Celticfury
King
No good. The Russians are liable to start asking why we have been in the Ukraine, and, not having any real reason why we should be there, that will only make things worse off for us.
Realpolitik CIV - An Interactive AAR
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Captain Fargle
Prince
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We say that we're in the Ukraine because we're worried about the Arabs obviously. We're keeping and eye on them because we know that once they finish with Russia their next target will likely be our German Vassals.
Simple, no?
Simple, no?
MathNerd
High on math (a, not e)
Simple, we kill her.
Celticfury
King
To Aysee:
The HDO is still in the Ukraine.
To Fargle:
Not so sure that will work. Whatever our reasons, we would still be admitting that we had operative on Russian soil, and seeing as our relations with Peter have always been strained at best, Peter is liable to blow a gasket and react very angrily at this admission.
The HDO is still in the Ukraine.
To Fargle:
Not so sure that will work. Whatever our reasons, we would still be admitting that we had operative on Russian soil, and seeing as our relations with Peter have always been strained at best, Peter is liable to blow a gasket and react very angrily at this admission.
Captain Fargle
Prince
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Then screw him, we'll still have his Princess as a bargaining chip.
Welcome to Realpolitik, WIM: where politicians kick babies instead of kissing them! 
Nukeknockout
Rusty Hinge
yeah! who wants to rape, pillage and burn a random innocent village?
Russia is around -17 relations with us. He is NOT going to be "allied" with us any time soon. We may be able to gain some concessions and make sure he's never strong enough to hurt us but he will never be allied. The Norse Viking people have always been the ones we hoped to ally in Europe but they became TOO powerful and Buddhist befriending our enemies and becoming a threat... now... things could change.
Here is my basic plan outline:
Try to save Catherine; A = Alive, B = Dead
IF A Then Interrogate her; C = Intelligent and willing to work with us, D = Intelligent and not willing to work with us, E = Dumb Blonde and willing to work with us, F = Dumb Blonde and not willing to work with us.
If B Then Make it look like an Arabian-Ukrainian joint Operation instead of a English-Ukrainian Operation; G = Succeed and Come into the war on Russia's Side, H = Fail and finger of suspicion is pointed at us thus Declare on Russia and Arabia at the same time.
If C then negotiate a agreement that leaves Ireland and Moscow in our hands; I = Success and we keep our words, J = Fail then go-to D
If D then talk to the Khan of the Irish to see if they will become vassals if we get them Ireland back (so we can protect them); K = Success thus forcefully marry Khan and Catherine in both the Buddhist and Christian tradition. Then every Russian city we take that we don't want to keep can be gifted to the Irish stopping our over expansion costs. L = Fail thus Declare on Arabia to claim back Moscow for us to keep. Catherine stays hidden untill she is useful.
E = Dumb Blonde will do anything we want. But too Dumb to bargain with directly, Thus will depend on negotiations with Peter; M = Peter refuses to leave Moscow and Ireland in our hands thus assassinate him and place Catherine on the throne as our vassal, N = Peter agrees and we help Russia against Arabia in exchange for Ireland. Catherine is married to an Englishman for insurance.
F = Dumb Blonde and now willing to help us, she will probably blame us for everything and thus sour any relations with Peter. Forceful marriage is the only option with political trickery to gain a political cause to attack who we want.
End Plan outline.
Here is my basic plan outline:
Try to save Catherine; A = Alive, B = Dead
IF A Then Interrogate her; C = Intelligent and willing to work with us, D = Intelligent and not willing to work with us, E = Dumb Blonde and willing to work with us, F = Dumb Blonde and not willing to work with us.
If B Then Make it look like an Arabian-Ukrainian joint Operation instead of a English-Ukrainian Operation; G = Succeed and Come into the war on Russia's Side, H = Fail and finger of suspicion is pointed at us thus Declare on Russia and Arabia at the same time.
If C then negotiate a agreement that leaves Ireland and Moscow in our hands; I = Success and we keep our words, J = Fail then go-to D
If D then talk to the Khan of the Irish to see if they will become vassals if we get them Ireland back (so we can protect them); K = Success thus forcefully marry Khan and Catherine in both the Buddhist and Christian tradition. Then every Russian city we take that we don't want to keep can be gifted to the Irish stopping our over expansion costs. L = Fail thus Declare on Arabia to claim back Moscow for us to keep. Catherine stays hidden untill she is useful.
E = Dumb Blonde will do anything we want. But too Dumb to bargain with directly, Thus will depend on negotiations with Peter; M = Peter refuses to leave Moscow and Ireland in our hands thus assassinate him and place Catherine on the throne as our vassal, N = Peter agrees and we help Russia against Arabia in exchange for Ireland. Catherine is married to an Englishman for insurance.
F = Dumb Blonde and now willing to help us, she will probably blame us for everything and thus sour any relations with Peter. Forceful marriage is the only option with political trickery to gain a political cause to attack who we want.
End Plan outline.
ilduce349
(Financial, Philo)
IRL Catherine was probably the smartest queen of all time. However this isn't RL...
I am hoping for C
I am hoping for C
Nukeknockout
Rusty Hinge
this isn't RL, but Catherine IS an Immortal. if she's intelligent, then she's dangerous. she understands that all she has to do is set up a long-term plan and stick with it. she could make life very difficult for us because by definition, she has political influence the only way to ensure she is no threat to England is put her in a position where she has no power, I.E. a situation where the fact that she's a princess is irrelevant.
this is all assuming she's non-cooperative, of course
-Nukeknockout
Imperial Party member
ilduce349
(Financial, Philo)
My new campaign manager has refused to let me post this.
Captain Fargle
Prince
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Remember if we install Catherine as ruler all Diplomatic relations will be reset. At least I think that's how it works.
ilduce349
(Financial, Philo)
SO LETS INSTALL HER!!!!!!!! (caps)
Twinkletoes89
Warlord
- Joined
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Well if relations are so poor with Russia, then we need to see how much they want their princess back.
Would they be prepared to pay us for the pleasure? Maybe we ask them to concede Ireland to us?
If they don't offer us anything, leave her for the Ukrainians to tear apart or force some 'regime change' to someone more likely to be friendly to us as we saved her from her death.
EDIT: Should've read all of Ravus' post first!
Would they be prepared to pay us for the pleasure? Maybe we ask them to concede Ireland to us?
If they don't offer us anything, leave her for the Ukrainians to tear apart or force some 'regime change' to someone more likely to be friendly to us as we saved her from her death.
EDIT: Should've read all of Ravus' post first!
ilduce349
(Financial, Philo)
ok, how about this:
If we don't rescue Catherine from the Ukrainians then I am pulling an Arya (Aka going on a sabotage spree)
If we don't rescue Catherine from the Ukrainians then I am pulling an Arya (Aka going on a sabotage spree)
ilduce if Catherine IS a intelligent woman then she could be very offended by your forceful "SHE WILL MARRY ME! GET HER HERE! INSTALL HER NOW OR I'LL BLOW UP ENGLAND YUK YUK YUK" thing you have going now. And by offended i mean she won't like you. And by won't like you i mean she may be willing to kill herself to get away from you.
Poetry, intelligence and a emotional connection are ways to woo a lady...
P.S i do want the lady alive to pull of some political trickery so just tone it down untill it's been sorted out. THEN you can start again on the caveman courtship ritual
Poetry, intelligence and a emotional connection are ways to woo a lady...
P.S i do want the lady alive to pull of some political trickery so just tone it down untill it's been sorted out. THEN you can start again on the caveman courtship ritual
Celticfury
King
We need to tread very lightly on this subject. As Ravus pointed out, Catherine will not be very pleased with us if we try and force her to marry someone. Not to mention that unless we get the approval of Peter, this proposed marriage will not benefit us at all. In order for it to work, it needs to be considered legitimate by all parties involved.
As for what Russia will do to get their princess back, I'd would like to paraphrase a comment made by LH in chat: Spetsnaz in London. All this discussion is hinging on the hope that Russia doesn't pull something drastic. They may even decide to even the playing field by taking a high ranking government official hostage.
Also, we need to know how the other nations are going to react to this. If we tell Peter that we have his daughter and we are holding her captive, there is a good chance that he will go to Ragnar for help. Peter will want to destroy any chance of us gaining popularity with Nidaros, and Ragnar will not be all too pleased with this development.
As for what Russia will do to get their princess back, I'd would like to paraphrase a comment made by LH in chat: Spetsnaz in London. All this discussion is hinging on the hope that Russia doesn't pull something drastic. They may even decide to even the playing field by taking a high ranking government official hostage.
Also, we need to know how the other nations are going to react to this. If we tell Peter that we have his daughter and we are holding her captive, there is a good chance that he will go to Ragnar for help. Peter will want to destroy any chance of us gaining popularity with Nidaros, and Ragnar will not be all too pleased with this development.
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