New Version - June 2nd (6-2)
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tu_79
Deity
So, in next iteration we're dropping the penalty to city size? Somewhat, it is included in the efficiency drop of bigger cities, but so it is the technology penalty, which is included in the world median.
Unless the tech modifier is needed to make up for the flat reduction buildings that come with technology.
Unless the tech modifier is needed to make up for the flat reduction buildings that come with technology.
Rekk
Deity
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There is no explicit city size modifier. The counter balance is already worked into yields/
.The technology modifier also counterbalances the increasing number of happiness sources a civ has at its disposal, in addition to unhappiness reduction, as the game continues.
I believe there was but G just removed it (which was a good call).There is no explicit city size modifier. The counter balance is already worked into yields/
I'm curious how people feel about the number of city modifier. More cities already means more unhappiness, via having more cities. Does that second layer of unhappiness for wide improve the system?
Revolutionist_8
King
There was an independent City-size modifier, and I agree its removel makes sense cuz it'd be a duplicate.
It's fine. There must counterbalances for over-expansion / conquerors / etc. And it's not like its effect is that massive. I really like it!
@Stalker0 reported this as well. I don't have much time playing atm unfortunately, last time I saw something similiar was my lvl 1 Spy in a big Indian city with 5-600 Turns, but I didn't pay much attention as that city must had Constabularies etc.
Yep I mentioned it myself. I've seen 100, 200 turns in the very early stages of the game (aka no constabulary), trying to spy on 5 star cities.
CrazyG, I think it was you who mentioned the notion of 10,000 small pop cities being possible with the current system. I do think that wide needs that escalating counterbalance (curbing heavy expansion is one of the primary goals of the happiness system that I think we all can agree with). To what extend is obviously a key question in our testing.
I phrased my post poorly. I agree with this entirely, but I'm not sure that city modifier does a very good job of curbing heavy expansion. Like, maybe it should be bigger or a similar mechanic added. A 28% needs modifier isn't slowing down my Carthage/China early game city spam.
If you have a spy you can see what buildings the city has and check for a constabulary. Either way, 500 turns is too much, right? My games don't ever reach turn 500.
Revolutionist_8
King
That is indeed seem to be true for me as well, I agree absolutely! An increase would be welcomed I think
Yeah I just didn't bother to check, but it seems to be too much kinda yeah. Especially that it was 4 or something-ish City. Dunno to be honest
I'm not the only one then, something is currently wrong with this system. +60 turns stealing from a five star city, with a lvl 3 spy - early game just isn't as it used to be. I can't trust my spys to steal anything as it is...
Omen of Peace
Prince
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I believe the Empire modifier was +8% per city in April or so (+4% per puppet), and the feedback was that wide was having happiness so it was lowered to the current +4%.
I haven't played the latest beta much, but keep the feedback coming!
I'm not sure the 8 vs 4 an apple-to-apples comparison (many other changes happened in parallel), but it could still be an indication that 5 to 7% is better to curb expansion.
I haven't played the latest beta much, but keep the feedback coming!
I'm not sure the 8 vs 4 an apple-to-apples comparison (many other changes happened in parallel), but it could still be an indication that 5 to 7% is better to curb expansion.
Enrico Swagolo
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The Unhappiness seems very heavily overtuned. Most of my warmongering cities have as much unhappiness as they have pop in renaissance and if they don't (because I clicked avoid growth everywhere), I see something like "growth +4 Distress, +2 Poverty". Most of the AI's I've fought against had a heavy unhappiness penalty.
chicorbeef
Emperor
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Carthage I get, but how are you managing China's growth early on? Do you actively try to not grow in spite of the bonus
?AndreyK
King
My spies don't get upgraded, I have incited coup in city-state, stole money from AI, assassinated Great Person and no upgrade. Just in version before (March or April) everything worked fine. Any ideas?
Txurce
Deity
Mine upgrade.
amateurgamer88
Emperor
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After playing a bit on Marathon up to Industrial Era, I noticed a few things that were weird. Now, it has been a few patches since I last played on Marathon so some of these issues may have came up from one of the older patches. However, I was curious if the new 200% scaler had an impact.
First thing I noticed was the amount of influence you get from CS quests. The amount of influence was like three times as much as what I was used to. In the past, I clear a barbarian camp and, if I'm lucky, I get a few turns of being friends with the CS that gives the quest. Now, I get a few turns being allied with the CS. In addition, I get at least 30 turns of alliance with CS if I complete certain quests like connect Horses, Iron or Luxury. This really throws off the balance since, with the right quests, you can get snowball quite quickly. For example, I got two "Find this Civ" quests where I can get 96 and 72 influence respectively. The benefits I get from those alliances can be very good if they are Religious or Cultural as those yields are worth a lot more that early in the game. Since I lose 1 influence per turn, I get 36 turns and 12 turns of alliance with CS very early in the game.
Another thing I noticed was the Tourism, specifically the Tourism from TR. Was anything changed for TR Tourism? For this exact game, I noticed that, during Industrial Era, I get around 60 Tourism for completing a TR with a CS and that seems surprisingly low. I was wondering if the recent scaler had an impact on that as well. The TR do seem to take 3 times as long to finish but the TR Tourism is so insignificant that I wonder if CV is achievable anymore.
The two things I noticed above are probably the biggest things I've noticed.
First thing I noticed was the amount of influence you get from CS quests. The amount of influence was like three times as much as what I was used to. In the past, I clear a barbarian camp and, if I'm lucky, I get a few turns of being friends with the CS that gives the quest. Now, I get a few turns being allied with the CS. In addition, I get at least 30 turns of alliance with CS if I complete certain quests like connect Horses, Iron or Luxury. This really throws off the balance since, with the right quests, you can get snowball quite quickly. For example, I got two "Find this Civ" quests where I can get 96 and 72 influence respectively. The benefits I get from those alliances can be very good if they are Religious or Cultural as those yields are worth a lot more that early in the game. Since I lose 1 influence per turn, I get 36 turns and 12 turns of alliance with CS very early in the game.
Another thing I noticed was the Tourism, specifically the Tourism from TR. Was anything changed for TR Tourism? For this exact game, I noticed that, during Industrial Era, I get around 60 Tourism for completing a TR with a CS and that seems surprisingly low. I was wondering if the recent scaler had an impact on that as well. The TR do seem to take 3 times as long to finish but the TR Tourism is so insignificant that I wonder if CV is achievable anymore.
The two things I noticed above are probably the biggest things I've noticed.
BiteInTheMark
Deity
Don't forget you are at marathon, so it is basically only 12 and 4 turns being their ally and only 10 turns their friends. That isn't that much.
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