What do you think are the greatest Civiliations in history?

What is the greatest civilization in history?

  • Arabia

    Votes: 15 7.5%
  • America

    Votes: 42 21.1%
  • Celtic (Scots, Irish, Gauls, etc.)

    Votes: 9 4.5%
  • China

    Votes: 71 35.7%
  • Egypt

    Votes: 24 12.1%
  • England/Britain

    Votes: 58 29.1%
  • Ethiopia

    Votes: 3 1.5%
  • France

    Votes: 21 10.6%
  • German (Germany, Viking, Netherlands, etc.)

    Votes: 34 17.1%
  • Hebrew

    Votes: 13 6.5%
  • Hellenic (Greece, Ptolemies, etc.)

    Votes: 64 32.2%
  • Iberia (Spain, Portugal, etc.)

    Votes: 10 5.0%
  • Inca

    Votes: 5 2.5%
  • India

    Votes: 25 12.6%
  • Japan

    Votes: 8 4.0%
  • Mesoamerica (Aztecs, Mayans, etc.)

    Votes: 11 5.5%
  • Mesopotamia (Babylon, Sumer, etc.)

    Votes: 22 11.1%
  • Mongolia

    Votes: 13 6.5%
  • Persia

    Votes: 22 11.1%
  • Rome

    Votes: 101 50.8%
  • Russia

    Votes: 18 9.0%
  • SE Asia (Khmer, Vietnam, etc.)

    Votes: 2 1.0%
  • Turkey

    Votes: 9 4.5%
  • West Africa (Mali, Songhai, etc.)

    Votes: 5 2.5%
  • Other (Please specify)

    Votes: 10 5.0%

  • Total voters
    199
I would put architectural achievements under cultural power IMO. What about another factor: time of power.

Architectural achievements are inspired by and strengthen culture, but are truly products of scientific advancement of the civ, the wealth of the civ, and the civs ability to organize for the building. This means it needs catagory of its own.

I included time in power with military power and in part cultaral power (a culture generally collapses with the civ.
 
Went with Hellenic, Rome and Mongolia. Mongolia and Rome for power and Hellenic for scientific and cultural achievements.
 
Architectural achievements are inspired by and strengthen culture, but are truly products of scientific advancement of the civ, the wealth of the civ, and the civs ability to organize for the building. This means it needs catagory of its own.

architecture also makes other, often later, peoples notice the ancient civ making it more famous and well-known.
 
-Arabia
-Egypt
-France
-Inca
-Rome
-Other: Brazil. Why? Because I am brazilian. If the game hasn't been made in America, you probably was seeing a lot of threads saying "why U.S.A. needs to be a civilization" ;)

CAN SOMEONE EXPLAIN TO ME WHY THE PEOPLE FROM U.S.A. CALL UNITED STATES OF AMERICA SIMPLY AMERICA? SOMEONE KNOWS THAT AMERICA IS A CONTINENT, NOT A COUNTRY?

11 votes for Egypt, 26 for U.S.A. I think that no one know that Egypt ruled (past of rules..?) the world more than 3.000 years and America 100 years (- than this)
 
Egyptian civilization may have existed for more than 3000 years, but it is hard to think of a time when they ever 'ruled the world' so to speak. Generally speaking Egypt benefited more from the Mesopotamians and Greeks than the other way around, even at their peak. Much of those 3000 years were spent conquered by somebody else (Hyksos, Persians, Greeks, Romans). They were more interesting than important.
 
And USA doesn't exactly rule the world either

And USA never declared itself as an Empire (Even though it acts like one)
 
Egyptian civilization may have existed for more than 3000 years, but it is hard to think of a time when they ever 'ruled the world' so to speak. Generally speaking Egypt benefited more from the Mesopotamians and Greeks than the other way around, even at their peak. Much of those 3000 years were spent conquered by somebody else (Hyksos, Persians, Greeks, Romans). They were more interesting than important.

they didn't spend "much" of those 3000+ years under foreign domination.

the first real "foreign" domination came from the Hyksos, and we're not even sure what those guys are - although the most believed theory is that they were some "Asiatics", it is also likely as possible they were simply Egyptians that earned a bad name! anyhow, the Hyksos domination wasn't complete, only in the delta, and lasted less than two centuries, if i am correct.

the next foreign domination came centuries later, in the late 700s BC, when the Nubian guy named Piye (i think, i forgot, maybe his father or son, can't remember) "invaded" Egypt. however, Nubia, being a Egypto-phile, loved the Egyptians so much that they let the Egyptian rulers keep their titles, the Nubians only being their "fuedal master", so to speak. more or less, the Nubians acted like the Egyptians. they were pushed out of Egypt after 75 years (about) by the Assyrians, who took Egypt for a short while, and then left, then the Babylonians, who *almost* took over Egypt, then the Persians came, who took over Egypt twice. the Ptolemis who came to own Egypt after Alexander left were Hellenes, but their last, Cleopatra, was a true Egyptian at heart.

anyhow, calculating from such, Egypt spent about 700 years of its existence AT MOST under full or partial domination. theres still a lot left.


in no way did the Mesopotamians or Greeks influence Egypt. that is an older more conservative view, made in the days when people still thought Caucasoids were superior. these days, some are starting to suggest it was even the other way around, espeiclally in the case of the Greeks. however, i won't go into these theories, as its a waste of time.

the Egyptians, now, had three "peaks": Old Kingdom, Middle Kingdom, and New Kingdom.

during the Old Kingdom, Egypt relatively kept itself in its core area, so i won't go much there. during the Middle Kingdom, however, Egypt began really expanding, into Nubia and sending a campaign here and there into the Levant (possibly even a full-scale invasion which has been claimed interestingly by some to go as far north as the Causcus and even Scythia!). the third peak, during the New Kingdom, Egypt expanded way south all the way nearly to Kush, and north up to the Euphrates river.

in the world known to them, (the near east), Egypt was really the "best" nation, competing with the Hittites, Mitanni, Minoans, Assyrians, Babylonians, and others for land, money, and well, yea, prosperity - this was not unlike the European age of colonization, with competing Euroipean powers - there were even Egyptian "colonies", more rather, "vassal states", in which rulers sucumbed to Egyuptian culture and customs. in this age of competition, Egypt was the "britain", more or less.

now im ranting again... anyhow, point is, i think some really downplay Egypt's capabiilities. Egypt was, after all, the world's first real nation.
 
i was kind of joking, im sure you know that. :) anyhow, i found ONE OF the definitions of liberalism on the internet, besides all that political movement and philosophy definitions:

1. the quality or state of being liberal, as in behavior or attitude.

so, in theory, it is possible for "liberalism", according to this definition, to have existed since the dawn of time or whatever.

That makes sense. Although when you say "ism", or "ist", you usually mean that it's gone beyond a simple attitude and into a more specific agenda. The word "liberal", with a small L, means tolerant. But to be into liberalism or liberalist usually means free religion, free markets, free press -- notions that are necessarily modern (nobody really knew what the heck a market was, and there was no such thing as the press... even the notion of free religion probably didn't matter before 1000 BC, where everyone believed in the same pantheon of gods, but simply preferred one god over the other).

Probably a better example is conserve versus conservative. Or commune versus communist.
 
A lot of new historical study is exploring the influence of the Egyptians on the Minoans and the influence of the Minoans on the Greeks. It's a controversial area, because it contradicts a lot of the theories of history established a long time ago.

But that was in the 1800s, which were an unfortunately racist time. Theories of scientific racism were a huge part of anthropology and archeology back then. For that reason, there was a lot of effort to tie together the histories of India and Europe, and exclude or distinguish the Indo-Aryan tradition from that of the Jewish or African peoples. Because of that, the 'common sense' belief is that Egyptians and Hebrews did not offer not much more than a few quaint ideas about religion. This 'common sense' is starting to change, when there's more and more scholarship to suggest they offered a lot of science and philosophy.
 
A lot of new historical study is exploring the influence of the Egyptians on the Minoans and the influence of the Minoans on the Greeks. It's a controversial area, because it contradicts a lot of the theories of history established a long time ago.

But that was in the 1800s, which were an unfortunately racist time. Theories of scientific racism were a huge part of anthropology and archeology back then. For that reason, there was a lot of effort to tie together the histories of India and Europe, and exclude or distinguish the Indo-Aryan tradition from that of the Jewish or African peoples. Because of that, the 'common sense' belief is that Egyptians and Hebrews did not offer not much more than a few quaint ideas about religion. This 'common sense' is starting to change, when there's more and more scholarship to suggest they offered a lot of science and philosophy.

agreed. (you can skip to the bottom if you want :))

i myself am starting to be convinced that it thuogh Egypt was not the mother of the west, i dont think Greece shuld have that position anymore.

back in the good ol' days of historical research in the 1800s, the often rascist views of the researchers really, i think, messed up a lot of research and skewed us from what the Egyptians, and other civiilizations, really were. the old view about the origins of Egypt was that some "white" or even Aryan peoples from the middle east suddenly poured in out of nowhere during the time when Egyptian culture was developing, way before statehood; and suddenly, when these Aryans came, Egyptians suddenly knew how to invent concepts like Pharaohs. there is more recent archaeological research that the Egyptian origns may not have come from the north, but actually from the south - excavations in what was once Nubia unearthed artifacts with clearly Egyptian symbolicism - like the boat to the stars (or whatever it is, i can't remember), pharaohs, etc. these artifacts dated to the Predynastic Period of Egypt, that is to say, Egypt before the pharaohs. if more of these artifacts are found, and are consistent, then it is possible, that if Egypt did not originate from Nubia, then at the least it had some connection.

anyhow, to add to the Egyptians amazingness, newer research shows that the Egyptians were excellent in the field of medicine, able to do even some types of primitive surgery; they had excellent knowledge of herbs; there have been some well-pronounced claims that the Egyptians may have even known of the concept of pi and various other mathematical thingies. and if the Egyptians built the pyramids and not the Atlanteans :p, then surely the correlations between the Pyramids' and the stars must have shown the Egyptians had an excellent tradition in Astronomy. anyhow, even if all those new developments are not as great as they seem, and even if Atlanteans did build the Pyramids and the Sphnix, the Egyptians still have the architectural and engineering capabilities to build amazing things - Abu Simbel, huge Obelisks, the Valley of the Kings, the Mud-Brick Pyramids of the Middle Kingdom; the Egyptians even attempted to build a "Suez Canal" (and they nearly suceeded as well)! The Pharaoh Necho even sent some Phoenicians on a sailing trip that may have sailed all aorund Africa (though this is somewhat unlikely and subject to debate)!

Even so, the poweress of the Egyptians in the Ancient World is impressive. The world they were in, that they knew of, consisted of this much - the northeastern corner of Africa (including Nubia, Kush, and Ethiopia), the Levant, Mesopotamia, parts of Persia, Asia Minor, the Balkans (including Greece), the Causacus perhaps, and maybe a link to the Indus. thgouhout all of this, the known world, Egypt was the more powerful. but this was not only during the New Kingdom, as many believe.

After the end of the New Kingdom, Egypt still shone a few more times, though it was on the decline. the Libyan pharaoh Shoshenk, possibly the Biblical Sishak (i think thats his name), sent a campaign into the Levant. a century or two later, the Nubian Pharaohs of Egypt secured a large empire in Africa, once again leading Egypt to rise to power, only to be stopped by the blood-thirsty Assyrians; after the Assyrians left Egypt in peace, the Babylonians came, but then came the reign of the last powerful native Pharaoh of Egypt - Ahmose II, who led his armies to defeat the Babylonians and conquer Cyprus and half the Levant, and to secure alliances with the Greeks to stop the impending Persians. had he not died, i am sure he would have sucessfully held out the Persian invasions, as he was an excellent general. after the Persians finally got kicked out by Alexander, the Ptolemies, came, and although they weren't technically Egyptian, i'll consider them so, just for the sake of something. the Ptolemies built the Great Lighthouse of Alexandria, the Great Library of Alexandria... and their last, Cleopatra, so famous in history, could nearly have been master of the Mediteranean along with her lover Mark Anthony, making Egypt, not Rome, mistress of the world.



anyhow, point is, that is partly why i voted for Egypt. :D
 
I'm entering this discussion!

Cybrxkhan,

1. You forgot to vote for Nam!!! I even voted for you!!!!
2. Egypt certeinly has some roots to Nubia. In particular some gods were of Nubian origine
 
I'm entering this discussion!

Cybrxkhan,

1. You forgot to vote for Nam!!! I even voted for you!!!!
2. Egypt certeinly has some roots to Nubia. In particular some gods were of Nubian origine

Well maybe nam wasn't the greatest nation of all time.:) :p

Why have you mentioned nubia?:confused:

Nubia is well just a filler civ, all they did was occupy space.
 
Nubia is well just a filler civ, all they did was occupy space.

Wow, what an offensive and uninformed thing to say. Nubia had all kinds of interesting cultural achievements, and continued to do so well into the Middle Ages, long after Egypt had been conquered by the Arabs.
 
Humanity is the greatest civ in history so far.
 
We are doomed :(
Haha

Don't worry. :)

Do you know the single most important trait humanity has so far ?
Could it be inteligence? adaptability ?
Neah, it's:
Spoiler :
LUCK
 
What a load of subjective nationalist crap this thread is.

Someone define "greatness" for me and tell me how to quantify it. Then I'll vote.
 
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