I notice a very minor gaffe with the latest mined hill at Thebes; it would've been better to mine the riverside hill for the extra commerce point. Very minor of course, and I can't recall if the current hill had a forest on it, so if it didn't, no loss.
Thats right, it was the only other un forrested hill. I wanted to save our chops for settlers.
Good set S.ilver
Hmmm... I'm inclined to agree with you that the surrounding lands are rather bleak, where's all the food? I'm looking at the map and struggling to see where we could place cities, City placement isn't one of my strengths at the best of times throw in a nasty barren land scape and I'm a bit lost!
I can't believe Joao only had 1 archer in the capital, like you said... If only we had another chariot around. I'm not much of a Rush expert either but is Joao looking really weak? his power rating says he's equal to us but this could be becuase of other factors than units. Do we still have time to take him out?
I guess we could do with fishing after masonry to get that clam tile up in Heliopolis, thanks to thebes borders its workable before a border pop.
Also a quick look say that we could settle 1W of the oasis. Food poor but then where isn't? With 3 grassland farms we can work the grassland hill and the plains hill. Forget how much food an oasis is. Is it 3? If so then the ffod is odd and annoying.
Another option is to drop a city by that rice claiming horses and dyeas well. Either 1N of 1Nw of rice. One has fresh water and one has less lake tiles. To be honest I don't like these locations.
Next up could be 1NW of the wine. second ring claims the rice but with all that water and lots of plains tiles its not ever going to be much more than a blocking city.
I'll dot map later.
The other option is to expand via the sword. Joao is near so I suggest him. Hope he does settle 2. Saves us having a crap city to chop out of the jungle. When it stops being rubbish.... well thanks!
This land is screaming cottages at me.
Tech fishing and if mono is gon its time to consider Theo. We should start producing multiple GProth ASAP. Could waist them on small bulbs whilst teching whatever or settle surplus in the capital.
I think we need to decide if we're going to go for Joao or not before we invest in the mids. Last game showed that divinding hammers and time between conflicting approchs doesn't work!!!!
I think we need to decide if we're going to go for Joao or not before we invest in the mids. Last game showed that divinding hammers and time between conflicting approchs doesn't work!!!!
Hmmm... I think we need to decide this before the next set, rush Joao by chopping out some warchariots or chop out the mids while settling some of the cities metioned above.
I guess Joao could always wait abit but its a shame not to make use of our UU.
Actually, I like grandad's idea about settling the rice city. Except that I'd put it 1W of the rice, to allow the city to reach across the lake and work the 2 plains hills. This, along with 1N of the 1 tile lake near Thebes, would make decent use of the terrain, although not great.
1W of the oasis isn't a great spot due to all the dead terrain. We can irrigate from the oasis, but the site is fairly marginal. I'd rather settle the plains hill that gets the copper in the BFC, if we're going to go to the trouble of settling out there. Heck, I'd rather rush to try and beat Asoka to the wine and gold if that's the plan...
We're going to be pressed for specs since we lack food in a big way, other than at Thebes (and the rest is buried in jungle). Then again, the plan is to run priest specs to pop GPs to allow us to bulb a religion for our RE. Having them Rep enhanced would certainly help our prospects out.
I think a rush is out of the picture, as Joao acquired Bronze Working a few turns ago, and we'd need mass chariots anyways, as his capital is on a hill (site 2 is on a hill if he settles that too). We could pull it off, but we'd have to declare immediately and cut the bronze off in order to have any chance. If he puts a spear on a hill, it'll be too costly to remove. We'd also have to abandon expansion objectives in order to build enough troops.
As it stands, Memphis is not great, but can build our troops for us for the time being while we decide if we're going to pump settlers from Thebes, or push out the Mids. We have stone and an abundance of trees, so it should be fairly inexpensive. And we're not chasing some ridiculous wall this time around.
Settle rice first sounds like a good idea, thats the spot that has the most competition.
On the discussion of the copper city I quite like the idea of settling 1 East of the oasis, gives us upto 4 farmable grasslands plus the oasis for food and marble,copper and two hills for production. But whatever you think is best, as I've said before I find it tough to settle when the land is like this.
If you guys think a rush is out then its out, (I'm such a wussy builder in my own games don't know why I keep pushing for rushes in SG's)...
<rant>
ok ok, but... Remember what happened when we tried to take out Mehmed's hilltop cities pre catapults? 1500 years of catchup...
I've only been early rushing for the last year or so, but I continue to be impressed of how much a gamble it can be... very recently I started as Ramses next to Monty and had bronze within 6 tiles of my capital... he was on a small flat-land peninsula without metals and I blocked him in while building 8 axes for his capital... more than enough I tell myself as I look at more than 2:1 power ratio...
I show up and miss taking his city by two axes... dude was pumping out of archers due to his seafood and whipping prowess. It's always such a crapshoot, and I never have a pleasurable rush experience against hilltop cities.
BTW, chariots only get combat I... I think the city-raider promo or barrage is table stakes for taking most capital cities on prince or higher.
</rant>
I thought I could play last night but I ran out of time and now I'm not free till sunday evening. Of course in the unlikely event some one doesn't play by then I'm happy to take it.....
Executive Summary
Founded Elephantine, promoted our warrior to Woodsman III, met Fredrick, Joao builds on our site 2, researched masonry and fishing, pop'd a new source of gems, killed some things.
Timeline
T80 - Inherited
T81 - Thebes: Granary > Oblisk. Joao's settler is on site 2... MM Thebes to grow to happy cap. Start building the road to Heliopolis.
T82 - Joao settles site 2. Send the chariot near site 2 west for fogbusting and barb xp.
T83 - Thebes: Oblisk > Settler. Chariot wins vs barb on a hill, but our advance reveals a barb archer in the woods next to him... the chariot still has 4.xx strength, so he should survive.
T84 - Barb archer leaves the woods and our chariot now has 5xp.
T85 - Masonry > Fishing.
T86 - Memphis' border pops.
T87 - start a quarry on the stone. Our woody II warrior finds the other coast.
T88 - Wahoo, we pop gems next to Memphis! Worker starts farming corn near Memphis. I bump the slider to 70%.
T90 - Woody II spots the Khmer border, West of Asoka
T91 - Fishing > Writing... Woody II advances into the trees and finds a barb in open territory... he waits hoping for his next promotion...
T92 - Woody II wins and gets 1xp from the fight... he heals for a while.
T94 - Thebes: Settler > Barracks
T95 - Quarry finished
T96 - Heliopolis grows to size 2 and we whip Oblisk there... Elephantine founded starts an Oblisk...
T97 - Heliopolis: Oblisk > Workboat. Woody II kills another barb warrior while healing and happily promotes to woody III... he will heal a bit more and I suggest retiring him as he is now at 10xp. Start chopping the grass-tree near Heliopolis.
T98 - Thebes grows to size 4... Woody III meets Fredrick, who seems to know Iron Working...
T99 - Woody III starts home for retirement... marked some potential city sites.
Closing Remarks
Our warrior made it to Woody III and thus is a candidate for a GG if we so desire... I've found that Woody III + Medic I seems better than Medic III as long as you don't promote him beyond warrior... it's really annoying when the super-healer gets selected a stack defender.
Nice popping gems in mephis... we really needed an early commerce resource, now we have one! Good set GatlingGun, unfortunatly I'm unable to look at the save as I'm having severe computer malfunction at the moment...
My laptop has literally just died, damn thing is just blue screening on me. I'm currently trying to repair my windows insatll but it looks like I'm going to have to re-install my o/s, update and re-install my civ plus all the other bits and pieces I need. Hopefully that'll fix it and its not a hardware issue but I maybe out of pocket for a little while until I get it sorted. When my turn comes round I'll let you know what the situation is and whether I can play or not.
So I won't be able to check saves and such so my input will be low until I get this fixed.
Pre Flight, everything looks good. We have a nice chunk of land for ourselves, lots of production yet good areas for farms. I whipped the Granary in Memphis, only move I made.
Logging by BUG Mod 2.30 [Build 742] (BtS 3.13)
------------------------------------------------ Turn 99/750 (1525 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:05:59] The whip was applied in Memphis Memphis grows to size 2 Memphis finishes: Granary Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Tokugawa(Japan), from 'Cautious' to 'Annoyed' Attitude Change: Asoka(India) towards Suryavarman II(Khmer), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'
Kinda got stupid here, started a Settler in Thebes instead of the GW. It worked out though.
Turn 102/750 (1450 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:16:33] A Fishing Boats was built near Heliopolis Tech learned: Writing
Writing comes in, and I didnt want to check our thread for our suggested tech line, heh. I decided to go Maths, so we could get more money for our chops. A lot of our cities are packed with forests, so we should get value for the tech.
Turn 103/750 (1425 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:19:09] Thebes begins: The Great Wall (8 turns) Research begun: Mathematics (23 Turns) State Religion Change: Asoka(India) from 'Confucianism' to 'Buddhism' State Religion Change: Frederick(Germany) from 'no State Religion' to 'Buddhism' Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Frederick(Germany), from 'Pleased' to 'Cautious'
Turn 104/750 (1400 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:20:50] Thebes grows to size 5 Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards The Mummy Strikes Back(Egypt), from 'Cautious' to 'Pleased' Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Suryavarman II(Khmer), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'
Turn 105/750 (1375 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:22:12] Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards The Mummy Strikes Back(Egypt), from 'Pleased' to 'Cautious' Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Suryavarman II(Khmer), from 'Cautious' to 'Annoyed'
OK after a few turns on the GW, nearing the happy cap, I stick the settler back in front, for a 2-pop whip.
Turn 107/750 (1325 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:24:42] While attacking, War Chariot decimates Barbarian Warrior (Prob Victory: 100.0%) While attacking in the wild near Tokyo, War Chariot (5.00/5) defeats Barbarian Warrior (Prob Victory: 100.0%)
A Cottage was built near Heliopolis
OK, my big move of this set, I built a cottage in our Stone City! UGH! What a waste of worker turns, my bad. I re-started a farm in this spot, it will finish shortly into the next round.
Turn 108/750 (1300 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:25:39] While attacking, War Chariot decimates Barbarian Spearman (Prob Victory: 100.0%) While attacking in the wild near Elephantine, War Chariot (5.00/5) defeats Barbarian Spearman (Prob Victory: 100.0%) Memphis finishes: Worker Heliopolis grows to size 2
Scarfing up all the free Barb XP I can get. I also found a wounded spearman, so I killed him too.
Getting Libraries started, our tech rate is going into the basement. We should be ok though.
Turn 110/750 (1250 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:27:27] The whip was applied in Thebes Thebes finishes: Settler Whip anger has decreased in Heliopolis
Sweet, 2-pop whip on the settler, and sent him to the Marble-Copper site. The Oasis will provide fresh water for farms, that city will be VERY strong. The overflow brought the GW within a turn as well.
Spoiler:
Turn 111/750 (1225 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:28:01] Thebes finishes: The Great Wall Heliopolis's borders expand
I decide to start the Mids right away. I was planning to pre-chop a few forests, and then pop em all off when Maths finished, but now I am not so sure on that plan. If we want to try it, cool, we should mark the forests we pre-chop, and even get our Library up in Thebes before then, to help finish off teching Maths. Its a trick I use in my own games, especially with an IND leader into a Wonder with the resource. Its incredible how many extra hammers you get from Maths in that situation.
Turn 112/750 (1200 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:28:28] Thebes begins: The Pyramids (38 turns) Elephantine grows to size 2 Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Tokugawa(Japan), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'
Turn 113/750 (1175 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:29:34] The whip was applied in Elephantine Thebes grows to size 4 Elephantine finishes: Obelisk Whip anger has decreased in Memphis Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Tokugawa(Japan), from 'Cautious' to 'Annoyed'
Whip the Obelisk in Ele, and founded the Copper-Marble city. I am liking this game so far.
Turn 114/750 (1150 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:31:25] Elephantine begins: Granary (90 turns) A Farm was built near Elephantine Alexandria founded Alexandria begins: Obelisk (45 turns) While attacking, War Chariot decimates Barbarian Spearman (Prob Victory: 85.5%) While attacking in Barbarian territory at Libyan, War Chariot (2.70/5) defeats Barbarian Spearman (Prob Victory: 85.5%)
Turn 118/750 (1050 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:37:34] While attacking, War Chariot decimates Barbarian Axeman (Prob Victory: 90.2%) While attacking in Egyptian territory at Alexandria, War Chariot (4.20/5) defeats Barbarian Axeman (Prob Victory: 90.2%)
Axeman roaming around, so he gets whacked.
Turn 119/750 (1025 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:38:20] War Chariot promoted: Combat I Thebes grows to size 5 Memphis grows to size 4 Heliopolis grows to size 3 While attacking in the wild near Alexandria, War Chariot (4.00/5) defeats Barbarian Spearman (Prob Victory: 12.7%) Attitude Change: Mansa Musa(Mali) towards Tokugawa(Japan), from 'Annoyed' to 'Cautious'
Turn 120/750 (1000 BC) [13-Oct-2008 11:40:00]
Thats the end of my set. I think we are in great shape here. There are a couple barb cities to take out. I think we should go ahead and raze them both and re-plant them where we want too. I noted a couple spots by the Western barb city we should consider. One trick here, have the settler RIGHT THERE before you raze the city, or one of the AIs will scarf up that spot. We can grab the Gold, Silver, Wine, and 3rd-border-pop the Fur with 2 well-placed cities. Here some screenies of our empire.
Spoiler:
Theres that nasty Cottage, heh.
There is the Gold-Silver area.
Good shape indeed. We need IW soon, maybe right after Maths. Mansa has Alphabet, but we dont have any techs he wants. Mids and Marble means we should also go for the Great Library.
Workers are needed as well, I kicked out 1 more, but we could use at least 2 more ASAP.
The roster:
GatlingGun
Bleys <-- Just Played Groogaroo up now if he can!
Krick19 <--- On Deck, be ready though, Groo has computer problems
S.ilver
grandad1982
Okay my computer problems are slowley sorting themselves out, managed to get windows xp to start so I could back up my files but I need to do a complete clean re-install so I won't be able to play for another couple of days while I sort this out. Not sure what happened, my laptop is normally pretty robust, I think it got stuck in a corrupted hibernate mode or something.
Any chance of a swap with Krick? and then I'll be able to play next.
Back at a PC again after a long drought. Don't let my girlfriend hear me say that........
Nicely moved along guys.
I agree about IW being next. Without it Mephis can't expand much.
Anyone think Joao for a medival war?
Also could be time to start on the GProth. Unless we want to ditch the idea of founding a religion and building the AP. We could take it off of whoever builds it if there near enouth.
Can't belive how weak Asoka is. Expect a dog pile IMO.
Usually when you see an AI fall behind in power like that, it's because they are wonder-building... so perhaps we could prepare a wonder-welcoming party for him
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I keep trying to forget about that!
move of this set, I built a cottage in our Stone City! UGH! What a waste of worker turns, my bad. I re-started a farm in this spot, it will finish shortly into the next round. 
