[Extension] [POLL] More Wonders for VP

[ProCatGamer]

They will not be available in standard game, but only when you load EE mod along with WW. What do you think about that?

Yea I think the wonders in EE should only be exclusive when one plays with it!
But how about the reshuffling part? Is the reshuffling only going to be in effect when one plays with the enlightenment era mod?

 

[adan_eslavo]

Pretty interesting mod, although it looks like I will have to disable Neolithic wonders, that has Ggantja so I don't want 2 Ggantja's... Or do I?

You must disable it because without that you will not be able to play MW. MW contains 2 of 4 Neolitic Wonders plus 5 other original ones not seen in that mod.

Oh, I did not know that as I never played with that mod before, I also never gave it a test as I think it hasn't been updated for a while


Yea I can see the reason to not add those 2 wonders, but I thought to give it a shot due to how iconic it is

Are there any other tech locations you want to add more wonders or are these enough? It is a bit hard to get more wonders during this era as the enlightenment era primarily focuses on Europe... But we can try


So among those listed in your original idea post, only 3 will be selected?

Initially, yes. I have already added dozen of Renaissance WWs, and similar amount of Industrial ones. This means that EE has much lower WW amount than eras before and after. 3 more wonders would fill the gap imo. Later on maybe there will be more. I still must create some art for new WWs because those already painted will run out after releasing v0.13.

For now I have brief plan for all Eras. Maybe 1 original wonder to Ancient and 1 to classical would be goid idea. But they must be "something". Also Modern era had initially 2 WW so it needs lots of them to compete with other eras. You can see tge plan for next eras in op.

Yes, UCS was not updated since 2019, so some things can be outdated. @Enginseer do you plan to update it or it is left to another use to handle it?

Yea I think the wonders in EE should only be exclusive when one plays with it!
But how about the reshuffling part? Is the reshuffling only going to be in effect when one plays with the enlightenment era mod?

By reshuffling I mean moving few WWs from or to EE when it is enabled. Normally those WWs are Renaissance or Industrial era WWs, but EE does some changes to the tech tree and thats why reshuffling is needed. Those 3 additional WWs will be enabled only when EE is, so it will be an incentive to play EE more.

 

[Bruhmoment]

You must disable it because without that you will not be able to play MW. MW contains 2 of 4 Neolitic Wonders plus 5 other original ones not seen in that mod.

That's a shame.

 

[adan_eslavo]

You lose only 2 WWs, New Grange and Barnenez. Ggantija and Skara Brae get brand new form, better balanced with stuff available to mod with VP. Additionally you get Mohenjo-Daro, Goebekli Tepe, Majorville Medicine Wheel, Kuk and Altamira Cave. I don't think it's a shame, but it is your choice .

The decision about throwing away those 2 wonders from Neolithic Era was dictated by will for spread the WWs acros the world. Neolithic Era focused too much on West and South Europe.

 

[Bruhmoment]

Yea you do lose a few neolithic wonders, but you do get more though. There IS a CBP compatibility mod that balanced out those wonders, but I will test this out and see if it works out well.
Also - why is it is saying where to build wonders and what yields it gives? Is this part of the mod?
Mod seems pretty good at first glance, man that's a lot of wonders
Edit: Is karnak supposed to LITERALLY give 1 production to FP?, or is it supposed to give like 1 production every 2 citizens (atleast that's what I'm guessing those mushrooms are), or could it be the former?

 

[adan_eslavo]

Also - why is it is saying where to build wonders and what yields it gives? Is this part of the mod?

Can you elaborate? I cannot catch the point from your question. Op describes all added or modified wonders. Requirements for World Wonders, such as required coast, mountains etc. are for few reasons:

• you cannot build tons of wonders in capital now; you must spread them out;
• now you have much more wonders to build, so requirements have to slow down or make building impossble in some games to not make you win in industrial era;
• they give some new flavour to the game; Mountainous wonders require mountain, there are more lake wonders, jungle wonders etc. it is something similar to civ 6's districts where you must fullfil some conditions to make profit of wonders.

You can also enable sort of blockade for very old wonders, so you and other players will not be able to build some wonder from ancient era if you are already in medieval. You can build only from 1 era past. But that's optional.


You have also something new for VP - Natural Wonder rework, which revamps existing Naturl Wonders, adds new ones, upgrades UI, and does tons of other things.



Mod is still under developement. I'm working on v0.13 now. But it should be totally playable in v0.12 state. It is compatible with VP 7-1-3 and other mods. OF course you must disable Wonders Expanded, because it derives from it.

 

[Bruhmoment]

I mean as in there's a different UI than usual. There didn't used to be Terrain: Feature:, and so on.
Again, I don't want to repeat myself, but is karnak literally supposed to add +1 production to FP, or does it add +1 production for every 2 fp worked? (dunno what the mushrooms are)

 

[pineappledan]

Another enlightenment era wonder idea is Stone Town in Zanzibar

 

[m0nk3yst1ck]

Loading MW v12 and Inuits v18 on VP 7-1-3, I found that the start biases for the Inca (mountains) and Inuits (tundra/snow) don't work. I've tried loading one after the other and setting the "override assignstartingplots" option in my map settings to "no," but removing More Wonders is what fixes the issue, so this leads me to believe it is the culprit. Is MW overriding the default VP assignstartingplots with an out-of-date version?

 

[bahamut19]

I mean as in there's a different UI than usual. There didn't used to be Terrain: Feature:, and so on.
Again, I don't want to repeat myself, but is karnak literally supposed to add +1 production to FP, or does it add +1 production for every 2 fp worked? (dunno what the mushrooms are)

You will repeat yourself if you don't listen to responses. Adan told you the description is in the OP, which means original post.

+ 1 production and +1 faith from every 2 local Flood Plains....

I just copied this from where Adan told you to look and it answers your question clearly. In the future, please be respectful of the modders time as the modders make these free mods for you, assist you in using them, and then you ignore their help when it's given. When they point you in a direction, go there.

 

[adan_eslavo]

Loading MW v12 and Inuits v18 on VP 7-1-3, I found that the start biases for the Inca (mountains) and Inuits (tundra/snow) don't work. I've tried loading one after the other and setting the "override assignstartingplots" option in my map settings to "no," but removing More Wonders is what fixes the issue, so this leads me to believe it is the culprit. Is MW overriding the default VP assignstartingplots with an out-of-date version?

Yeah, Im working on fresh update on that file. It is outdated by about 4 versions. They also changed few things regarding NW spawning and this took me few days to resolve, but im on my way. In v0.13 will be fine.

EDIT:
My predecessor and me did't find solution to not to use the AssignStartingPlots.lua file. Some changes to NWs just must be modified there manually.

 

[adan_eslavo]

I mean as in there's a different UI than usual. There didn't used to be Terrain: Feature:, and so on.
Again, I don't want to repeat myself, but is karnak literally supposed to add +1 production to FP, or does it add +1 production for every 2 fp worked? (dunno what the mushrooms are)

On top of help text you have requirements for WW. Next you have new type of help text, more flavoured and clean. If you want old one, op will tell you how to configure it.

Maybe after release I will spend a while to improve the legend in the op.

There are people who like them and probably other half that don't. Depends on personal taste. I made them because I dont like original ones which mention about some things, keeping in secrets few others.

 

[Bruhmoment]

On top of help text you have requirements for WW. Next you have new type of help text, more flavoured and clean. If you want old one, op will tell you how to configure it.

Maybe after release I will spend a while to improve the legend in the op.

There are people who like them and probably other half that don't. Depends on personal taste. I made them because I dont like original ones which mention about some things, keeping in secrets few others.

Yep, that's the one. I was wondering why it was saying different requirements for wonder's. I like the descriptions, though.
As to bahamut19, I think you should leave their decision to the person itself, not by someone who hasn't made major mods. Sorry not sorry. Questions will be asked, and I don't think that's breaking the rules of respect.

 

[Bruhmoment]

Loading MW v12 and Inuits v18 on VP 7-1-3, I found that the start biases for the Inca (mountains) and Inuits (tundra/snow) don't work. I've tried loading one after the other and setting the "override assignstartingplots" option in my map settings to "no," but removing More Wonders is what fixes the issue, so this leads me to believe it is the culprit. Is MW overriding the default VP assignstartingplots with an out-of-date version?

I've asked pineapple, and he said that it doesn't necessarily actually give a snow start with the Inuit. If it gives you a tundra start, then that means it's working (Atleast I suppose?). Not sure about the Inca though, I'll have to test that out

 

[m0nk3yst1ck]

I've asked pineapple, and he said that it doesn't necessarily actually give a snow start with the Inuit. If it gives you a tundra start, then that means it's working (Atleast I suppose?). Not sure about the Inca though, I'll have to test that out

Yes I should've said tundra start. Too much snow would be brutal even for the Inuit. Normally I am able to get a tundra start on Inuits and mountain start on Inca nine times out of ten, but with MW v12 loaded it's very hit or miss.

 

[adan_eslavo]

Yes I should've said tundra start. Too much snow would be brutal even for the Inuit. Normally I am able to get a tundra start on Inuits and mountain start on Inca nine times out of ten, but with MW v12 loaded it's very hit or miss.

I neglected updating this file, because it was changing a lot, and I have no time for regular updates, too. Now, because I did so much work towards v0.13 I want to make it fully compatible with VP 7-1-3, and maybe later one if it comes out this week or next one. I want to do also something I haven't for a long time - balance frequency of Natural Wonders. Last time I did this there were only 3 new NWs added in this mod. Now there are 7 of them. Stay tuned and keep up finding the bugs, if there are some

@Gazebo Do you plan to release new VP version soon or rather in late August or even after summer vacations?

@Bruhmoment @bahamut19 I'm not offended. Sometimes asking is a good thing, but I try to write down as many as I can in the main post. Every new player interested in MW, or any of my other mods should do this first. Of course I will try to answer all the questions, and thanks @Bruhmoment I found one or two things I can do better in the op. @bahamut19, like me, just knows some people from this forum who were really annoying with their attitude and this is probably the reason why he "stifled" you in advance. But, finish this arguement and let's talk about improving the mod.

 

[m0nk3yst1ck]

• Indeed, flanking of Fleet of the Sun is not working on ranged naval units, so I will cut it from Carriers, Subs and Naval Ranged. Maybe I should chnge the bonus to more universal? Any ideas?

Here are some ideas for a more encompassing bonus for all types of naval units (no idea how balanced or plausible to implement they are)

• +5% CS/RCS per adjacent friendly unit (for attack only or for both attack and defense)
• +5% CS/RCS per adjacent enemy unit (for attack only or for both attack and defense)
  
• +1 sight
• No CS/RCS penalty for wounded friendly units
• +10% CS/RCS against wounded enemy units
• +10% CS/RCS on attack

 

[adan_eslavo]

I gave them bonus vs Air units and bonus cs rcs if theres adjacent friendly.

 

[Asterix Rage]

@adan_eslavo
Good to see you back here.

I tried MWVP once. You're doing a very sophisticated Wonder mod! It make Wonders Bonus absolutely unpredictable and sometimes game changer.
And some of the new NWs are stunning. What a beautiful achievement already!
For those who don't know, Natural Wonders modding is everything but easy. You must be skilled on everything actually

I believe there are good materials enough in 0.12 to release a first more than decent version 1 of MWVP. Don't you think?
With only what works well.

I noticed two identical new Lakes NW with different colors.
I know you'll make all your possible to have always more in your mods, but here it's maybe too much? One lovely colored Lake as a new NW , it's mind blowing. Two make both disappointing.

 

[adan_eslavo]

I believe there are good materials enough in 0.12 to release a first more than decent version 1 of MWVP. Don't you think?
With only what works well.

I will release official v1 after finishing all planned wonders for Information and Atomic Era. For now, numbering is not so important. From gameplay perspective nothing changes, because I try to make them playable in 100%, even though it's called beta.

I noticed two identical new Lakes NW with different colors.
I know you'll make all your possible to have always more in your mods, but here it's maybe too much? One lovely colored Lake as a new NW , it's mind blowing. Two make both disappointing.

I don't know what you saw, but there's only Lake Victoria and Lake Retba on the map. I suppose Dallol is "second colorful lake", but it's magmatic creation, used to be called also a volcano, even though it doesn't look like a volcano, with totally different spawning conditions and unique bonuses. It's not "lake" in normal meaning. It's rather a death trap where temperature doesn't fall below 25 celsius degrees.

And they are not identical with their shapes. Trust me I used google images to copy the contours.