Proofs that God is imaginary

[Capt Buttkick]

Actually... if God is real and shows up, then yes. I would much prefer to believe him. Force me please. It is really for my own good. The only reason free will (with respect to the freedom to believe or not) is a good thing is only because of the possibility that God is false. Then it means I have a choice.

I value free will beside and above most else. Who would I be without free will? Not me.
If God exists, I hope he strikes you down like Paul en route to Damascus then. Count me out, though.

Who will choose not to believe if God showed up? But since he never showed up (meddling with certain chosen ones don't count), then the idea of free will is used to help believers rationalise among themselves why there are non-believers.

That's a possible explanation too.

The freedom to ignore and disbelief in the face of overwhelming evidence is not freedom. It's silliness. Someone with a gun (with bullets) in my face telling me to smile, I will willingly flash my teeth. I don't want the pseudo-freedom to disobey and have my face punctured. But with no guns or any weapons, then it makes sense for me to decide freely if I wanted to smile at a stranger.

Now you're making my case?

 

[Xyan]

Now you're making my case?

Lolz...

Not the best analogy. But the point is that I know guns are real. And I obey the gun if I had to. Therefore, if God is real, I will willingly obey it. No questions asked. I don't need the freedom to say 'NO' and let a bullet go through me.

BUT since God does not show up to us as being real without doubt, it is like there are no guns anywhere near me. Hence, it is silly to imagine the gun is there and obey everything that potential gunman (priests??) tells me. It means no sense.

 

[Annex]

My question then is...:Why is such a cruel and unjust deity worthy of mass worship and obedience then, when he clearly proves himself to be absolutely not better or any more moral than any other human being?

Thats more of a reason to worship him! Grovel at his feet so he doesnt send you to hell.

I think youre confusing the idea of God being imaginary with the idea that Christianity is imaginary.

 

[Capt Buttkick]

Lolz...

Not the best analogy. But the point is that I know guns are real. And I obey the gun if I had to. Therefore, if God is real, I will willingly obey it. No questions asked. I don't need the freedom to say 'NO' and let a bullet go through me.

BUT since God does not show up to us as being real without doubt, it is like there are no guns anywhere near me. Hence, it is silly to imagine the gun is there and obey everything that potential gunman (priests??) tells me. It means no sense.

I guess eternal damnation is the whip (or gun for that sake), heaven is the carrot. But we're getting close to my boundaries for this discussion. Like I said in my first post, I'm not on a mission.

 

[warpus]

Subsistute 'believe' with 'follow' in my last post? I think it's more of a semantic argument anyway.

I would probably follow God if I was convinced that he exists.

Why would he condemn me to hell, then? He knows my heart is in the right place (assuming he's all-knowing).

He also knows that I haven't seen much evidence for his existence.

 

[Flying Pig]

I argue as following:

• As Pascal pointed out, the evidence for the existance of God is equal on both sides - 0
• I'm an Atheist, so I don't have any god above him, so I don't break the first commandment - and I had good reason not to believe in him
• I do no work on Sunday most of the time, so I don't break that
• I am (I like to think) a generally good guy
• Therefore, if God exists, he'll probably be nice to me
• Therefore, there's no point in worshipping

 

[eastsidebagel]

I'll repeat myself then.
I'm not claiming God created evil. The common christian belief is that evil entered the world through Satan, let in by man.

God allowed it though. Men where then like children, they had no real idea what was going on.

I don't claim God is a puppeteer. Quite contrary, I'm arguing that God created beings with true free will. In this context, the reason why God is obscured from view, is that he's not forcing anyone into believing. This also explains why God can't cure cancer in one go, why won't God heal amputees and so on.

To not believe in God and therefore be damned for all eternity in a lake of unquenchable fire is a very easy choice. If God really plays this game, then I have yet another reason to call him a sadist.

If he did, he would force belief upon us, thus taking away his highest gift, free will.

If free will just causes me to go to hell, then this so-called highest gift of him is nothing more than a candy trap.

If the christian god is the one true god, and I'm not let into heaven because of my lack of faith, I can't really blame him. My bad, entirely.

Nonsense! Lets imagine I'd tell you about a speaking unicorn I've seen the other day. This unicorn has told me that it is impersonating the only stairway to heaven, and that everyone who wouldn't believe its words would be go straight to hell. You would be totally amazed and would at least demand a single proof so that you'd see it for yourself that I didn't make this story up. I'd reply then to you that this is unfortunately impossible, for showing you a clear and unambiguous proof would take away your free will and therefore the magical unicorn wouldn't deem you worthy then to lift you up into heaven. Would you still believe after that, or would you rightfully accuse me of being a liar?
How can this unicorn plan to redeem just a single soul with this total unfairness and cover-up on its side, so that just a little minority of the population over the course of the centuries will decide to have faith in?

 

[eastsidebagel]

• As Pascal pointed out, the evidence for the existance of God is equal on both sides - 0
• I'm an Atheist, so I don't have any god above him, so I don't break the first commandment - and I had good reason not to believe in him
• I do no work on Sunday most of the time, so I don't break that
• I am (I like to think) a generally good guy
• Therefore, if God exists, he'll probably be nice to me
• Therefore, there's no point in worshipping

Well, the verdict on this case is more than clear:
Hell for you, mister, because Jesus is still not your accepted and cherished messiah!

 

[Flying Pig]

If God deliberatly set up the world so that the odds for his belief were 50-50, he won't be too cross with atheists. The Hindus have it right; believing in God is not what gets you spiritually rewarded, but being devoted and disciplined

 

[Agent327]

I argue as following:

• As Pascal pointed out, the evidence for the existance of God is equal on both sides

I like it this far, and it confirms my point: there's no real evidence for the existence/non-existence of God.

(I've clipped the quote, as the rest of the argument is logically flawd.)

 

[Loki130]

I always liked the omniscient/omnipotent paradox:
-If god knows all, he knows his own future actions
-He can't change his actions, because then that would be a change in the future he foresaw and therefore something he didn't know
-So god doesn't control his actions, and is therefore not omnipotent

also, if god already knows our future actions, why does he need to test us all the time?

And for you scholars, is there any line in exodus that either recognizes or denies the existence of the Egyptian gods? been wondering

 

[warpus]

[/LIST]I like it this far, and it confirms my point: there's no real evidence for the existence/non-existence of God.

(I've clipped the quote, as the rest of the argument is logically flawd.)

I told you that I already proved that God doesn't exist, by pointing out that he isn't present in the corner of my room where a chair resides.

 

[eastsidebagel]

And for you scholars, is there any line in exodus that either recognizes or denies the existence of the Egyptian gods? been wondering

Well, the sorcerers of the Pharaoh transformed their sticks into snakes too, like Moses did, as well as turning water into blood, so the question is:
Who helped them to do these miracles when it wasn't YHWH himself?

 

[Eukaryote]

Godisimaginary.com proves christanity false, it doesn't prove there to be no god.

 

[Cutlass]

If you want proof of the non existence of god, try selling your soul to the devil. No devil = no god.

 

[eastsidebagel]

Godisimaginary.com proves christanity false, it doesn't prove there to be no god.

Actually, I've never noticed that contradiction about their site's name before.
But since the Judeo-Christian-Islamic God is the most recognized and best known deity of the world, they just chose to target that one, I guess.

 

[Lade]

The God you believe in must a hypocritical, sadistic evil-doer then! He creates cancer, millions of people suffer and die from it, and yet, he still relies on our own intellect to cure it! Why did he create this horrendous decease in the first place? And what about Aids, Ebola, the Pest etc.? And why does it seem to me that we are all just his mindless marionettes in his big, pointless game of chess when this God is really existent at all?

Disease was one of the first punishments God let loose on mankind

If (no sins == happier) & (no free will == no sins),
Then (no free will == happier)
God -> gives free will
God -> expects sins
God -> does not want us to be happy
God -> Evil.

Seriously, I think free will only make sense in the absence of the concept of a creator.

Perhaps God was lonely, and wanted some sort of follower to love and worship him. However, it means nothing unless someone CHOOSES to love him. If you built an android that was built to follow and love you, would it mean anything? In comparison, it would feel better to be loved by a spouse who has CHOSEN you (please don't make any "married to God" jokes because of my metaphor)

 

[Traitorfish]

If you want proof of the non existence of god, try selling your soul to the devil. No devil = no god.

This is possibly the most bizarre fallacy I've ever witnessed. None of your basic premises- that A) "the devil", as modern Christianity understands him, exists, B) that the devil must exist for god to exist, and that C) the devil, if he were to exist, will respond to any and all attempts to bargain a soul- are Biblically supported, and so your argument holds no weight against the Judeo-Christian god. Furthermore, C is merely a later superstition, without any basis in theology and B is, frankly, something which you just pulled out your arse right there.

The modern concept of "the devil" is essentially a hybrid of the Accuser, a servant of god who appears in the Old Testament, tasked with testing the faith of mortals, and various malign spirits and creatures, such as the serpent of Genesis and the "demons" of Hebrew myth- superstitious caricatures of pagan gods- and the Demiurge, the materialistic creator god of Gnosticism. It's basically a big, complicated, often contradictory superstition which really has no bearing on the existence of the Biblical god, let alone the premise of an omnipotent, omnipresent and omnibenevolent personal creator.

Don't get me wrong, I'm quite convinced that such a creator does not and could not exist, but this is a really rather awful argument against it...

 

[Cutlass]

This is possibly the most bizarre fallacy I've ever witnessed. None of your basic premises- that A) "the devil", as modern Christianity understands him, exists, B) that the devil must exist for god to exist, and that C) the devil, if he were to exist, will respond to any and all attempts to bargain a soul- are Biblically supported, and so your argument holds no weight against the Judeo-Christian god. Furthermore, C is merely a later superstition, without any basis in theology and B is, frankly, something which you just pulled out your arse right there.

what's your point?

 

[Agent327]

I told you that I already proved that God doesn't exist, by pointing out that he isn't present in the corner of my room where a chair resides.

And I ignored it because of absence of logic in that statement.