IMHO, I believe you should settle the stone, then use that as a staging point for a war against Ramesses. Taking his two Holy Cities should prove financial beneficial later on once you build the religions' UB and you spread it adequately.
I'm not sure about settling the stone spot and rushing from there. That was my initial thought too, but if Memphis gets a border pop first (which is likely) you basically have one farmed FP for food (eventually 2 with border pop?), not many forests, and no hills for production. It wouldn't be much help for getting out rush units. I would be leaning towards the fish+deer spot first, and maybe consider the stone spot for a 4th city if it's still available.
I would like to hear other opinions. Choosing where and how many cities to build before a rush is important and something i could still learn a bit about from the experts.
^ True, I didnt fully consider the fact that Memphis is a Holy City and will border pop soon. Depending on how long ago Judaism was founded, (Guessing not too long ago) You are probably right about getting the deer+fish. With those food resources he can grow quick and whip out some HA.
The region in entirety is not very good for hammers, but those food sources can help in whipping.
^ True, I didnt fully consider the fact that Memphis is a Holy City and will border pop soon. Depending on how long ago Judaism was founded, (Guessing not too long ago) You are probably right about getting the deer+fish. With those food resources he can grow quick and whip out some HA.
The region in entirety is not very good for hammers, but those food sources can help in whipping.
Memphis being a holy city is a non-issue as Ramesses is already in another religion (so no culture from that). Regardless it is likely that that it will pop faster because it has been settled earlier.
Haven't read anything except the first post, thought I would try it out, maybe post 25 (then ? 50, ? 100 turn saves/screen shots). This map is one solid level above me, so might get ROLFstomped, but will learn.
Opening:
--I didn't settle in place, and this is probably the first Civ IV I have moved the settler. Went NW.
--Decided to get agriculture for working the wheat and corn.
--When you have clams/fish and start with fishing, what do you guys think about starting with a worker boat? Had I realized Greece started with fishing I might have done that, but by time I realized (two turns in) I just kept on going with worker.
Spoiler:
3560
Met Ramsses.
He's tooling around exploring with an archer, and so he could wipe out my city...I'm still working on worker...defenseless.
He's also got 2 gold and a sheep in the NE part of his BFC. Meanwhile I've go no land and am sandwiched between tundra and desert.
Next tech? Well, looks like from above our only hope is early war on Egypt. If he gets war chariots we are probably hurting. Unfortunately, I chose BW first figuring that could help me chop. But we really need to know where the horses are.
Religion. No surprise, Buddhism 3240 and its Ramsses. Hinduism 3160.
That's the end of 25 turns.
--Warrior about to finish. ? WB next then settler.
--Dot map. Not much room at all. I made a pink dot Hail Mary city (like in RB1 Cuban Isolationists)...doubt I can get it. But there is no where else to go except "Go West young men." Even if I do, there's going to be culture pressure big time from Egypt.
--Need horse or bronze and have to hit Egypt, otherwise we are totally hemmed in.
Good exploration! The planned city spots are nice. There is a nice tundra spot worth settling with deer and fish on the north.
Worker first is good here because it can improve 2 food tiles (corn+wheat) compared to a workboat that can improve only one (and that is only 4 compared to 5 dry corn). And it can chop out two workboats later. If you find coppper nearby, don't build all these spots, just the most productive ones, build/whip/chop some axes and get rid of Ramesses
If there is no copper, go for AH to improve the cow and check horses.
I've also played a shadow, got up to 375bc (T100).
Spoiler:
I settled I N as was initial inclination on seeing the 4000bc screenshot. Second city grabbed cow and wheat, 3rd city for deer and fur. I followed ben-jammin's advice on mounted warfare posted in RLC1 and went to war with egypt c 1800bc after my first chariot. Nabbed 3 workers, pillaged everything, eventually got to HbR about 700bc and I've just annihiliated Egypt. The economy is a bit of a mess, there's a huge amount of land with Gilly way down south so it might be interesting. In my shadow Gilly founded Judaism, maybe we can become friends eventually.
Is the tile 1E of the cows a plains hill or a grass hill? If it's a grass hill i would definitely settle that 2nd city 1S of the hill rather than on it. There's limited production in this start, and there's really no inherent benefit to settling on a grass hill.
If it's a plains hill you could probably make a case for either.
I settle nw also from seeing the screenshot. Ramzy convert to Bhuddism and went on a mission frenzy as I expected. He also got Giggles to convert. Notice that I had horses, I had to attack Ramzy while I had the opportunity. So I build the oracle and got horseback riding (could use it for better things but I want to kill Ramzy quickly. So I took over the holy city and everything else. Now I have 14 cities and Giggles had the whole jungle land down south. The war with Ramzy hurt my research and economy a bit but I was able to get back from my GS (thanks to philosophica trait). Now I'm researching Gunpowder and going for Calvary Rush, but I got bored save and quit.
I did not finish the game as I got bored. Anyway if u like some screenshots or game save, let me know.
Is the tile 1E of the cows a plains hill or a grass hill? If it's a grass hill i would definitely settle that 2nd city 1S of the hill rather than on it. There's limited production in this start, and there's really no inherent benefit to settling on a grass hill.
If it's a plains hill you could probably make a case for either.
1E is a grass hill
1NE is a plains hill
I was trying to give that blue dot city freshwater and hills defense. I need to scout north tip to see where I can jam a city up there. Going to be tricky and a fight soon.
Fresh water is good, but i was thinking since you already have access to 2 grains (and probably a third soon) you shouldn't have health problems in that city for quite a long time. I would probably opt for the extra production since that will help you more with the war effort.
Built worker, then WB, then warrior, then three settlers...but first one not out until Ramesses stole my prime city spot. I could have done settler before WB, but this strategy has allowed me to build Athens to happy cap (a paltry one though) and kick out three settlers in rapid fashion.
Tech: BW -- no copper nearby. Then AH -- no horses nearby. The nearest copper is SW of Egypt and the horses SSW. I can try for a hail mary city that way but I wouldn't be able to get the resources back to the capital. What now?
Clearly we need to rush Ramesses because we are totally boxed in, but with what?
Without copper or horses and Memphis being on a hill that's a tough spot to be in. What about getting a settler on a boat or by land South of Memphis? His land and cities look pretty good and fighting now might not be the best way to expand.
It would really need to be Horse Archers, and you might want to get a chariot or two out to go suppress him and try to prevent him from hooking up metal.
Thanks for looking at the map
haven't done a HA rush (just downloaded the guide)
but it seems I need horses...which means a city the other side of Memphis. This means it won't be a rush....
Should I just beeline cats and hit then?
/slaps forehead
//that's only a spoiler if you missed the obvious like I did. Guess I shouldn't play when tired. Thanks Ghpstage
still, might be an interesting variant to try this after not hooking up horses. it seems the map generator rarely maroons you without starting resources. Is there a check for this in map generation?
/slaps forehead
//that's only a spoiler if you missed the obvious like I did. Guess I shouldn't play when tired. Thanks Ghpstage
still, might be an interesting variant to try this after not hooking up horses. it seems the map generator rarely maroons you without starting resources. Is there a check for this in map generation?
It doesn't check to make sure there's a strategic resource nearby (unless you turn on Balanced Resources), but it does guarantee a certain quality of capital, which means your capital BFC always gets some good tiles. Not sure what you meant by "starting resources."
Got HBR turn 97.
I have 10 chariots ready to go and 4 cities. Ramesses has a great merchant coming my way. At first I thought "maybe I should kill it" to deprive him of the money, but if I capture Memphis (that's a big if) I would get the proceeds. I don't have any intel on their capital, but going to attack that first because Memphis is on a hill.
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compared to 5
