The Question of Leftist Framentation

Its quite plainly clear that you've never been given the [crap] end of the stick in life, and probably have little idea of how the "other half" lives. A funny statement, that, since its far more than half who live that way.

I've worked harder, studied harder and put my ass on the line more than the average bloke. The infantry (I left private uni to volunteer during war, airborne) was not full of genius and I live in a poor neighborhood at school. I've had friends die and been divorced twice. I've lived in Africa without electricity and running water. If you take me for a fool in a blindfold with a silver spoon still in my mouth, perhaps you are not the intellectual I once thought.

I don't need a lecture on how the poor suffer from a fellow bougie college student in a new fur hat from vacation to red square.



Link to video.


Too bad you cannot understand me, that's the only thing quite plainly clear here.
 
Its quite plainly clear that you've never been given the [crap] end of the stick in life, and probably have little idea of how the "other half" lives. A funny statement, that, since its far more than half who live that way.

HAHAHA this is funny on so many levels coming from you. Didn'y you just take a vacation to Russia a couple months ago? Then start a thread about how you can't pay your heating bill? Get a grip, buddy, lol

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edit: dang, eco got to the Russia vacay with a ninja edit while I was posting this
 
That was a great song. Never heard it before, thanks for posting it.
 
I wouldn't change a thing. One of the reasons why I think the Democrats are so much more viable than the Republicans is their diversity of opinion. There are no loyalty oaths. There is no semi-official propaganda cable channel trying to tell everybody how to think. Different views are encouraged instead of ostracized. Democrat congressmen seem much more willing to vote for how they think their constituents want them to vote and how it actually reflects their own views, instead of toeing the party line regardless of how it is perceived by their constituents. While this unified front gives Republicans far more political power by doing so, I think it is largely self-defeating in the long run and will eventually fracture the party into smaller ones.

The same holds true for the current liberal vs conservative movements, at least in this country. The conservatives are now polarized to a great extent by the fundamentalist far-right. There are many hard-line stances that most feel they must take, or they will fall out of step with a great portion of the constituency they now desperately need to be elected.

And as Shadylookin pointed out on page one, I think it would be a lot like herding cats. While there are some fundamental concepts that virtually all liberals seem to agree upon, such as using the government to help the victims of capitalism and oppression and raising everybody's standard of living instead of just the affluent who need it the least, most of their agendas are radically different. If you have ever gone to an anti-war demonstration, about the only thing they all seem to agree upon is ending war. The movement is constantly in danger of being sidetracked by those who want to use that unity to strengthen their own political base.
 
In this country, they are basically one and the same. There really is not other place for leftists besides the Green Party, which is about as viable as the Libertarian Party.

And isn't that what is really being discussed here? Using the Republican Party's techniques of enforcing conformity to strengthen the liberal movement?
 
In this country, they are basically one and the same. There really is not other place for leftists besides the Green Party, which is about as viable as the Libertarian Party.

And isn't that what is really being discussed here? Using the Republican Party's techniques of enforcing conformity to strengthen the liberal movement?

We're talking about real leftists, socialists etc.
 
Well, sadly most of them aren't anymore as the party has drifted farther and farther to the right trying to get more voters. But they do still exist. Here's a few of the more prominent ones:

Dennis Kucinich, son of a union truck driver, and a member of a union himself, who thinks they are a necessity to stop exploitation of workers.


Link to video.

Russ Feingold, the only senator who voted against the original Patriot Act.


Link to video.

Bernie Sanders, the self-styled "democratic socialist" from Vermont.


Link to video.
 
Didn't all of that start off under Thatcher anyway? New Labour simply maintained or advanced existing policies in those regards. Only real exception is welfare, and that's not exactly pertinent.

Don't think so. I do know that Thatcher had turned the PM role into more of a Quasi-Presdential role and that was defnitly continued by Blair. Also she started using Statuory instruments which I think are the equivalent of executive orders which bypass the scrutinity of parliament - which, again has been continued by Blair. Although on all of these fronts, credit to Brown as he has not raped the constituition as much.
 
Don't think so. I do know that Thatcher had turned the PM role into more of a Quasi-Presdential role and that was defnitly continued by Blair. Also she started using Statuory instruments which I think are the equivalent of executive orders which bypass the scrutinity of parliament - which, again has been continued by Blair. Although on all of these fronts, credit to Brown as he has not raped the constituition as much.

You have no constitution to rape.
 
We do it just isn't written down. More of a mix of statuates and convention.

That's not a constitution. The only thing limiting the power of the British Government is custom, nothing more.
 
The only thing limiting the American government is the goodwill of people who customarily follow of a piece of paper. It does seem to be neglected repeatedly by officials, which calls into question the supposed greater American checks and balances limiting power.
 
If you had told me prior to 9/11 that the US government would invade and occupy Iraq on a pretext of lies, openly torture and murder innocent people, and monitor all domestic internet activity for the supposed protection of national security, I would have told you that you were nuts. There is no way any of that could possibly happen due to the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
 
I've worked harder, studied harder and put my ass on the line more than the average bloke.

I doubt the first part of that.

The infantry (I left private uni to volunteer during war, airborne) was not full of genius

I had a feeling you would play this card.

and I live in a poor neighborhood at school.

It couldn't have been that poor. That, or you're ashamed of your past. Based on other comments you've made in the past, its safe to assume so, because you seem to want everyone else to have just as hard a time as you, or you're trying to close to door behind you.

I've had friends die and been divorced twice.

That's not really what I'm talking about. John McCain has been divorced, too.

I've lived in Africa without electricity and running water. If you take me for a fool in a blindfold with a silver spoon still in my mouth, perhaps you are not the intellectual I once thought.

Yes I know you've lived in Africa; Kenya, right? And you still have no empathy for the cause of the poor? You must be sociopathic.

I don't need a lecture on how the poor suffer from a fellow bougie college student in a new fur hat from vacation to red square.

Fortunately you're getting one from a working class student with a faux fur hat that cost $10 who got in on the only vacation away from the East Coast he'll probably ever get to do, saved up for years for, and was essentially bankrupt by.

I make $10 an hour and I work in a kitchen in central Baltimore with some of the poorest mothereffers you've ever seen. Most of the cooks are ex-cons for everything from highway robbery to dope dealing, and aside from the college students working their way through school, none save for the manager have been to college. Most haven't completed school. I helped one of them, a 35 year old man who still lives, along with his older brother, with his mother in the same run-down rowhouse with sketchy heat and no air conditioning and doors permanently ajar, open a bank account for the first time, because he's just now gotten enough money to need to store it somewhere. His brother, a 39 year old man, cried when he had to go collect unemployment after getting fired from his job in the kitchen. he felt horrible and embarrassed that he had to life off the money of someone else. Those guys are the people I'm talking about, the people getting the crap end of the stick of life by no fault of their own. Those are the people you're hurting when you support Capitalism, those are the people who make this country go. They are myriad.
Compared to them, yes, I've lived a rather well-off live, but my origins are by no means more than lower-middle class; we only got a few presents each year, we lived in a house that was falling apart, and after saving since before I was born for my college, my parents only had enough for two years of an in-state school. I'm well aware of the privileged life I've had, and I want everyone to be able to have it as least as well as I have, if not better. I'm not claiming I've had the hardest of lives, but at least I'm honestly aware that people have it much worse than I, and at least I desire to help them, to fight for them, to fight alongside them, which is far more than you and your superiority complex can say. If you really came from the "rough" origins you boast, you've done a good job of burning the bridge behind you.

Oh, and the Dead Kennedys suck.

HAHAHA this is funny on so many levels coming from you. Didn'y you just take a vacation to Russia a couple months ago? Then start a thread about how you can't pay your heating bill? Get a grip, buddy, lol

What are your panties in a bunch about now?


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You have nothing to contribute to this thread.

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I don't think that the Democrats fit Cheezy's conception of leftist.

Indeed. I regard the Democrats and Republicans as two branches of the same party.
 
Cheezy, if I wasn't straight and already married, I'd be on my way over to propose to you...
 
Oh, and the Dead Kennedys suck. - Cheezy

Tell me about it. Anybody with a set listens to Bad Brains way before watered garbage like DK.
 
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