Storm on Brazil's government

[Absolution]

If we have to put it into a binary, then consider:

1. The two parties that hate each other conspired to undermine the incoming administration by orchestrating an ineffective but politically damaging break-in of government buildings.

2. Some people are just really stupid.

I vote two!

Oh, two was proven beyound any doubt back in 2018.

 

[Arwon]

Brazilian media reported that the army had stationed 2,500 troops in Brasilia ahead of the possible declaration of a "guarantee of law and order" (GLO) by the president, which would authorize the use of troops in the case of a security crisis.

the military? at least they don't do this in the US. we have federal law enforcement for that sort of thing. I'm assuming Brazil does not...?

The US uses its National Guard like this.

 

[9gkj548hkm20vk79dj689bnj4]

- the National Guard is more of a state entity despite receiving some federal training and funding, iirc.
- I'm not sure how exactly a response to a similar incident in Washington D.C. would occur since that's sort of federal territory...maybe the president would deploy [what used to be called] the "Washington Division" [which used to be at Ft. Meyer but I think that place has closed].
- I'm only surprised that no one really gives a second thought to using national defense troops to suppress internal opposition, but hey, that's what the Brits did in Northern Ireland in the '70s so the bar is set pretty low anyway.

 

[stinkubus]

National Guard is not a state entity. Governors can activate them, but if push ever comes to shove the feds are the ones cutting the checks so it really shouldn't be all that hard to figure out where the ultimate authority lies.

 

[Angst]

- the National Guard is more of a state entity despite receiving some federal training and funding, iirc.
- I'm not sure how exactly a response to a similar incident in Washington D.C. would occur since that's sort of federal territory...maybe the president would deploy [what used to be called] the "Washington Division" [which used to be at Ft. Meyer but I think that place has closed].
- I'm only surprised that no one really gives a second thought to using national defense troops to suppress internal opposition, but hey, that's what the Brits did in Northern Ireland in the '70s so the bar is set pretty low anyway.

for the third, i can see the government doing that if a group of people assaults the parliament

 

[Arwon]

- the National Guard is more of a state entity despite receiving some federal training and funding, iirc.
- I'm not sure how exactly a response to a similar incident in Washington D.C. would occur since that's sort of federal territory...maybe the president would deploy [what used to be called] the "Washington Division" [which used to be at Ft. Meyer but I think that place has closed].
- I'm only surprised that no one really gives a second thought to using national defense troops to suppress internal opposition, but hey, that's what the Brits did in Northern Ireland in the '70s so the bar is set pretty low anyway.

You're getting caught up in minute differences of form, why would it make a difference whether the troops keeping order in the streets during unrest are tied to a state govt or the federal govt? That's military forces keeping a lid on riots either way.

Also a bit incorrect on that distinction anyway. The Brazilian military police, who seem to be the main enforcement at work here, are considered part of the military but are also ordinarily under the control of the governors of the states, with a separate force for each state. In this case, in the federal district, the federal govt took over once it became apparent the governor of the capital territory was part of the problem. So the line of command there is pretty much the same as in the US, with federally linked auxiliary military units being ordinarily at the disposal of state executives.

The takeway here is most/all countries have some sort of militarised way to restore order and control crowds, a function somewhere between the standing army and ordinary police. In some countries the function sits squarely with a military police or gendarme type entity (ie sections of a military whose jurisdiction is basically civilian policing) like the Brazilian military police, many European gendarmeries like the Carabinieri and Guardia Civil, or the Canadian RCMP. In some countries it's more of a pure military entity having occasional ad hoc law enforcement powers as required, like the US National Guard. In some cases it's a heavily armed section of ordinary police like the Australian Federal Police's Specialist Response Group.

If those various functions are not enough and things get really out of control with regards to a big ole riot, the next step will generally be conventional military regardless of the form of that intermediate step, though in this case it sounds like the regular army are stationed "just in case" while the military police do their thing rounding everyone up on charges.

 

[Gorbles]

Also, notably, not actually the same as what the Brits inflicted upon Ireland.

Sorry not sorry, had to be said.

 

[Arwon]

Yeah I mean Brazil isn't a stranger to what paramilitary death squads look like either. The comparison is a little far fetched (and the ones trying to bring that back are on the uh other side of proceedings here).

 

[Moriarte]

i have a very hard time believing that this is an illuminati thing

seeing what happened in the states, the incompetence of it, it's believable that it was just idiotic

i mean, they support bolsonaro... x)

I don’t think anyone hinted illuminati yet. Usually, when a crowd of people overruns multiple government buildings, it means several things: Someone organised them, directed them, made sure they get there by using transport and social networking, made sure they don’t stray away to local bar and get drunk senseless. One also needs to make sure these people are properly fed, if the operation is planned for longer than 2 hours. Which means that several people conspired to overthrow government. It takes planning, coordination, money, to move masses of people, be it for capturing president’s palace or anything else. “Just idiots being incompetent” is, well, naive. Idiots sit at home/in a bar all day and watch TV.

Brazil riots: Arrests ordered for top officials after capital stormed

One of the officials, the former military police commander, has been arrested, local media reported.

www.bbc.com

 

[Arwon]

Given the timing when nothing was in session, I'm inclined to think it was more about encouraging disorder to create an excuse for a coup, rather than being an attempted coup directly.