PH07: The School of Athens

[Codeman]

Did I miss a memo?

you didn't get it? hmmm? odd. i'll get you another copy. :rummages through pile of paperwork: can't seem to find it right now, i'll email you. keep an eye out for it.

guess it would be good for all to discuss first. i don't feel well tonight so will not be playing for at least 12 hours. everyone chime in with your thoughts.

until then, good night.

 

[pholkhero]

well, we haven't actually "decided" on Asoka, but I saw many reasons why not Shaka or Churchill, and some reasons pro-Asoka, so i just assumed . . . does anyone else think it should be someone else??

also, i guess play 10 since we'll be in war, and I didn't check to see who all would be involved in the war.

 

[pigswill]

Asoka has the fewest friends and is least friendly with us. He's also currently the most powerful; however capture a couple of cities (and survive the reprisals) and that can change quickly.

Ten turns for war sounds about right.

 

[Codeman]

well. it's looking like asoka is in my sites for 10 turns. i will play/post in the next couple hours.

 

[Codeman]

decided to pause for discussion after hitting enter 1 time. why, well...

as discussed on inherited turn made did some trading. here is one...

decided to cancel deals before declaring on asoka. he had a cat outside sparta. when i canceled the open borders this is where it went...

i decided to wait 1 turn to declare so i can move the workers. i pressed enter.

turn opened with "Asoka's golden age has begun. asoka has completed Taj Mahal.

i will wait a couple hours before continuing to play. does the team want to continue with the war even though he is entered a golden age? i don't think it will devistate us, but i would like to hear others thoughts. if i haven't heard back in couple hours i will continue.

 

[lukep]

It would be suicide to declare while he is in GA, methink.

So i would prepare for another set.

Now let others speak their advice

 

[pigswill]

Better to fight during the golden age than after the golden age. Its a bit late now to fight before the golden age.

 

[Codeman]

that's 1 for war now and 1 for wait til after golden age ends for war. i'll wait a little longer.

i'm in the war now court. i think take a couple of his small cities close to us. also, around the time golden age is over we'll be looking for peace anyway.

 

[ruff_hi]

delurk: war now, give him less chance to actually build something useful in the near by cities (ie by taking them)

 

[Codeman]

sorry for taking so long, but i haven't felt great lately. but this morning i feel 100% better. and happy Father's Day to all dad's.

now to the report.

well, i declared on asoka. score ranking is different now. we aren't at the bottum any more. and it by the grace of the RNGod the GP who came in was a merchant! sent him to farthest german city i could. would love to have sent him to india, but didn't. got 2550 gold from this. science is back up to 100% for now. most unit upgrades happened.

took jaipur and hyderabad. kept both. i think i lost one unit in the war so far. asoka has sent alot of knights, so may want to get some mounted defenses if war is going to go on. also, pillaged a good bit (including horse pasture, he probably has another). i would raze chittagong. thanks to the mountains hyderybad is the choke point. after this the front gets a little bigger.

relations...

on the trading front i renegotiated the dye deal with shaka to get the rest of his gold per turn off him. i think we went from 7gpt to 12gpt. forgot that pict. also, since chruchill was the only one without PP (except toku) traded to him for economics. and since shaka was the only one without liberalism i traded to him.

here is the world power scale.

and we may get a holy city if we keep this pressure up. i have one time in a SP game had a holy city flip from pressure, and we could see it happen here. be a nice addition to our budget.

and we're still applying pressure here to, should probably raise it a little.

and then here too. hmmm. looks like england is really feeling the pressure of the Greek culture.

and below is a snapshot of the current trade market. as youcan see we no longer hold a monopoly on chemistry. this may need to be considered when we decide when to get peace.

thoughts. comments. suggestions for improvement. all welcome.

 

[Codeman]

delurk: war now, give him less chance to actually build something useful in the near by cities (ie by taking them)

thanks ruff. that's what i thought too. he only had 2-3 defenders in the 2 close cities. it was the knights that kept popping up that was annoying. they would slow my advance but not stop it.

 

[Codeman]

so we don't have to search the thread for who is next...

Roster

Zophos >>
Pholkhero >>
Codeman >> just played
Lukep >> UP NOW
Pigswill >>on deck

 

[pigswill]

Looking good tho Asoka remains a significant threat. Nice to see we're going for steel. Maybe raze Chittagong then have a go at defending our gains and wait for Asoka to sue for peace. Let's hope he doesn't go for steel, that wouldn't be much fun at all. (Maybe capture Chittagong then return it to Asoka shorn of culture buildings as part of peace treaty).

 

[lukep]

nice play on the war and the GM trick.

I have however some rants to do

The civics are a disaster :

- We are running Bureaucraty, but Princeton is running only merchants (the gold from them dont get bonus), which means we pay 13 /turn for almost nothing in exchange
- free market is worth at least 30 /turn
- pacifism cost us a lot.

With the GM mission success, we should not worry about income and go in full production mode or run scientists.

We are running a SE, and neither Heroic Epic, National Epic and Globe Theater have been built. For the latter We need 6 Theaters. HE was probably not available before war though.

Those are urgent IMHO, and should have been built before war.

You said you encountered a lot of knights, but we have no pike (one phalanx and one is built)

We have a GS due in one turn, and a GM or GS in roughly 15 turns.
Lightbulb (Scientific method) ?

So i propose :

Revolt to Nationhood/Free Market/Free Religion
Take Calcutta and perhaps bengal with existing army and sur for peace?
In the meantime go in build mode, national wonder + grocers
fire the merchant, hire scientists
Redeclare after 10 turns, we should have steel then.

HE goes in sparta imho
NE+GT in cambridge ?

Wont play before your thought

 

[Codeman]

nice play on the war and the GM trick.

thanks.

I have however some rants to do

thanks here to.

The civics are a disaster :

- We are running Bureaucraty, but Princeton is running only merchants (the gold from them dont get bonus), which means we pay 13 /turn for almost nothing in exchange
- free market is worth at least 30 /turn
- pacifism cost us a lot.

admittedly, this is a weak area for me.

You said you encountered a lot of knights, but we have no pike (one phalanx and one is built)

i didn't realize i would encounter as many as i did. once i saw he was sending a lot (around turn 6 or so i think i saw he 4th or 5th knight, only a couple more) i decided to start getting the proper defenders. i wanted the next player to know what he was throwing at us. they were no match for the grens. grens wer taking them at about 75% and better odds. same as the phalanx.

We have a GS due in one turn, and a GM or GS in roughly 15 turns.
Lightbulb (Scientific method) ?

So i propose :

Revolt to Nationhood/Free Market/Free Religion
Take Calcutta and perhaps bengal with existing army and sur for peace?
In the meantime go in build mode, national wonder + grocers
fire the merchant, hire scientists
Redeclare after 10 turns, we should have steel then.

HE goes in sparta imho
NE+GT in cambridge ?

Wont play before your thought

cool. would we want slavery also?
on the specialists, if we want the GM to be produced, wouldn't our odds be better if we kept the merchants assigned in that city at least? couldn't we specialize one city torwards producing GS, one producing GM, and one producing GE? would that be possible/feasible?

do agree with your plan and thank you for the feedback.

 

[Idlenessss]

its too bad you already commited masonry, because I dont like the stone location at all. I would actually like to expand where you warrior is now, and start a plan of conquering louis, especially attractive when he takes stone and builds wonders

 

[pigswill]

Agree on switch out of pacifism. We can't draft grens but we can draft maces (I think); we can of course whip any unit. If we're staying in war production mode then switch to theocracy, we could either go with nationhood and caste for drafting or feudalism and slavery for whipping.

Sparta would be good for HE. Maybe go for Globe in high food city and draft/whip there. NE in next highest food city as GP farm.

 

[pholkhero]

its too bad you already commited masonry, because I dont like the stone location at all. I would actually like to expand where you warrior is now, and start a plan of conquering louis, especially attractive when he takes stone and builds wonders

sounds like a perfect plan ~ make it so!!

- We are running Bureaucraty, but Princeton is running only merchants (the gold from them dont get bonus), which means we pay 13 /turn for almost nothing in exchange

So i propose :

Revolt to Nationhood/Free Market/Free Religion
Take Calcutta and perhaps bengal with existing army and sur for peace?
In the meantime go in build mode, national wonder + grocers
fire the merchant, hire scientists
Redeclare after 10 turns, we should have steel then.

Good turns, Codeman ~ a nice opening ot the

Those GMs were my fault ~ forgot about the Bureau. bonus.

as to civics ~ do we really need the free religion boni? I don't think we have *that* many units where the upkeep from Pascifism will be SO much more. Theocracy, too, i think might be a waste since we've only got 3 unit-producing cities ~ though if we were going to draft, I would say yes.

Free market I can see, esp if we're not gonig w/Mercantilism.

I would definitely fire all merchants at this point, and bring on the scientists again. I would also try to push our army as far as possible: raze Chittagong, take Calcutta and see what's what.

 

[lukep]

Ivory to Hannibal for 6 gpt.

revolt to NationHood/FreeMarket/theo.

start non war builds. theater, grocers, HE in sparta, NE in princxeton.
GT is sheduled for cambridge

A surprise :

1466.
Chittagong is no more. Get a GG. As Sparta will be HE, put him as MI there

1514
Asoka get emancipation - calcutta fall

We start to have some WW + emancipation.
I would still continue on Bengal and Lahore

 

[pigswill]

Nice set of turns; solid gains.

Looking at the save Bismark, Shaka and Hannibal have picked up rifling; Asoka andChurchill can't be too far behind.

I'd be tempted to get peace from Asoka for whatever we can get then pick on Churchill. We'll get diplo hits but not enough to lose pleased status; we would gain a solid empire.