[RD] "Race"-based Gerrymandering

[Cutlass]

Fair? We have no simple system like Costa Rica where an indelible ink is applied to the thumb and cast your vote.

And people are terrified of voter id cards even though you need an official photo id for everything.

We have no idea if only citizens are voting and there are high estimates of abuse. Likewise a lot of dead Democrats vote.

There's no evidence that in person voter fraud in the US has reached 0.1% in any election in the past 80 years. It has certainly not changed the outcome of any election. And nearly all of it which is found to have happened is honest mistakes, not intentional fraud.

So why whimper and whine about something that has a smaller error rate than just about any other human activity? Since there is no actual dispute that in person voter fraud is not changing the outcomes of elections, how can you possibly make an excuse for making it harder for an American to vote?

 

[Berzerker]

cuz it makes it harder for poor folk to vote

 

[Cassius Critzer]

There's no evidence that in person voter fraud in the US has reached 0.1% in any election in the past 80 years. It has certainly not changed the outcome of any election. And nearly all of it which is found to have happened is honest mistakes, not intentional fraud.

So why whimper and whine about something that has a smaller error rate than just about any other human activity? Since there is no actual dispute that in person voter fraud is not changing the outcomes of elections, how can you possibly make an excuse for making it harder for an American to vote?

What is your source because there is evidence of the dead voting. We have evidence of the Democrats on video talking about flooding voting districts by transporting illegal immigrants, and then having them alter elections.

By all means provide this evidence.

I am pretty certain it is a felony to vote in a presidential election if not a citizen.

 

[AdrienIer]

Maryland
(That map is truly horrible)

I agree, there's one or two D cases out of the dozen possible ones (I was also surprised at Massachussetts having only D representatives). Meanwhile Virginia NC Pennsylvania Ohio and Michigan are more than surprising.

 

[Cutlass]

What is your source because there is evidence of the dead voting. We have evidence of the Democrats on video talking about flooding voting districts by transporting illegal immigrants, and then having them alter elections.

By all means provide this evidence.

I am pretty certain it is a felony to vote in a presidential election if not a citizen.

Put up or shut up. Even the Trump administration has admitted that they have no evidence to take to court. If you have actual evidence, why do you refuse to produce it?

Answer: The whole thing is deliberate false accusations for the purpose of dog whistle racism.

 

[metalhead]

What is your source because there is evidence of the dead voting. We have evidence of the Democrats on video talking about flooding voting districts by transporting illegal immigrants, and then having them alter elections.

It's kind of an own goal to ask for evidence, and then make a claim like this without providing any evidence of your own.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Put up or shut up. Even the Trump administration has admitted that they have no evidence to take to court. If you have actual evidence, why do you refuse to produce it?

Answer: The whole thing is deliberate false accusations for the purpose of dog whistle racism.

And it's also an excuse to ramp up voter suppression efforts to Jim Crow levels.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Put up or shut up. Even the Trump administration has admitted that they have no evidence to take to court. If you have actual evidence, why do you refuse to produce it?

Answer: The whole thing is deliberate false accusations for the purpose of dog whistle racism.

Really? You made a claim that you said was based on evidence. Well. Let's see the evidence. And then, that's fair, I will supply evidence of the Democrats tampering with elections.

Put up or shut up seems like an impotent demand with no teeth in the threat. Why so belligerant?

You think a brown man who is openly hostile of bigotry is making racist claims? Really?

If a mod will allow it, I will provide video evidence of a Democrat admitting to voter fraud. It seems that videos are highly discouraged even considered a violation of the rules. I will not include a video without permission.

 

[Cutlass]

Really? You made a claim that you said was based on evidence. Well. Let's see the evidence. And then, that's fair, I will supply evidence of the Democrats tampering with elections.

Put up or shut up seems like an impotent demand with no teeth in the threat. Why so belligerant?

You think a brown man who is openly hostile of bigotry is making racist claims? Really?

If a mod will allow it, I will provide video evidence of a Democrat admitting to voter fraud. It seems that videos are highly discouraged even considered a violation of the rules. I will not include a video without permission.

One person does not add up to the kind of voter fraud that you are alluding to.

On the other hand, many Republicans admit to election fraud.



http://billingsgazette.com/news/gop...cle_22d791f1-e3dd-5b4b-b8f2-c9fcbb137888.html

http://billmoyers.com/2014/10/24/voter-discrimination/

https://www.thenation.com/article/w...w-suppressed-200000-votes-trump-won-by-23000/

https://www.thedailybeast.com/north...-voter-suppression-is-workingand-theyre-right

https://www.thedailybeast.com/republicans-admit-voter-id-laws-are-aimed-at-democratic-voters

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/10/voter-suppression-may-have-won-wisconsin-for-trump.html

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/wisconsin-voter-id-2016_us_5704a2eee4b0a506064d90cf

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/17/...eraging-voter-id-laws-for-political-gain.html

But, I can see from the fact that you can't produce anything that you knew when you made the claim that you could not produce anything, and were just making crap up. Because, you know, every single Republican in the country has failed to find actual evidence of voter fraud. So why should you be any different?

 

[Cassius Critzer]

When you make the claim every single Republican has failed to....

It immediately is false as you are not being intellectually honest. Try again. As I said, I will provide the evidence if allowed by moderation.

 

[metalhead]

Judging by your description, the "evidence" you have would seem to be of extremely limited probative value in proving the claim you're making.

Unless your video of "the Democrats" talking is literally a video of all of the Democrats talking about what you say they're talking about.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

It's an undercover video with grotesque admissions.

Few Republican politicians desire to touch upon this topic. Even vaguely mentioning it is political suicide. I don't know why as it is a lost cause to expect an illegal immgrant to eventually vote Republican regardless that two Republican senators are championing DACA. Or that many Republicans supported more than ten amnesties in the past.

It is disingenuous to state that a voter id card is in effect a poll tax as everyone in America has to have photo id for just about everything including public assistance. The issue is completely solvable. And we couple this with independent election observers.

 

[metalhead]

It's an undercover video with grotesque admissions.

By whom? Who is speaking? What, specifically, are they admitting to, and what is the scope of what they're admitting?

 

[Cassius Critzer]

By whom? Who is speaking? What, specifically, are they admitting to, and what is the scope of what they're admitting?

It is easier to just post it. Otherwise it is like trying to describe how to tie your shoes. It is easier to just do it than read about the process.

I was aghast when I saw it because, yes certainly in loosey goosey districts then some illegal immigrants are voting. But orchestrated? That is ugly and wrong. Some illegal has pretended for so long that they don't want to out themselves to their neighbors at the voting precint by not voting. But busing illegals to vote and alter and election...that is serious.

Think about this. There's a claim with evidence that the Republicans used voter fraud. Therefore don't you want this stopped? I do. I don't want any voter fraud.

Absentee voting is the loophole in many cases.

 

[metalhead]

Are you going to do that thing where you claim something exists, and then only claim you couldn't produce it because you weren't allowed to?

Surely if the video shows people admitting to such criminal activity, they would have been investigated. Were they? What did those investigations turn up? And once again - WHO ARE THE PEOPLE talking on the video about bussing in "illegals" to vote?

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Are you going to do that thing where you claim something exists, and then only claim you couldn't produce it because you weren't allowed to?
Surely if the video shows people admitting to such criminal activity, they would have been investigated. Were they? What did those investigations turn up? And once again - WHO ARE THE PEOPLE talking on the video about bussing in "illegals" to vote?

Here. Read about it yourself.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...er-james-okeefe-sting/?utm_term=.d5cec2f6d9c8
Two people were fired. You can find spin doctoring on both sides. I even posted a leftist source to help you digest it.

Personally, I think the best method is watching the video and using critical thinking.

 

[Wastl]

The Washington Post is not a leftist source. Some far-right weirdos proclaiming it as such doesn't make it so.

Beyond that:
a) that's not proof for voter-fraud
b) using videos of James O'Keefe as proof, who was found to deliberately misconstruct and edit videos in such a way that they do not represent what the person in the video was actually saying, has more to do with being into conspiracy theories than it does with critical thinking

Simply put, there is no voter fraud on any noticeable level. You may find low-level employees from all possible parties trying to diminish the turnout for the other parties, and you have pretty high-level members of the Republicans trying their best to misuse their power to introduce laws that are very much anti-democratic in nature, preventing legitimate citizens from voting because the specific groups tend to favour the democrats, but that isn't voter-fraud either. Voter fraud is the active act of forging an election, either by changing votes that have been made or by adding votes that shouldn't count / subtracting votes that should count. None of that is happening.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

The Washington Post is not a leftist source. Some far-right weirdos proclaiming it as such doesn't make it so.

Beyond that:
a) that's not proof for voter-fraud
b) using videos of James O'Keefe as proof, who was found to deliberately misconstruct and edit videos in such a way that they do not represent what the person in the video was actually saying, has more to do with being into conspiracy theories than it does with critical thinking

Simply put, there is no voter fraud on any noticeable level. You may find low-level employees from all possible parties trying to diminish the turnout for the other parties, and you have pretty high-level members of the Republicans trying their best to misuse their power to introduce laws that are very much anti-democratic in nature, preventing legitimate citizens from voting because the specific groups tend to favour the democrats, but that isn't voter-fraud either. Voter fraud is the active act of forging an election, either by changing votes that have been made or by adding votes that shouldn't count / subtracting votes that should count. None of that is happening.

Nonsense. The Washington Post is a leftist source. The Washington Times is on the right. These words are NOT perjoratives.

And that is your spin on Project Veritas. Did you watch the videos? They are having a conversation. No one forced a Democrat to say these awful things. They have made many many videos. There is a new one just out on Google shadow banning.

It's pretty simple. Stop saying outrageous truth to strangers who might be investigating.

Anyone on the left could do the same thing. In fact, I encourage you to go after bigots and crush them. Please do this.

 

[metalhead]

Ah. So a video was creatively edited to make it look like a no-name operative was talking about bussing in illegal voters, when he was actually talking about bussing in people to disrupt campaign events. These comments by a single individual, in your mind, adds up to a widespread and concerted effort to have "illegals" vote in elections. Mmmkay.

Ugh. People will believe whatever they want to believe regardless of its veracity. Project Veritas counts on that.

 

[Cassius Critzer]

Nice spin job. You missed your calling. There is still time to work for any number of Democrat orgs.

I rather enjoy watching fundamentalist ideologues squirm in real life when they realize how bigoted the Democrats are. To a student of history, this should be no surprise whatsoever. The party that condoned lynching is shall we say rather biased...even terminally so.

Project Veritas is doing a public service exposing intolerance. I would love it if they are balanced and next target some staid Republicans. Let's get 'em all.

Anyone can claim any video is a cut and paste job. The reality is the creep on the video being interviewed was clearly discussing voter fraud. And possibly very practiced at doing this. And Veritas has over and over exposed what operatives really think to suppress opinion they disagree with.

Not only does he discuss how to do it in general terms, but which kind of vehicles could be used so not to leave a paper trail to obfuscate as much as possible.