The Case for Eugenics in a Nutshell

[Masquerouge]

Mainly because we have destroyed or at least decimated all of the "primitive" civilizations that did not have the same beliefs.

I don't understand? I thought we were discussing whether or not any society had concepts or righteousness and civilization. My understanding is that no matter where or when, any society have/had those, an that's actually the basis for a group of humans to form a society.

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

The Case for Eugenics in a Nutshell
by Marian Van Court​

http://www.eugenics.net/papers/caseforeugenics.html

This is the definition of Eugenics I'm using (wiki):
"Eugenics is a social theory advocating the improvement of human hereditary traits through various forms of intervention.[1] The purported goals have variously been to create healthier, more intelligent people, save society's resources, and lessen human suffering. Earlier proposed means of achieving these goals focused on selective breeding, while modern ones focus on prenatal testing and screening, genetic counseling, birth control, in vitro fertilization, and genetic engineering. "​

Eugenics really that bad? I dont think so. The human race could advance at a much greater rate if we had artificial selection in place.

Oh, and PLEASE dont clog this thread up about Nazi's. Eugenics was an excuse for genocide, not eugenics causes genocides.


#6,000th post WooHoo!

yes I would advocate eugenics. I hate poor people who cannot suport their kids making more. There are too many humans holding back our great civilization. But nothing too brutal should be used to enforce this.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

The problem with eugenics is that the term is either too broad to have any meaning, or so narrow that it implies coercion of some sort.

 

[Masquerouge]

The problem with eugenics is that the term is either too broad to have any meaning, or so narrow that it implies coercion of some sort.

I would disagree. I'd say that the problem is that the term is so loaded it prevents any real discussion.

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

No, I think that you and I are not vastly in disagreement except over definitions.

I am not opposed to anyone performing screenings of any sort to avoid having fetuses with defetcs (although i don't think it is a moral imperative) and I certainly don't think that there is anything wrong with seeking an attractive spouse. And you don't think that the government should dictate who should breed.

 

[Dionysius]

<purged.>

 

[Eran of Arcadia]

Humans are what make our civilization great. The uneducated, lower class, nonintellectual human beings have just as much worth as the rich smart ones do.

 

[Whomp]

Humans are what make our civilization great. The uneducated, lower class, nonintellectual human beings have just as much worth as the rich smart ones do.

Spot on. I'm so much more educated than my grandfathter however he was so much smarter than I.

 

[HawkeyeGS]

Change the poll question. it is a double negetive. you are saying we should and the poll asks are we against. Again I prob should read things first

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

so... you need a certain amount of income to be allowed to breed?

if there were no poor menial workers, the rich would have to work
in those jobs, for lower pay, and gradually become the new poor.
if the wages were dramatically risen, prices would rise to compensate making no difference.

Point 1: exactly. as long as you can support and educate your children.
Point 2: did I say they would be phased out completely? I said there were too much.

 

[admiral-bell]

Offencive, in no way does this make me a nazi



Yes, given any combinations of environmental factors, a monkey will always be less intelegent than a human.



Why are they in the situation where they dont have the opportunity? Bit of grey matter could have dragged them out of that.

1. Eugenics supporter= Nazi
simplest piece of math ever.

2. True, But will a person with stupid parents be stupid, Unlikely, lots of intelligence has to do with environmental factors.

3. Culture and economics shape poor inner-city kids from birth, leaving them incapable of going to college.

Bonus: eugenic violates the first, fourth, and ninth amendments of the US constitution.

 

[Abaddon]

Intelligence is commonly thought to be roughly 50% based on genetics. No (current) environmental stimulus will allow a chimp to be as smart as a human.

As long as there is some base in genetics, we can manipulate it.


I think a "state/nation/island/sect/guild/scion of darkness/Brotherhood" should be created, with those only admitted who have proven "advantageous" genes.

While avoiding inbreeding and wotnot (cos they're not idiots) would this not be a good thing?

I mean take Steven Hawking.. has he any kids?
Chances are, his kids would be smarter than yours
Especially if combined with a smart female.

I think there should be hundreds of SH kids produced, in a factory.

YES.

Only breed for IQ?
What about Body Strength? (a stronger heart for example?)

Perhaps we can have several lines of breeding program. Humans must not shun this opportunity for betterment.

 

[Ecofarm]

But what happens when the Body Strength people overthrow the IQ people?


Perhaps we should avoid that and just create Body Strength IQ people who are better than everyone...

 

[Abaddon]

But what happens when the Body Strength people overthrow the IQ people?

I'll bite


Why would there be conflict created in the first place? What is there to assume the IQ were in "power" to be thrown over in the first place?

 

[Ecofarm]

Assuming you are not going to create people who are across the board better at everything, you are creating a most rigid class system.

Would the people who are good at smelling be more powerful than the body strength people?

 

[Abaddon]

But what happens when the Body Strength people overthrow the IQ people? Perhaps we should avoid that and just create Body Strength IQ people who are better than everyone...

AAAaaaah. edit!


BSIQ people would be much harder to breed for.. going after more than one trait would take many many many generations to get anywhere.

You want to breed the two lines seperatly and then combine once a pedegree is created.

 

[Ecofarm]

Why not three lines (The Time Machine)?

But I don't wanna be an orc; I wanna be a wood elf or a wizard. You be an orc, k?

 

[Abaddon]

Assuming you are not going to create people who are across the board better at everything, you are creating a most rigid class system.

Well that is of course impossible, you have to be selective, you can't just magically improve everything.

A class system of those who are involved in the system and those who are not?

But that is why I suggested it be some "sect". I'm not talking the whole human population.. just a select few who have opted in, and therefore are all accepted as the same class.


Its no more than suggesting those of Mensa are a different class to everyone else..

 

[Abaddon]

Why not three lines (The Time Machine)?

But I don't wanna be an ork. I wanna be a wood elf or a wizard. You be an ork, k?

TBH, the only line really importance is intellegence. Intellegence will invent ways beyond the ability of our frail bodies to evolve.

Technology is the way forward, but without (yet?) knowing how to augment our intellegence. We should augment ourselves so that we can reach that goal.

 

[Ecofarm]

Oh, I see. As soon as you gotta be the orc then we don't gotta have those no more.


Umm... Body Strength people? Bad news...



Who you gonna get rid of next?