Why do european countries compare themselves to the US as the EU?

[Ingvina Freyr]

That can be argued, but not here since it's off topic.

Anyway here are some numbers for the European Union wich could be interesting for all of us to look into.

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Strange enough I remember instances where single European countries were compared to the US (like social mobility index, freedom of press, ect.) where the comparison was in favour for the European country and then the answer was like: Well, [insert name] has just [insert number] million inhabitants just like a single state, I am sure Northern California or the state of Washington are even better in [insert area].

I guess each side picks where it looks favourably.

Imo, A comparison EU - USA or Countries - States makes sense concerning the size, but unfortunately not all types of rankings are made on a whole EU scale (like the freedom of press).

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

Countries are to hard to compare so I say we shouldn't compare them, honestly what is the point. Just because something is stistically proven doesn't change anything.

 

[Goa]

Countries are to hard to compare so I say we shouldn't compare them, honestly what is the point. Just because something is stistically proven doesn't change anything.

The point (or at least one point) is that a lot of political decisions are very complex, and quite often they bear side effects which can't be anticipated. So by looking on different, comparable countries/political entities, which are driving different policies, quite often you can try to study the empirical result of a given decision.
Oh and than of course there is this "my penis is longer than yours" thingy

 

[PrinceOfLeigh]

Why do european countries compare themselves to the US as the EU?

I'm not sure that many of them do. The only time I've seen it done is either as a pointer to the EU's economic progress or if someone wants to score points against a Yank on CFC. Either way you have to ask yourself, as others have mentioned, why you care. It perhaps ties into StoneAlex's thread.

3. They have common federal laws that do not differ from country to country.

Hummm. Not familiar with EU Law are you?

Primary Legislation in the form of Treatys is binding upon each state as are secondary legislation such as Regulations and Directives. Perhaps you have a point that under a directive the method of enforcing the rule differs from State to state but the rule remains the same.

Then of course there is the case law established in the European Court of Justice, and the ECHR, which become binding on all Members.

Countries like France, Germany or Britain were dominant powers in the world of 19th century, but nowadays? Even if they tried very hard, they simply lack the size of the US, China, India, Brazil, even Indonesia or Nigeria.

The logical choice is to gang up and cooperate. Of course they don't like it at first, but it's the only rational option they have.

Small European countries know that for a long time, it's the bigger players who have to appreciate it.

Since when has large land size = granteed economic success?

 

[Winner]

Since when has large land size = granteed economic success?

Did I say that?

 

[PrinceOfLeigh]

Did I say that?

Apologies. I thought that's what you meant with:

Even if they tried very hard, they simply lack the size of the US, China, India, Brazil, even Indonesia or Nigeria.

What did you mean?

 

[storealex]

Who's we?

All the people who voted no, or non. Or would have done so.

It is rather funny fact, that even the nationalist co-operate trans-nationally in the current Europe. Of course, their goal is to destroy the EU and restore that old world of European power politics, but in the process, they in fact prove that trans-national cooperation is necessary.

Yeah I always found that rather ironic too. Btw Im not against EU, just to make sure you know that. I like EU, but it is going too far too quickly, and much of EU isn't mature enough to me being ruled by them. Scandinavia is ahead of EU in several apects. Slowly, countries like France are beginning to look north, to see which innovations they can implementate themselves, but it's a slow process, and meanwhile they continue to pass medieval laws in for example stuff like the environment.

 

[mrtn]

In the past, when the US and Europe split, there was a large red country east of Europe that made everyone realize that they were better off putting their disagreements aside and sticking together.

That's no longer there. There is no further reason for the EU and the USA to cooperate, except perhaps on issues where it is in the interest of all states to cooperate (such as dealing with pirates, who are enemies of all nations).

You don't think it moved a fair bit to the south east then? One billion rice eaters can't be wrong, or something like that?

 

[batteryacid]

80% of the laws passed in Austria this year were ratified EU laws, and its similar in other EU countries.

Most differences are in Taxation and crime laws , but I think even in the US they are not the same in every state.

 

[HannibalBarka]

That is not always true. I definetly think french cuisine, not EU cuisine, is by far much better than USan. French wine are definetly way better than those of the US, and finally French fashion is by far better than the american ;-)

 

[Peri]

What is your angle on this Xanikk999?

As people have said we have one currency and function as one economically and there are always closer steps to integration.
Using CFC as an example the European posters here appear to be more united in their views about many subjects than the US posters. Unity is more than just political structures.

 

[sonorakitch]

In the past, when the US and Europe split, there was a large red country east of Europe that made everyone realize that they were better off putting their disagreements aside and sticking together.

That's no longer there. There is no further reason for the EU and the USA to cooperate, except perhaps on issues where it is in the interest of all states to cooperate (such as dealing with pirates, who are enemies of all nations).

There is this other big thing called culture. The cultural alikeness of Europe and America will keep the two regions together for a long time. The big red thing you speak of wasn't really a threat before WWII.

~Chris

 

[Agarwaen]

I think they should compare the EU with the USA once they have an united foreign policy, it doesn't matter how they are organized internally, but if the act as one in the internacional arena than it matters

 

[Verbose]

Right now the EU means squat. Its just a socialist pipe dream. It has very minimal power. If they want to compare the EU to America..well then lets do NAFTA to the EU. Whats fair is fair...

All the EU is is a glorified NAFTA.

What's definately not dreamlike about is that it has made Europeans work together, not kill each other.

That's one of the major reasons, and successes, of the EU.

And if NAFTA was anything like the EU all those Mexicans slinking into the US would be perfectly legal.

Not to mention the US would be forking out billions upon billions of US tax dollars for structural investments in the other member states. And would have been doing so for decades. (It might actually be a good idea if NAFTA worked like that.)

No, NAFTA is nothing like the EU.

 

[Winner]

Apologies. I thought that's what you meant with:

What did you mean?

Power. You may be extremely well developed, economically speaking, but if you're of a size of... say Luxembourg, you simply don't matter in the global arena. That's why you have to find a lot of allies, make compromises, find common interests and then push them forward.

 

[Winner]

And if NAFTA was anything like the EU all those Mexicans slinking into the US would be perfectly legal.

Good point, but they may say that the US would come up with "transitional period", like Germany and others did in the case of new EU members.

Not to mention the US would be forking out billions upon billions of US tax dollars for structural investments in the other member states. And would have been doing so for decades. (It might actually be a good idea if NAFTA worked like that.)

No, NAFTA is nothing like the EU.

Sure it isn't. It is free trade zone.

On the ladder of economic integration, you have many steps:

0) Supposed cooperation area (most of IGO's - basically they have mouths full of cooperation, but nothing real is done to put it into practice)
1) Preferential trading area
2) Free trade area (NAFTA)
3) Customs union
4) Common market
5) Economic and monetary union (this is what EU is at present)
6) Complete economic integration (this is what EU would be, if some socialist idiots didn't shoot the directive opening a free flow of services)

 

[Steph]

I dont mind competition but if they arent taxed as one country or as a federation they really arent one country.

Is VAT the same in every american states?

 

[Reno]

Just a comment on this discussion, the point of the EU (or Internationalism in general for that matter) is not to take the sovernity of member states away. But to promote total cooperation between the member states through laws common to all states, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internationalism_(politics)

Sure it isn't. It is free trade zone.

On the ladder of economic integration, you have many steps:

0) Supposed cooperation area (most of IGO's - basically they have mouths full of cooperation, but nothing real is done to put it into practice)
1) Preferential trading area
2) Free trade area (NAFTA)
3) Customs union
4) Common market
5) Economic and monetary union (this is what EU is at present)
6) Complete economic integration (this is what EU would be, if some socialist idiots didn't shoot the directive opening a free flow of services)

I agree with this completely.

 

[REDY]

Maybe its because Americans dont know small countries. Its older but still nice: http://www.antiusa.webz.cz/galerie/vlajka1.jpg

Nice Chechnyan flag