apriorical view, but because of knowledge of the actual situation) in the israeli-palestinian conflict. I try to be objective. I think the creation of Israel was a mistake, the treatment of Palestinians in 1948 and since was and outrage, that Israel is chiefly responsible for lack of peace etc. But sometimes it does get unfair treatment, because people assume that since it's wrong (as it is in most cases), it's wrong always. And sometimes it's not.
Winner
Diverse in Unity
Seriously, the problem isn't occupation, it's more or less subjugation. Israel want's Palestine to continue to be their "vassal-state," pardon the EU3 reference.
Being a vassal state of Israel is in Palestinian interest.
r16
not deity
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2008
- Messages
- 11,999
now that my country is to be big dark cloud in this winter thing here comes ther regular bellyaching .
those who follow my walls of rambling will know Mahir Kaynak as a guy who needs to retire . Well , he was on TV a couple of days ago , and doing famously well until he came to the part that stopped the show . Audiences hence TV channel managements like anything against the seperatists , tolerate goverment adulation , endure opposition adulation , but there are red lines . He said terrorists must be fought and the host closed the show early ... Poor Mr. Kaynak , looking on astounded doesn't become him .
this a day later after the guy who had Mr. Kaynak removed ( from a rather more famous State TV show ) was fabolous . Like when he said border outposts were passe in the age of unmanned aerial vehicles . Yes , people are already talking of evacuating and "Terrorists must be fought" !!? While everybody says so , it is the eyes that give away the fact that Mahir Kaynak actually means it .
they are not terrorists , they are lost sons and daughters who will come home when the deal is made under American supervision and bring in their warlike relatives across the borders . Making this country a Middle East empire and of course they will be balanced and countered by the "Sunni majority" that will be realized when we invade Syria . Ah yes , how sad that Mahir Kaynak still fails to see that his baby is long hijacked out of his hands with a twist , instead of Turkey becoming a magnet with being the only place where the Kurds are democratically respected , it is to invade Arab lands if it wants to be a democracy . This ain't the 20th Century , but ı had already posted that . It is becoming a familiar sight to see the originator of the concept falling short on the recent developments with his chin down and mouth agape . There is no place for Turks in this new age ! Not that we were any popular in the 1970s when he was kicked out of the intelligence service for writing all the pro-actual democracy stuff , but then the Red Army was so scary .
everybody frowns on the fight the terrorists language as it is a relic of the 1990s . It was bad and everybody warns against it coming back . Yet the only difference compared to recent events was that the exchange ratio back then favoured security forces , Kurdish conscripts , their village guard relatives and Kurdish+Turkish civilians against the seperatists . Even when one excludes the death squads . Aww yes , how horrible . We will have an empire , we can lose a few pawns in this mighty great chess game . We must actually , to rub down this bothersome Turkishness that serves nobody .
the empire is guaranteed by this new kind of war where one shoots newsreels instead of real bullets . Make believe nearly anti-Semitic shouting matches at which Iran now officially laughs at . Before they were laughing at the new policies even before they were discussed in Ankara , true , but that was unofficial and out of sight . Against the world we won a massive victory in the UN , where the PM's security detail crushed the UN staff in an UN official induced ruckus . We are the future , cause this is the world we live in , where facts on the ground and in the air as TV news do not have to match . We must follow the master plan and masters will give us some table scraps ; for those who find such prospects somehow debasing a further future is mentioned where we will stab the masters in the back . Which means those people who talked of driving it up America's behind with an independent Turkish foreign policy in Gazze are now talking of forgetting Filistin now that statehood proposal has made it into the Security Council . Repeat after me the good people of the new Turkey , if you can : Two-fortytwo ... What , silence ?
actually there is no silence , instead we are hearing that our feet must touch the ground between bouts of old pumpin up . One TV studio saw the diplomacy correspondent speaking with an American scholar to ask him whether it was true that the Obama Administration seriously wanted to make Israel a more responsible country and was behind Ankara , had actually driven the entire crisis hand in hand ? The answer was this was not something Washington would delegate to us . This scholar is accused to be in Turkish pay by the way . Two days afterwards in the same studio we again hear the Middle East will be de-Israelized , we are powerful enough to do it . But we must be careful not to enrage America where there are many nuts ; an organization even darker than the Illuminati was mentioned . That ı can't spell it must be proof enough that ı never heard of it . In any case ı am idiot stuck in a fairy tale about how the world is to be de-Turkified .
all of which surprise the democrats as they define themselves . ı have lots of time which ı waste on TV debates and this guy called some old guy to reach out the nationalistic streak that still remains . ı relearned Kurds were not a race difference but of language . Oh-kay , it is pressure on the seperatists time , ı grasp that easily . Yet the old guy started pummeling the Glorious First of March Vote , when in 2003 the National Assembly failed to accept American troops incountry for the invasion . Biggest defeat in Turkish diplomacy etc etc , traitors , extensions of the seperatist organization etc etc . Good thing ı wasn't around in the day , my posts of Ho Ho Hell no , We won't go would have been an headache right now . Democrats have been praising it the biggest thing in history ı must say with a certain amount of exaggeration . The host managed to get in some commercials and they returned to narrative later on with some talking of why we must invade Syria . They , the democrats , do not like it when they are not in 105% control .
not to take any seriously . Furtive language , a certain amount of luck and onetime local inventions colour people's perception of me and add gravity to my nonsense . The discomfort only arises when people see the remote chance that the boot might be somewhere else , if not on the other foot .
like the Journo that cursed me on the street , accusing me of a liasion with an internet persona . If ı ever could afford her aka 10,000£ a night , trust me , ı surely would find better things to do than pointless ranting in CFC . Would not believe this , considering he must have the moral high ground , spitting out the view some broad abroad is my wife ; would be something for this 40 year old single and what's it to him , he travelled all that way to say personally that ı am worthless ? And with that ? ı was the first person to say ı am worthless , am not ? Maybe because he was born to have the high ground .
the exact reason he must defend a collegue of his that accused another ( who doubted the policy vis a vis Syria ) as an accomplice to the murderous Assad family , because they were from the same sect . As indicated back in the times we were just out of the primordial soup , the Democrats in Turkey are now playing the sectarian divisions to belabour their opposition . The closet Jews lost so much of their weight , going on that tack would now hurt international standing , in the light of the dificulties with Israel . One or two percent of the reason ; even more pertinent , to claim they still survive would damage the invincibility mystique that covers the neo-Ittihadists .
the all conquering Israelis who fear only the new Turkey are very much alive though . The seperatist successes against the police have been explained by a collusion of elements in the Turkish Military and Intelligence ( jealous pigs and enemies of this country ) , terrorists ( as usual ) and the Israelis amongst us . The last is a paraphrased form of the Irish amongst us , an attack against the sports media , invented by the trainer of the national football team after a bad experience in Eire .
oh yeah , the police have arrived , they are now # 1 in Turkey . As such , "it" now happens to them and "it" comes as a shock to "their" experts . Told ya , they are still Turkish in the eyes of the guys , they are still of the demon seed . What all them guys think about all of us , the neo-Ittihadist survivors will learn in the concentration camps . Like the ones the Serbs had running back in 1990s where they gave proud tours to the world media . Doh , nobody believes me . Just like they will all refuse that the Third Balkan War will be fought in 2012 , as a centennary . In the Western capitals , once fully informed of the situation it averages about two hours to pour fuel onto fire or not , one road accident and a local kingpin in Bulgaria finds out he is not that scary and Bulgarians have a couple of things to say against the Roma and the even worse Turkish minorities .
wellcoming Bulgaria into the enemy camp , the neighbourly advice is that they should count on only on themselves . The Greeks plan on the open rebellion in the East , the rebels of the East plan on Greek Airforce and Navy slapping us so hard that we will die in heart-attacks of disbelief . Opening their airspace to the all conquering people from the South and Greeks will not make that much a difference to Bandırma and Balıkesir F-16s , apart from opening their airspace to Eskişehir Phantoms . Anyhow the people of the South trust on America to take up the slack . You know , that is why America will be broken first , to see whether the rest will measure up to the proverbial house of cards in any perceptible scale .
returning to Middle East and our woes , real compared to the wet dream above , Police has just began to realise that they are about to follow the Military to the trash can . Friendship with the West never pays ! [Smilie of choice] One wonders whether the Atlantic Breeze didn't ever study the Anglosaxon theory of allying with #2 anywhere against #1 and change horses as soon as the rankings change ? Yeah , the police experts will watch how their men are attacked and killed on UAV feeds . Just like the military did when Israeli made Heron "malfunctioned" , while the übersecret American stealth type was already there to film the procedings , to be served to pro-police TV channels later on .
the very ones who show this head of American intelligence in Congressional hearings with the sound so arranged that we hear only the part he says "The regime will prevail" but don't know which regime . Such a voice , did he ever consider acting ?
probably on Al-Jazeera police casualties will be , no-fly zone over Turkey ticks closer everyday . Until then , Americans even those who are actually good people , will avoid hearing the call not to send him to Ankara again .You know , that would mean actually agreeing he was involved .
yes , Americans refuse many things . There is even talk of sending armed Predators to defence of this country . For the interested , the idea to buy some dates to 1993 , even if they didn't exist back then . Anyhow the protracted affair kept going on , cause it is SOP in the Defence industry to ask for the best bribes which companies recover from bloated contracts .Plus , US wouldn't sell as US Lawmakers channel lots of contracts to their voters and supporters , who somehow turn out to be shareholders in this or that Israeli company .
though one must admire the local media in the frenzy they created over the mighty Predator , even this idiotic poster of yours truly would have seen it as a good thing that they were to be involved , until Americans or some smartie here came up with the idea of basing them in Incirlik , come April 2012 . If America wants to use drones to help , they can join in the action from Iraq , right now . "Terrorists are in their backyard , are they not ? " And how come the mighty Turkish made UAV coming online next year does not carry weapons ? Bribes not paid ? Why doesn't that mysterious unknown Turkish officer who leak stuff real enough to put 56 generals and admirals behind bars leak this too ?
police SWAT was to win the fight , now we hear it will be the border guards coming online in 2012 . Experts are wailing over the small radars that spot people moving around are not mobile but will be made so , surprisingly for me . Looking at their pictures in glossy magazines in my teens ı had wondered at the amazing backpack aspect . Well , what do ı know ? America gets promises , Europe gets assurances , seperatists slow down , their MPs will even take the oath to serve theTurkish constitution . Winter is upon us , yeah maybe there will be a relative peace . For a couple of months . As there has been for the past three decades . Meanwhile everybody warns against the 90s making a return . Oh sure , you know the bloody 90s ended with the dearest seperatist leader making tearful pleas in the courtroom that he was always ready to serve Turkey .
those who follow my walls of rambling will know Mahir Kaynak as a guy who needs to retire . Well , he was on TV a couple of days ago , and doing famously well until he came to the part that stopped the show . Audiences hence TV channel managements like anything against the seperatists , tolerate goverment adulation , endure opposition adulation , but there are red lines . He said terrorists must be fought and the host closed the show early ... Poor Mr. Kaynak , looking on astounded doesn't become him .
this a day later after the guy who had Mr. Kaynak removed ( from a rather more famous State TV show ) was fabolous . Like when he said border outposts were passe in the age of unmanned aerial vehicles . Yes , people are already talking of evacuating and "Terrorists must be fought" !!? While everybody says so , it is the eyes that give away the fact that Mahir Kaynak actually means it .
they are not terrorists , they are lost sons and daughters who will come home when the deal is made under American supervision and bring in their warlike relatives across the borders . Making this country a Middle East empire and of course they will be balanced and countered by the "Sunni majority" that will be realized when we invade Syria . Ah yes , how sad that Mahir Kaynak still fails to see that his baby is long hijacked out of his hands with a twist , instead of Turkey becoming a magnet with being the only place where the Kurds are democratically respected , it is to invade Arab lands if it wants to be a democracy . This ain't the 20th Century , but ı had already posted that . It is becoming a familiar sight to see the originator of the concept falling short on the recent developments with his chin down and mouth agape . There is no place for Turks in this new age ! Not that we were any popular in the 1970s when he was kicked out of the intelligence service for writing all the pro-actual democracy stuff , but then the Red Army was so scary .
everybody frowns on the fight the terrorists language as it is a relic of the 1990s . It was bad and everybody warns against it coming back . Yet the only difference compared to recent events was that the exchange ratio back then favoured security forces , Kurdish conscripts , their village guard relatives and Kurdish+Turkish civilians against the seperatists . Even when one excludes the death squads . Aww yes , how horrible . We will have an empire , we can lose a few pawns in this mighty great chess game . We must actually , to rub down this bothersome Turkishness that serves nobody .
the empire is guaranteed by this new kind of war where one shoots newsreels instead of real bullets . Make believe nearly anti-Semitic shouting matches at which Iran now officially laughs at . Before they were laughing at the new policies even before they were discussed in Ankara , true , but that was unofficial and out of sight . Against the world we won a massive victory in the UN , where the PM's security detail crushed the UN staff in an UN official induced ruckus . We are the future , cause this is the world we live in , where facts on the ground and in the air as TV news do not have to match . We must follow the master plan and masters will give us some table scraps ; for those who find such prospects somehow debasing a further future is mentioned where we will stab the masters in the back . Which means those people who talked of driving it up America's behind with an independent Turkish foreign policy in Gazze are now talking of forgetting Filistin now that statehood proposal has made it into the Security Council . Repeat after me the good people of the new Turkey , if you can : Two-fortytwo ... What , silence ?
actually there is no silence , instead we are hearing that our feet must touch the ground between bouts of old pumpin up . One TV studio saw the diplomacy correspondent speaking with an American scholar to ask him whether it was true that the Obama Administration seriously wanted to make Israel a more responsible country and was behind Ankara , had actually driven the entire crisis hand in hand ? The answer was this was not something Washington would delegate to us . This scholar is accused to be in Turkish pay by the way . Two days afterwards in the same studio we again hear the Middle East will be de-Israelized , we are powerful enough to do it . But we must be careful not to enrage America where there are many nuts ; an organization even darker than the Illuminati was mentioned . That ı can't spell it must be proof enough that ı never heard of it . In any case ı am idiot stuck in a fairy tale about how the world is to be de-Turkified .
all of which surprise the democrats as they define themselves . ı have lots of time which ı waste on TV debates and this guy called some old guy to reach out the nationalistic streak that still remains . ı relearned Kurds were not a race difference but of language . Oh-kay , it is pressure on the seperatists time , ı grasp that easily . Yet the old guy started pummeling the Glorious First of March Vote , when in 2003 the National Assembly failed to accept American troops incountry for the invasion . Biggest defeat in Turkish diplomacy etc etc , traitors , extensions of the seperatist organization etc etc . Good thing ı wasn't around in the day , my posts of Ho Ho Hell no , We won't go would have been an headache right now . Democrats have been praising it the biggest thing in history ı must say with a certain amount of exaggeration . The host managed to get in some commercials and they returned to narrative later on with some talking of why we must invade Syria . They , the democrats , do not like it when they are not in 105% control .
not to take any seriously . Furtive language , a certain amount of luck and onetime local inventions colour people's perception of me and add gravity to my nonsense . The discomfort only arises when people see the remote chance that the boot might be somewhere else , if not on the other foot .
like the Journo that cursed me on the street , accusing me of a liasion with an internet persona . If ı ever could afford her aka 10,000£ a night , trust me , ı surely would find better things to do than pointless ranting in CFC . Would not believe this , considering he must have the moral high ground , spitting out the view some broad abroad is my wife ; would be something for this 40 year old single and what's it to him , he travelled all that way to say personally that ı am worthless ? And with that ? ı was the first person to say ı am worthless , am not ? Maybe because he was born to have the high ground .
the exact reason he must defend a collegue of his that accused another ( who doubted the policy vis a vis Syria ) as an accomplice to the murderous Assad family , because they were from the same sect . As indicated back in the times we were just out of the primordial soup , the Democrats in Turkey are now playing the sectarian divisions to belabour their opposition . The closet Jews lost so much of their weight , going on that tack would now hurt international standing , in the light of the dificulties with Israel . One or two percent of the reason ; even more pertinent , to claim they still survive would damage the invincibility mystique that covers the neo-Ittihadists .
the all conquering Israelis who fear only the new Turkey are very much alive though . The seperatist successes against the police have been explained by a collusion of elements in the Turkish Military and Intelligence ( jealous pigs and enemies of this country ) , terrorists ( as usual ) and the Israelis amongst us . The last is a paraphrased form of the Irish amongst us , an attack against the sports media , invented by the trainer of the national football team after a bad experience in Eire .
oh yeah , the police have arrived , they are now # 1 in Turkey . As such , "it" now happens to them and "it" comes as a shock to "their" experts . Told ya , they are still Turkish in the eyes of the guys , they are still of the demon seed . What all them guys think about all of us , the neo-Ittihadist survivors will learn in the concentration camps . Like the ones the Serbs had running back in 1990s where they gave proud tours to the world media . Doh , nobody believes me . Just like they will all refuse that the Third Balkan War will be fought in 2012 , as a centennary . In the Western capitals , once fully informed of the situation it averages about two hours to pour fuel onto fire or not , one road accident and a local kingpin in Bulgaria finds out he is not that scary and Bulgarians have a couple of things to say against the Roma and the even worse Turkish minorities .
wellcoming Bulgaria into the enemy camp , the neighbourly advice is that they should count on only on themselves . The Greeks plan on the open rebellion in the East , the rebels of the East plan on Greek Airforce and Navy slapping us so hard that we will die in heart-attacks of disbelief . Opening their airspace to the all conquering people from the South and Greeks will not make that much a difference to Bandırma and Balıkesir F-16s , apart from opening their airspace to Eskişehir Phantoms . Anyhow the people of the South trust on America to take up the slack . You know , that is why America will be broken first , to see whether the rest will measure up to the proverbial house of cards in any perceptible scale .
returning to Middle East and our woes , real compared to the wet dream above , Police has just began to realise that they are about to follow the Military to the trash can . Friendship with the West never pays ! [Smilie of choice] One wonders whether the Atlantic Breeze didn't ever study the Anglosaxon theory of allying with #2 anywhere against #1 and change horses as soon as the rankings change ? Yeah , the police experts will watch how their men are attacked and killed on UAV feeds . Just like the military did when Israeli made Heron "malfunctioned" , while the übersecret American stealth type was already there to film the procedings , to be served to pro-police TV channels later on .
the very ones who show this head of American intelligence in Congressional hearings with the sound so arranged that we hear only the part he says "The regime will prevail" but don't know which regime . Such a voice , did he ever consider acting ?
probably on Al-Jazeera police casualties will be , no-fly zone over Turkey ticks closer everyday . Until then , Americans even those who are actually good people , will avoid hearing the call not to send him to Ankara again .You know , that would mean actually agreeing he was involved .
yes , Americans refuse many things . There is even talk of sending armed Predators to defence of this country . For the interested , the idea to buy some dates to 1993 , even if they didn't exist back then . Anyhow the protracted affair kept going on , cause it is SOP in the Defence industry to ask for the best bribes which companies recover from bloated contracts .Plus , US wouldn't sell as US Lawmakers channel lots of contracts to their voters and supporters , who somehow turn out to be shareholders in this or that Israeli company .
though one must admire the local media in the frenzy they created over the mighty Predator , even this idiotic poster of yours truly would have seen it as a good thing that they were to be involved , until Americans or some smartie here came up with the idea of basing them in Incirlik , come April 2012 . If America wants to use drones to help , they can join in the action from Iraq , right now . "Terrorists are in their backyard , are they not ? " And how come the mighty Turkish made UAV coming online next year does not carry weapons ? Bribes not paid ? Why doesn't that mysterious unknown Turkish officer who leak stuff real enough to put 56 generals and admirals behind bars leak this too ?
police SWAT was to win the fight , now we hear it will be the border guards coming online in 2012 . Experts are wailing over the small radars that spot people moving around are not mobile but will be made so , surprisingly for me . Looking at their pictures in glossy magazines in my teens ı had wondered at the amazing backpack aspect . Well , what do ı know ? America gets promises , Europe gets assurances , seperatists slow down , their MPs will even take the oath to serve theTurkish constitution . Winter is upon us , yeah maybe there will be a relative peace . For a couple of months . As there has been for the past three decades . Meanwhile everybody warns against the 90s making a return . Oh sure , you know the bloody 90s ended with the dearest seperatist leader making tearful pleas in the courtroom that he was always ready to serve Turkey .
Winner
Diverse in Unity
A friendly advice: short, concise, clear, non-metaphorical posts focusing on one topic at a time will probably elicit better responses than "what?" 
r16
not deity
- Joined
- Nov 10, 2008
- Messages
- 11,999
thanks for the advice , but it is a certainly huge collection of bitter experiences that induce a feeling of that there are no answers .
which ı forgot to say that the experience belong to people who count , am just a loser . Because if ı don't remind this people get ever more angry .
which ı forgot to say that the experience belong to people who count , am just a loser . Because if ı don't remind this people get ever more angry .
Silurian
Deity
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2010
- Messages
- 7,567
Winner
Diverse in Unity
Ah, the Copts. I read that they're leaving Egypt by the thousands now, afraid of what the future might bring. Judging from what happened to Christians in Iraq after it was "liberated" by the US, nothing good.
A lot of Iraqi Christians left for Iraqi Kurdistan which is more tolerant. I was surprised by the number of churches I saw there, and large conspicuous ones too. There's a whole Christian district in Erbil with lots of liquor stores and churches. I've heard most of them are trying to emigrate to other countries though, but maybe it has more to do with economic opportunities and the possible ability to claim refugee status.
Loppan Torkel
Deity
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- Feb 21, 2004
- Messages
- 4,756
Probably not. It's a too touchy subject that I doubt much will be done about it.
It seems that the Egyptian army massacred at least 26 Copts, who were protesting the destruction of one of their church.
As time passes, this Egyptian Revolution strikes me as poorer and poorer role model for other Arab nations.
I also wonder why such a high death toll of christians receives such little cover (if 26 palestinian protesters were killed in a single day, there would be no other topic on the global press). It seems that pundits, who were so eager to praise the glorious egyptian revolution, are very scared of admitting that things might go to hell.
As time passes, this Egyptian Revolution strikes me as poorer and poorer role model for other Arab nations.
I also wonder why such a high death toll of christians receives such little cover (if 26 palestinian protesters were killed in a single day, there would be no other topic on the global press). It seems that pundits, who were so eager to praise the glorious egyptian revolution, are very scared of admitting that things might go to hell.
Formaldehyde
Both Fair And Balanced
Ironically, it was the military who killed them in Egypt, not terrorists as it was in Iraq.
Loppan Torkel
Deity
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- Feb 21, 2004
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- 4,756
Where's the irony in it?
kochman
Deity
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- 10,818
That region of Iraq has long had a Christian presence, called Assyrians. They were already in Irbil, Kirkuk, etc... Baghdad... but are definitely leaving for greener pastures. Saddam actually provided them some level of protection.
Also see Lebanon for an example... it isn't going to go well for the Copts, I hope we will, as a nation, be as open toward granting them asylum as we are to granting asylum to non-Christians.
Hopefully Europe will absorb some too...
It's a pity.
And, yes, this is being done by the "military", in the new fundamentalist situation though. It is also being done by simple locals... religious hatred fuels this.
