SprylliNES V: The Peloponnesian War

erez87: Yes, cities that are more prosperous will find that, when I adjust population figures every few turns, they will get more of an increase (subject to a few other considerations).

Greek states didn't lose 1000 men in battle every year. If they had, they would indeed have been eliminated. In the entire Peloponnesian War, there were maybe three or four such full-scale engagements involving states' whole armies, and they tended to result in the loser being forced to capitulate (which is what happened to Argos in updates 1 and 2 of this NES). Greek pitched battles were notoriously bloody, and that was partly why, in practice, they couldn't happen all that often, and why many generals often tended not to risk them unless they had decisive superiority or were desperate. There are also instances of cities very nearly being wiped out in a particularly violent battle: look up the Battle of Idomene, for example. If you look at the present situation, there are several cities completely, and realistically, emaciated by the war - Ambracia, Amphipolis and Cumae are all in such circumstances, and Plataea, for example, is completely destroyed, and if you look through Greek history, it's full of cities being wiped out, such as Sybaris, or Megara Hyblaea, or Leontini, or what very nearly happened to Mitylene. Sieges, raids, and attempts to make the enemy's allies, subjects, or slaves revolt are much safer means of warfare.

That doesn't apply in quite the same way to fighting Italian natives, though, because although they're formidable and numerous, they're not very good at taking well-defended cities, they don't fight as hoplites, and you've got cavalry on both sides - although, nevertheless, fight too many pitched battles with the Lucanians and either you, they, or both of you will be in a very precarious position.
 
Declaring war:

You may not attack anyone without giving some form of warning on the thread in good time. Sneak attacks will be considered to be breaking the rules. The reason for this is that no-one in Ancient Greece could possibly get together an army or attack anyone without everyone else noticing.

If you attack someone without saying so, or declare your intentions excessively close to the deadline, you can expect it to either go wrong, not happen at all, or get delayed right at the end of the year.
But you could say you attack someone and then actually attack someone else, couldn't you?
 
JoanK: Possibly. If you wanted to do something like that, you should get my approval well in advance, on the individual instance. I would, though, in almost any case, inform the target player so that they can give instructions to their soldiers.

Clearly, once you get there and are besieging their city, for instance, then the element of surprise is lost and they should be able to make plans for that turn, beginning from the point at which they become aware that they are being attacked, rather than having to wait until the next turn.
 
Clearly, once you get there and are besieging their city, for instance, then the element of surprise is lost and they should be able to make plans for that turn, beginning from the point at which they become aware that they are being attacked, rather than having to wait until the next turn.

That is of course reasonable.
 
You keep numbers for the tribes as well? I don't know the number of their losses after the last war...

What I mean is that I hope that while I lose men, they do too and won't come with 10k every war while my numbers dwindle.
 
erez87: In the last war, the losses that you inflicted on the tribes exceeded the losses they inflicted on you by a considerable amount, although neither side's losses were disastrous, and your manpower decreased just as much by agreeing to colonise Cumae as it did by losing men in battle.

The Italics are not undefeatable by any means - but really a rather tough nut to crack. They do probably have a considerable demographic advantage (but then your men are worth more than theirs as soldiers, by and large). You should note that in RL, in this period, what was starting was a considerable increase of Italic power in southern Italy at Greek expense: they have already captured Capua and Pyxus, and they went on IRL to capture Cumae, Posidonia, and almost the whole west coast of the toe of Italy down to Locrian territory, by 350 BC. It's possible to halt this - but it's quite a challenge! - and even more of a challenge to reverse it completely. :)
 
Yeah the samnites did most of that, no? Anyway I think I have an idea how to turn the tide.
 
Joining as Macedonia.
 
talonschild, christos: Thebes and Macedonia are both already taken, if you look at the list of claims on the previous page.

erez87: No, it was mostly the Lucanians, actually. The Samnites took Cumae and Neapolis, but the Lucanians did everything else.
 
Can I join as upper Macedonia?
 
Upper Macedonia is a region consisting of three separate independent kingdoms, Lyncus, Orestis and Elimea, of which you can only be one.
 
Lyncus.
 
Hmm. spryllino, are you going to pick up where we left off, or start anew?
 
das: My intention has been pick up where we left off. I don't, myself, see any particular reason not to use the progress we've already made, which I think provides us, as it stands, with an interesting setting.

I think I will increase the turn length to two years, though, in order to stop the NES descending into inertia every time there isn't a dramatic war going on.
 
Can we create new troops? Also, can we develop new weapons as projects (Sarisa)?
 
Can we create new troops? Also, can we develop new weapons as projects (Sarisa)?
Pretty much no to both I believe. Only way to increase troops is to get your prosperity better, and I believe spry intends to leave inventions for himself to decide, or else this game will become just a "who invents best weapon".

Spry if updates will be 2 years age, then prosperity pop updates should be every 2-3 turns...? As in every 5 years.

People won't go to wars without building up first in any case :p
 
Yes, erez is right there:

You cannot "raise extra troops" in addition to the troops in your stats: the troops listed in your stats represent your entire possible fighting population.

And indeed, you can't design weapons chiefly because (a) that would make no sense in your particular circumstances since you are Lyncus, which is especially backwards, and whose troops don't even fight as hoplites, and because (b) it would be completely anachronistic to design the sarissa in 419 BC (not to mention that it would also be fairly useless as a weapon, given the mountainous terrain of Upper Macedonia).
 
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