That was the case in Germany until recently (1999). You needed to have Ar...German blood.Renata said:@ Little Raven -- In a lot of countries, it isn't enough to be born there to be a citizen.

That was the case in Germany until recently (1999). You needed to have Ar...German blood.Renata said:@ Little Raven -- In a lot of countries, it isn't enough to be born there to be a citizen.
Masquerouge said:Nonsense. First, it is not the Muslims of France who are torching cars. 99% of French Muslims are law-abiding citizens who want nothing to do with the riots.
Second, what you call the headscarf law is accepted and enforced by 99% of the French Muslims. Only a handful of heavily mediated cases posed problems, and now it is no longer an issue in France.
Third, people torching the cars are first of all, and before everything else, youg people turned thugs by poverty and living in ghettos. They are using the islamic rethoric to look important and cool, but anyone just slighty aware of what Islam is about knows it is not about torching cars. And not all rioters are Muslim, far from it.
So your comment shows a poor understanding of Islam, the French society, and the riots.
Well, we have less patriotism and a more laissez-faire attitude in Europe. Though I am also surprised that there are no acts of retalliation, as there were in the Netherlands where a few islamic school and mosques were torched after the jihad-inspired murder of Theo van Gogh.Speedo said:What amazes me (without having read the thread) is that the French/europeans seem... pretty tolerant of all of this.
I can tell you that if those kinds of thing happened around here and the gov't refused to do anything (unlikely, that's why we have the National Guard), it would only be a night or two before the little sh*ts were met by a group of good 'ol boys who would be more than willing to draw a line in the sand and dare them to cross it.
In France, anyone born in the country is French... and this since the French revolution in 1789.
It's only in case you're born in a foreign country but you've raised in France that you have to make a demand in order to get the French nationality. However, that's very easy.
sonorakitch said:To all who disagree with me, why don't you get off Civfanatics and read the news:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/09/AR2005110901177_pf.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4395934.stm
http://www.altmuslim.com/perm.php?id=1580_0_26_0_M
These riots have everything to do with Islam. It is you Masquerouge who demonstrates a lack of understanding concerning Islam and the world.
~Chris
France's riots have set off a round of troubled debate across the Arab world: Most here blame a failure to offer opportunity to immigrants, but others see a more ominous clash of cultures over Islam
Most attribute the flare-ups to social injustice and high unemployment, rather than anti-Islamic discrimination or a wider culture clash. They have urged the French government _ and the Western world at large _ to take concrete steps to rectify the problem.
"There are no puzzles here. The core problem is mass degradation and alienation manifesting themselves in ... belts of educated, usually unemployed, young men throughout Arab and Asian urban areas; and in parallel urban zones of mass disenfranchisement and marginalization," said Rami Khouri, writing Wednesday in the Lebanon Daily Star.
But Iran has taken a more provocative slant, blaming anti-Islamic sentiment that it contends is widespread across Europe.
The deep problem is the sentiment of exclusion from the social and economic game," explains Laurent Mucchielli, director of the Center for Sociological Research on Law and Penal Institutions near Paris.
While right-wing politicians in France (most notably the Le Pen family and the National Front party) are using the riots to strengthen their anti-Muslim stances, the truth is that the reasons for the unrest are the same as those that caused riots in many Western cities over the past few decades. Poor or immigrant communities have not been successfully integrated into the larger society (and in this case, both French and immigrant societies share the blame), unemployment gives rise to crime that compounds the misery of the population, and mistrust between authorities and those in the ghettos snowballs into confrontation. While religious ideology may have a role in other types of violence (i.e, al-Qaida), in this case it just happens to be the faith of the disenfranchised population. Those seeking a solution to the problem would be more effective by looking deeper than that
Speedo said:What amazes me (without having read the thread) is that the French/europeans seem... pretty tolerant of all of this.
I can tell you that if those kinds of thing happened around here and the gov't refused to do anything (unlikely, that's why we have the National Guard), it would only be a night or two before the little sh*ts were met by a group of good 'ol boys who would be more than willing to draw a line in the sand and dare them to cross it.
Jorge said:Yes, and you would have by this time several persons killed. It´s another approach, but we don´t like to kill people (even if they are burning cars).
eyrei said:Considering we have regular citizens running around with assault rifles, it would probably be more than several killed after two weeks of rioting.
kronic said:That was the case in Germany until recently (1999). You needed to have Ar...German blood.![]()
We tend to average a couple dozen killed and scores wounded per 24 hour period during riots.eyrei said:Considering we have regular citizens running around with assault rifles, it would probably be more than several killed after two weeks of rioting.
It's quite impressive, true, but it also shows how hyperhyped were these unrests in the world, and why most of us found frankly laughable the "civil war" delirium we saw.Little Raven said:We tend to average a couple dozen killed and scores wounded per 24 hour period during riots.
Frankly, it's nothing short of astounding how few casualties this violence has produced.
While I agree that the 'civil war' rhetoric was laughable...last night saw 482 cars burned, and that was considered a good night.Akka said:It's quite impressive, true, but it also shows how hyperhyped were these unrests in the world, and why most of us found frankly laughable the "civil war" delirium we saw.
According to CNN, it is thanks to the curfew that things have got calmer.Akka said:It's quite impressive, true, but it also shows how hyperhyped were these unrests in the world, and why most of us found frankly laughable the "civil war" delirium we saw.
Each year in France on new year's eve.Little Raven said:While I agree that the 'civil war' rhetoric was laughable...last night saw 482 cars burned, and that was considered a good night.
I can't remember the last time a first world nation saw 500 cars burned in one night, much less 5000 cars burned in two weeks. There's definitely a major shakeup happening on your side of the pond.
Yeah, we can all have a good laugh now that things are starting to settle down. Though it turns out 'civil unrest' isnt much of a picnic either. BTW, you are in a civil war, these have just been the opening engagements. In the next 5 to 10 years, there'll be more.Akka said:It's quite impressive, true, but it also shows how hyperhyped were these unrests in the world, and why most of us found frankly laughable the "civil war" delirium we saw.
Marla_Singer said:Each year in France on new year's eve.
You must know that France is very good at burning vehicle. 5,000 cars burned in two weeks is insane of course, but what would be your reaction if you'd learn that more than 30,000 cars have been burnt since the beginning of the year ?