Sleep, an old thread that got spam-bumped

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That seems academically interesting, but I am not sure how it can help me. My body just seems to prefer the evening, and hates mornings. That could be all in my head of course, but that's been the case since I can remember.

It sounds though that I would have a better time sleeping on Mars, which has a 25 hour long day.

Well you're being forced to get up 10am now. If you forced yourself to get up at 7am, it would take a few days/weeks to adjust, and then it would be pretty much the same.

Or don't, if stuff is working fine, and whatever forces are making you get up at 10am now are preferable to whatever forces you need to get you up at 7am.
 
Well you're being forced to get up 10am now. If you forced yourself to get up at 7am, it would take a few days/weeks to adjust, and then it would be pretty much the same.

Or don't, if stuff is working fine, and whatever forces are making you get up at 10am now are preferable to whatever forces you need to get you up at 7am.

I've basically tried that before. What happens is I am a sleepy mess until noon and get nothing done. Then I am fully awake in the evening, like always, and end up going to bed at the same time, because it's not easy to fall asleep when you're the most awake you've been the whole day. So it ends up wasting my whole morning and nothing changes, and I'm more tired the next day to boot, and far less likely to wake up early again.
 
I've basically tried that before. What happens is I am a sleepy mess until noon and get nothing done. Then I am fully awake in the evening, like always, and end up going to bed at the same time, because it's not easy to fall asleep when you're the most awake you've been the whole day. So it ends up wasting my whole morning and nothing changes, and I'm more tired the next day to boot, and far less likely to wake up early again.

Yes, that will happen at first. You'd get used to it. You're sleeping the same number of hours regardless of when you get up, and your body doesn't know what a clock says, all it knows is the stimulus it receives as input. If you shift all the stimulus and your responses to the the stimulus a few hours earlier, then everything will happen a few hours earlier.
 
That sounds nice in theory, but I've never been able to embrace it. And is it wrong that I'm just not a morning person? I don't want to wake up at 7am. I'm just a night owl, I've accepted that a long time ago. I get my best thinking done at night.

edit: having said that, I will look into seeing professionals about this. After this pandemic is over.
 
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I find that when I'm on a more or less set schedule that I wake up more or less the same time all the time anyways. Most days I'm wide awake before my alarm goes off. Many time in my life if I've forgotten to set the alarm, or something happened which messed it up, I still find myself awake at the normal time, before it was supposed to go off. I don't think I've ever been late for work because my alarm didn't go off. If I deliberately turn off the alarm like I do Saturday nights to sleep in on Sunday morning, today I was awake at 7, but most of the time I'll still wake up before 6, and then have to roll over and go back to sleep.
 
I often struggle with falling asleep at night. I really envy those who do that easily. I should try a lot harder to avoid screentime at late evenings though. But you know how it is..
 
I had sleep issues as a teen and even a little younger. I would lay in bed and try and sleep and instead would be awake until pretty late just thinking (almost always bad thoughts).

Then at some point in the last 10 years a switch flipped and I fall to sleep generally within 5-10 minutes of trying to go to bed. I sleep pretty good but I do snore so some mornings I wake up and don't feel that rested. I get up at 5am and half the time I'm awake right before the alarm goes off. I have a lot of nightmares about tarantulas though which kind of sucks.
 
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That sounds nice in theory, but I've never been able to embrace it. And is it wrong that I'm just not a morning person? I don't want to wake up at 7am. I'm just a night owl, I've accepted that a long time ago. I get my best thinking done at night.

edit: having said that, I will look into seeing professionals about this. After this pandemic is over.
You're thinking that being a night owl means there's something wrong with you. There isn't. It's just that your brain (and my brain, and many other brains on this planet) are wired to be awake and alert at different times from most other people. My normal bedtime is somewhere between 5-6 am. I'd love to sleep until about 1 pm, but my medication schedule says I have to be up at 12:30 pm.

I spent 35 days in the hospital, 20 years ago. I told the nurses about my sleep schedule (before it went completely out of whack due to the untreated hypothyroidism that made me sleep for 12 hours straight and I was constantly tired for the other 12), and they said, 'We'll get you straightened out and back to normal" - acting as though being a night owl isn't normal. I see it as no different from the fact that some people are left-handed, most are right-handed, and both ways are okay, if that's how your brain is wired.

People would call me lazy when I told them that my work day began at 3 pm. "Must be nice," they'd sniff, and then I'd point out that this 3 pm was the beginning of at least 12 hours' work, more likely 15-18 before I'd be able to go back to bed. I tried to make time for two meals a day, plus one hour for my soap opera. I'd usually read for half an hour before going to sleep. So I worked the same number of hours (or more) than other people did, but it was just at a different time of the clock.

I should add that this schedule was doable because my grandmother was a morning person and would be up and awake to handle the clients in the morning when they came to pick up their papers. She'd collect the money for me, give them their papers, and take any messages (if they wanted to book another paper, for instance, and wanted to mention it then instead of phoning later). I did have to tell her not to solicit tips, though, since I didn't want the clients to think I'd put her up to it. She'd say things like "She was up until 3 in the morning typing this, don't you think she deserves a little extra?". Tips were normal with some clients and that was really appreciated, but I didn't want people to feel obligated. It was worth more if they recommended me to a friend or two so I'd get a whole semester's worth (or more) of business from them. There were times when this led to crazy 30-hour days, but I was able to tolerate that fairly well back then. I wouldn't be able to manage it now.

So anyway, @warpus, if your night owl schedule feels right to you and doesn't interfere with your job - and there's nothing medically wrong with you, my advice is to not try to fix what isn't broken. As far as the rest of the night owls are concerned, you are perfectly normal.
 
It does sort of interfere in my job, in that my boss expects me to work office hours (more or less). Even though I have the flexibility to sleep in and start at 11 if I want to or whatever, I would get a lot more done if work began at like 6pm. That sounds like a horrible schedule, but that's when I'd be the most productive. Right now they are asking me to work during my most unproductive hours, so I get stuff done, but they have no idea how much potential sits within me that they're not tapping into because they're tied to these stupid office hours. Their problem, not mine, I guess
 
Damn capitalists, exploiting workers again.... ;)
 
I find that even when I'm not waking up to my alarm, as now I've noticed recently I'm getting up even for a few minutes at night every night, I wake up at clock intervals that end in 0. Today, it was 5:20. The other day, 4:30. Never a number other than zero. Is my body hard-wired to wake up on the zero? Mmpfh.

I feel like I sleep better if I'm laying on my right side, not the left. I can sleep on both, but it feels like I'm a right-side guy.
 
I feel like I sleep better if I'm laying on my right side, not the left. I can sleep on both, but it feels like I'm a right-side guy.
Your body changes positions all during your sleep. You may fall asleep easier in your right side though.
 
Has anyone ever studied if Feng Shui has any impact on sleep? I know that it's all mumbo jumbo made up by people in silly looking hats or whatever, but it aligns with magnetic NESW directions in some way, right? I swear I've read somewhere that sleeping aligned north to south is better somehow.

I tried to google this, but all the sites coming up were made by people who wear silly hats, so.. maybe there's some actual scientific studies made on this? I sleep east-west. Maybe I should rotate my bed 90 degrees? It wouldn't be ideal, but if it helps me sleep, I'm willing to try it.. I'll dig more into this later when I have more time, but maybe somebody's already looked into it
 
Has anyone ever studied if Feng Shui has any impact on sleep? I know that it's all mumbo jumbo made up by people in silly looking hats or whatever, but it aligns with magnetic NESW directions in some way, right? I swear I've read somewhere that sleeping aligned north to south is better somehow.

I tried to google this, but all the sites coming up were made by people who wear silly hats, so.. maybe there's some actual scientific studies made on this? I sleep east-west. Maybe I should rotate my bed 90 degrees? It wouldn't be ideal, but if it helps me sleep, I'm willing to try it.. I'll dig more into this later when I have more time, but maybe somebody's already looked into it
Seems like an easy test to make.

https://www.healthline.com/health/best-direction-to-sleep
 

It's not, though. For an actual study I would need volunteers, I would need to set up a proper study and make sure I've collected all my data properly (so that I can make worthwhile conclusions from it), etc. I'd also need to account for the placebo effect and so on. Nobody's going to let me watch them sleep, I already tried that once

The problem is that any sort of positive experience I have sleeping north-south is just an anecdote. Who knows what really affected my sleep? I've taken melotonin before, but like I said I have no idea if it did anything. Sometimes I slept better, sometimes I slept worse. Even if I slept better for the whole 2 months of taking it, maybe there's another factor? If you don't set up a proper study, you just don't know. You can't make any worthwhile conclusions.

Sure, if I started sleeping north-south and felt amazing for months, then I'd be sold. But, I know what's going to happen. Some days I'll sleep better, some days I'll sleep worse. What I'm after are actual scientific studies that did all the leg work for me (so I don't have to ask strangers to participate in my quasi-scientific study)
 
It's not, though. For an actual study I would need volunteers, I would need to set up a proper study and make sure I've collected all my data properly (so that I can make worthwhile conclusions from it), etc. I'd also need to account for the placebo effect and so on. Nobody's going to let me watch them sleep, I already tried that once

The problem is that any sort of positive experience I have sleeping north-south is just an anecdote. Who knows what really affected my sleep? I've taken melotonin before, but like I said I have no idea if it did anything. Sometimes I slept better, sometimes I slept worse. Even if I slept better for the whole 2 months of taking it, maybe there's another factor? If you don't set up a proper study, you just don't know. You can't make any worthwhile conclusions.

Sure, if I started sleeping north-south and felt amazing for months, then I'd be sold. But, I know what's going to happen. Some days I'll sleep better, some days I'll sleep worse. What I'm after are actual scientific studies that did all the leg work for me (so I don't have to ask strangers to participate in my quasi-scientific study)
Your goal should be more good nights of sleep and not proving anything. Just keep your own score on which nights you sleep well and if you did anything to improve the situation. Keep your records for 6 months or more. Keep it simple with a -3 to +3 measure and then a few notes that include active measure (drugs, position, lights etc.) Other conditions, bed time, wake up time, weather? last activity, last food, idk....
 
Your goal should be more good nights of sleep and not proving anything. Just keep your own score on which nights you sleep well and if you did anything to improve the situation. Keep your records for 6 months or more. Keep it simple with a -3 to +3 measure and then a few notes that include active measure (drugs, position, lights etc.) Other conditions, bed time, wake up time, weather? last activity, last food, idk....

You're essentially saying that I should set up a scientific experiment without any of the benchmarks that would actually make it scientific. The conclusions of such an experiment would be unfortunately useless to me (or anyone else). You can't trust conclusions like that, they could be way off. That's why we invented the scientific method and peer review.
 
You're essentially saying that I should set up a scientific experiment without any of the benchmarks that would actually make it scientific. The conclusions of such an experiment would be unfortunately useless to me (or anyone else). You can't trust conclusions like that, they could be way off. That's why we invented the scientific method and peer review.
Your goal is a very personal one and collecting your personal data over time may not be a sleep study of interest to scientists, but you might actually learn something about what helps you sleep. And that is the goal. If you want a scientific process, then go talk to a sleep expert and use their long expertise to guide you in what you do. That science is just more expensive than keeping your own record for 6 months. :)
 
My waking up on the zeroes ended as soon as I posted about it. Now the ties are motionless intervals are random.

Let’s see if this post turns it/them back on. Actually, I haven’t been sleeping well due to anxiety issues and the prescription I got to deal with attacks, while causing some drowsiness, does not seem to have a measurable impact on sleep performance regardless of time taken.

I turned off some of the lights now here (past 10:00pm local time) and I think the reduced light will put me in a better position once I’m ready to go to bed. I’ll try not to think about any of the anxiety-causing things, maybe put on a video and veg out for a while.
 
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