1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Strange Stability maps

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Rhye's and Fall of Civilization' started by Dennis Laursen, Dec 25, 2010.

  1. Alexius08

    Alexius08 Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,102
    Maybe to prevent an AI-controlled Mongolia to expand a lot and remain stable without the occupation and police state civics.
     
  2. Akbarthegreat

    Akbarthegreat Angel of Junil

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,746
    Location:
    Erebus
    I guess he was right, because Gameplay>Realism
     
  3. Wessel V1

    Wessel V1 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2007
    Messages:
    1,417
    Location:
    Nijmegen
    I don't think that the provinces the mongols controlled were very stable, the empire expanded quickly, and collapsed less than a few centuries afterwards. The AI can expand quickly, become unstable, and collapse. Far more realistic than a mongol empire that slowly expands and become large in the 18th or 19th century.
     
  4. Gruekiller

    Gruekiller Back From The Beyond

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2010
    Messages:
    2,365
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Ohio
    The problem is, usually the Mongols -don't- expand quickly and then collapse quickly afterwards. Generally they just gobble up Mongolia and Turkestan, occasionally conquer China and Korea, and generally afterwards don't go after the Khmer, Persia, Middle East, or even Japan, like the actual Mongols did.
     
  5. blizzrd

    blizzrd Micromanager

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    3,738
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    That is a problem with CivIV AI, not a problem which is specific to RFC.
     
  6. Akbarthegreat

    Akbarthegreat Angel of Junil

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,746
    Location:
    Erebus
    As blizzrd said, you would have to change the general AI behaviour
     
  7. Gem Hound

    Gem Hound Mercenary

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2011
    Messages:
    2,594
    Location:
    In the dark
    And I would need to do that for RFC Britannia. :)
     
  8. DylanAraki

    DylanAraki Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2010
    Messages:
    105
    Location:
    Canada
    Another weird thing about the Vikings is they're in India!
     
  9. Gruekiller

    Gruekiller Back From The Beyond

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2010
    Messages:
    2,365
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Ohio
  10. yuchai

    yuchai Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2010
    Messages:
    39
    Japan in Vancouver doesn't make sense. If anything, it should be the Chinese.

    The Chinese stability map is quite restrictive from what I can see if cultural influences and immigration count for anything, which they seem to be for some other civs. Malaysia & Singapore are yellow for India but red for China? Huh?

    http://rhye.civfanatics.net/civ4/stability/China.gif
     
  11. Alexius08

    Alexius08 Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,102
    AI China might expand to the Khmer spawn zone well before the latter's spawn.
     
  12. samarghata

    samarghata Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    21
    I cannot find answer.... what does that colors mean for city placement? Is it negative stability on yellow, orange - don/t even try and apocalypse now - for red:) ?
     
  13. The Wimp

    The Wimp Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2011
    Messages:
    62
    Location:
    Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
    I think the green for us in the balkans is because albania is a very pro-American country
     
  14. youtien

    youtien Lyricist

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,308
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Taipei
    Why should stability map accord to history? I always thought it should be decided by culture, religion and relationship. For example, South Africa could be settled / conquered by any colonial civ, but why only English and Dutch get OK stability, just because they actually did it? And if China settled America 400 years before European, like I usually do, why shouldn't they get at least OK?
     
  15. DC123456789

    DC123456789 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2012
    Messages:
    3,060
    Location:
    Canada
    Because RFC is a simulator of real-life history.
     
  16. Rod

    Rod Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    754
    Location:
    Munich / Germany
    I think I can explain the German stability map

    German colonies:
    green and yellow territories in South America, Asia (East Timor, some area in China) and Africa all represent former German colonies - most of them were very short-lived though as Germany gained most of its colonies very late in the 19th century and lost all of them in 1918. Please note that even till today a good amount of the upper class of Namibia is of German origin.

    German emigrants:
    Green and yellow territories in North America and Eastern Europe represent German people who emigrated into these regions - most notably the large immigration in Northern US and Canada during the 19th century but also all the German founded cities&villages in today Romania, Hungary, Russia, Ukraine, Poland,Czech, Baltic States you name it.
    Today these former German pockets either peacefully absorbed into the local culture or the German population got forcefully evicted after 1945 and then these regions were resettled with Non-germans. Nevertheless for centuries especially these Eastern European regions were inhabited by Germans, who even lived and spoke only like Germans (even developing their own version of the language) and often created a parallel state within the state.
    The dark green territories in Eastern Europe represent the inhabited regions which were at times even part of first the Holy Roman Empire and later the German nation state. Most of these got lost after 1945 and the population got removed, simply because the German population had and was endangering the stability of the newly founded Slavic states as the Germans never truly accepted to be ruled by Non-germans. Especially the current East-Poland got often invaded by Germans, while West Poland (Silesia, Pomerania) , Czech Republic (Bohemia) and North Poland/Baltic(Eastern Prussia) were an integral part of Germany/Austria most of its history in the last millenia.

    Clash with other cultures:
    Red areas in today Germany are clashes with other cultures. While German expansion often went unchecked in Eastern Europe it met strong resistance in Western Europe. France, Germany and later Netherlands (a culture very much related to German culture) constantly fought over Western Germany/Eastern France/Lower Countries for centuries until the current borders were established only in 1945. Therefore possession of these territories was highly unstable and foreign claims were common.

    Germanic origin:
    Yellow territories in Scandinavia are due to the common roots of Germanic and Scandinavian civilization. The original Germanic tribes were very much related to the Scandinavians in language and ethnicity and even though the split occurred 2000 years ago there are still similarities in values, morale, religion, personal features etc.
    Hence it could be assumed that Scandinavians would be more comfortable (long term) being part of a German empire then lets say of a French or Chinese Empire.
    History has shown that the resistance to German rule during WW2 was much bigger in Russia and France than in Scandinavia - I suppose this could justify the yellow territories in Scandinavia - please note that Norway/Denmark as the Viking heartland is red for the Germans and in fact the Germans faced some substantial civil resistance in Denmark during WW2

    Holy Roman Empire:
    Yellow territories in Italy are there because of the history of the Holy Roman Empire. For centuries large parts of Italy were formally ruled by a German Emperor and only when the empire slowly disintegrated the Italian states regained independence. However even during the height of the empire the German rule was often more formally than directly noticeable, as in general the execution of power was less absolute during the Middle Ages. Still the rich Italian city taxes did pay taxes to the Emperor without much rebellion and at the end this is was matters isn't it :)

    So by and large the German stability map is a very neat conclusion of German history, very well thought of and rich in detail.
     
  17. DC123456789

    DC123456789 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2012
    Messages:
    3,060
    Location:
    Canada
    Good job! Now if only the other stability maps could find such a complete and detailed explanation...
     
  18. Tomorrow's Dawn

    Tomorrow's Dawn Heroes Never Die

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2009
    Messages:
    3,618
    Location:
    SF Bay Area
    ^Yeah, the main problem is that obviously, some of these choices are really skewed.
    They're all concentrated with Germany + Rome, and to an extent, Japan
    (which could really stand to be larger but minus Vancouver and more accurate).
    If Rhye had given EVERY civ an immigrant map, there wouldn't be so much crying foul.
    Every time someone wants a civ to have stability somewhere reasonable,
    it's already justified via any of those three maps.
     
  19. Leoreth

    Leoreth 心の怪盗団 Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    32,998
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Leblanc
    It should be noted, though, that the stability colors from dark green to red do not represent a sliding scale. What's red or yellow is more determined by properties of other civs than the civ you're currently looking at.
     
  20. The Wimp

    The Wimp Chieftain

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2011
    Messages:
    62
    Location:
    Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
    I thought for sure that china would get light green for manchuria, those guys get sinosized to the point where they were more chinese than mongolian
     

Share This Page