Paris burning

[Jorge]

I didn't say that only Muslims were rioting, but a large majority of the rioters are Muslims. If you have something to contradict this assertion, now is the time to put it forward. (Hint hint, let's see that "50% of rioters are not Muslims" link)

Well fortunately the kind of logic I was taught has nothing to do with the one you were taught

Most of the rioters are Muslims. So Islam is the cause.

Most of the rioters are poor. So poberty is the cause.

Most of the rioters are young. So age is the cause.

Most of the rioters haven´t got a University degree. So that is the cause.

Most of the rioters don´t own a house. So not being propietary is the cause.

Most of the rioters drink water. So water is the cause.

Most of the rioters speak french. So speaking french is the cause.

Well, I could go on and on, but all these stataments have exactly the same value from a logic point of view.

 

[Akka]

Why do you bother to continue to try reasoning someone who obviously is only interested in seeing what he wants to see ?
It's pointless and drag the thread down a level of childiness totally uninteresting, we'd better to reflect a bit on the added three-month state of emergency, which seems horribly off-the-point.

 

[Marla_Singer]

Why do you bother to continue to try reasoning someone who obviously is only interested in seeing what he wants to see ?
It's pointless and drag the thread down a level of childiness totally uninteresting, we'd better to reflect a bit on the added three-month state of emergency, which seems horribly off-the-point.

I disagree. I don't believe that guaranteeing that order will indeed be definitly restored as something shameful.

I'm always impressed to see people considering that it's not that bad to damage properties of others. It's actually insanely selfish to think this way when you think about it.

Restoring order is clearly not THE solution to solve the issue. But you can't solve the issue without restoring order. It's something necessary but not sufficient.

 

[kryszcztov]

Why do you bother to continue to try reasoning someone who obviously is only interested in seeing what he wants to see ?
It's pointless and drag the thread down a level of childiness totally uninteresting, we'd better to reflect a bit on the added three-month state of emergency, which seems horribly off-the-point.

Well, I could go on with him, since I am "immature", and.... wait, I think he didn't give any argument about this and my so-called "whining". Yeah you're right, what's the point in argueing with someone whose logic itself is failing ?

I agree with you about the silly 3-month curfew law.

Anyway this government will fail too. Some politicians may have the best intentions in the world for their country, they can't escape the elections' deadline. Modern democracy is like that : the rapid succession of elections will help diversity and representation, but will kill any ambitious program.

 

[Verbose]

Anyone in France want to comment on what Sarkozy might be thinking about here?

From what I read and hear in my northerly position, it's now being said that he might actually have some kind of insight into what will pay off at election time.
Argument being that the French in general might still be in the mood for tough measures. And they have brought up what happened after 68, when there was a conservative backlash against the student revolt in the elections.

Any substance to these speculations? What's the mood among average French people?

 

[Steph]

Any substance to these speculations? What's the mood among average French people?

Today's popularity poll:
Chirac: +6
Villepin: +7
Sarkozy: +11

Does it answer your question?

 

[TheDuckOfFlanders]

Elohir ,youre words arn't backed up in any way.You claim religion to be the cause of this problem but you have shown nothing yet to support youre claim other than the shouting youre oppinion out load every time.Where are youre sources ,figures?

The majority of the people on this thread clearly agree the poverty angle of the problem ,in fact mutlitple article's and sources have been posted from the media that clearly back up this view.You havn't shown any sources yet and nothing backs up youre oppinion.In a regular discussion this means you have nothing to stand on ,while youre arguments have been countlesly refuted by valid sources.Youre loosing this argument by a mile unless you can post some serious sources that back up youre claim.

And that whole Godwin's law is rediculously ,to arbitraaly call a discussion "won" on any topic by the mere fact that Hitler is mentioned is stupid ,simply stupid.It's not because it's called a "law" that it carries much credibilety really ,i can invent a few laws like that to.

Kung-Fu master? yeah right ,you sound more like a dogmatic to me.As to youre participation in this thread ,it shows that you want to prove certain arguments while you seem to have very few insight in the actual topic.It's like trying to prove the world is flat to Stephen Hawkings.

 

[Winner]

In one of our newspaper they said that "only" 98 cars were burned last night, which means all is OK because that is an average number of cars burned in France every day.

That's quite schocking news for me, can somebody explain it? Is that nonsense, or it is true? And if it is true, how is that possible?

 

[Steph]

And that whole Godwin's law is rediculously ,to arbitraaly call a discussion "won" on any topic by the mere fact that Hitler is mentioned is stupid ,simply stupid.It's not because it's called a "law" that it carries much credibilety really ,i can invent a few laws like that to.

Especially with that

It is considered poor form to arbitrarily raise such a comparison with the motive of ending the thread. There is a widely-recognized codicil that any such deliberate invocation of Godwin's law will be unsuccessful. See Quirk's exception below.

 

[Marla_Singer]

In one of our newspaper they said that "only" 98 cars were burned last night, which means all is OK because that is an average number of cars burned in France every day.

That's quite schocking news for me, can somebody explain it? Is that nonsense, or it is true? And if it is true, how is that possible?

It's been more than 10 years that 30,000 cars are burnt in French each year. It's totally outrageous I know but with time you get used to it. Let's say it's a French cultural thing.

 

[kryszcztov]

And that whole Godwin's law is rediculously ,to arbitraaly call a discussion "won" on any topic by the mere fact that Hitler is mentioned is stupid ,simply stupid.It's not because it's called a "law" that it carries much credibilety really ,i can invent a few laws like that to.

(bolding by me)

Sometimes civil disobediance has its charms... Good post BTW.

And it is news to me that so many cars are burnt in France. I thought it was many cars only on special occasions : New Year's Eve, when we get to win the World Cup or the Euro (happens once a century or so)...

 

[SonicX]

It's been more than 10 years that 30,000 cars are burnt in French each year. It's totally outrageous I know but with time you get used to it. Let's say it's a French cultural thing.

Nice culture you've got going on there
I'm happy we only took your gastromic culture and adapted it to our own tastes and left the rest alone (except Wallonia )

 

[Elrohir]

Especially with that

I believe I said "you lose", not "I win". And what makes you think I quoted Godwin's Law to stop the thread? I didn't. And wouldn't it make more sense for me to have stopped posting on this thread if that was my intent?

If I didn't want to post on this thread, I just wouldn't, I wouldn't resort to childish tactics to stop it, and I'm insulted that you think I would. And as I haven't stopped posting in this topic, doesn't it seem a stupid to assume that I tried to stop the thread?

Why do you bother to continue to try reasoning someone who obviously is only interested in seeing what he wants to see ?
It's pointless and drag the thread down a level of childiness totally uninteresting, we'd better to reflect a bit on the added three-month state of emergency, which seems horribly off-the-point.

"someone who obviously is only interested in seeing what he wants to see". That's just about everyone on the planet. If someone doesn't want to believe someone, then they won't, regardless of the facts put forward. I've seen it happen many times. Human beings are stubborn creatures who hate changing what they believe, and often won't even when logically reasoned out of their beliefs.

 

[Winner]

It's been more than 10 years that 30,000 cars are burnt in French each year. It's totally outrageous I know but with time you get used to it. Let's say it's a French cultural thing.

That's insane...

 

[Elrohir]

It's been more than 10 years that 30,000 cars are burnt in French each year. It's totally outrageous I know but with time you get used to it. Let's say it's a French cultural thing.

30,000 a year?! Is this like France's national pastime? "Hey guys, let's go catch a ball game, and torch a couple cars"? That's nuts.

 

[MobBoss]

30,000 a year?! Is this like France's national pastime? "Hey guys, let's go catch a ball game, and torch a couple cars"? That's nuts.

Thats what you get when your police have no testicles.

 

[Grisu]

well, at least the french are focusing only on torching cars, while in certain 'other' countries murder seems to be much higher on the national hobby list....

 

[Akka]

That's insane...

That's a joke

(or I have been totally absent of the country for ten years )

 

[Marla_Singer]

That's a joke

(or I have been totally absent of the country for ten years )

Well, the fact that burning cars is a traditional French pastime is indeed a joke. However, there are indeed 30,000 cars burning on average in France each year. That is not a joke.

 

[Marla_Singer]

Thats what you get when your police have no testicles.

The problem isn't about French police having no testicles, it comes from French left wing having no brain.

Indeed, people like Noël Mamère (French environmentalists) would consider you as a monster with no heart when you'll say thiefs or aggressors have to be prosecuted. Those idiot considers that rioters aren't criminal but demonstrators. And of course, those rioters who were already known by the Police for 80% of them, will play the victims on TV in saying that repression is a bad thing. Of course it is, that's bad for business.

That left wing which considers that respecting the law is optionnal is totally irresponsible. Drug dealings and mobile phones stealings are not good for the "cités". And by the way, it's in excusing what can't be excused that you lead people to vote Le Pen afterwards.