Why Islam is a problem for the integration of immigrants

[Synobun]

Compared to now.

I'm not sure that stands up to scrutiny. The mere circumstance of needing to occupy another sovereign nation's territory disproves the argument that the region is stable. If it was stable, it wouldn't need to be occupied.

 

[RomanKing]

I'm not sure that stands up to scrutiny. The mere circumstance of needing to occupy another sovereign nation's territory disproves the argument that the region is stable. If it was stable, it wouldn't need to be occupied.

No rational thinking person can say the Middle East is more stable now than when GB was in office. In fact, the conflict has now spread to North Africa and into Europe.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I'm not sure that stands up to scrutiny. The mere circumstance of needing to occupy another sovereign nation's territory disproves the argument that the region is stable. If it was stable, it wouldn't need to be occupied.

It would if you were a blood drenched totalitarian and consider that the only "stability" comes from you having control of the territory and killing all who oppose you.

 

[RomanKing]

It would if you were a blood drenched totalitarian and consider that the only "stability" comes from you having control of the territory and killing all who oppose you.

Sometimes that is the only way.

That's what ISIS is doing, so unless you're going to adopt the left's "do-nothing policy" continue to allow them to kill all that oppose them. You're going to have to kill the ISIS barbarians.

 

[Synobun]

No rational thinking person can say the Middle East is more stable now than when GB was in office. In fact, the conflict has now spread to North Africa and into Europe.

Right, but nobody is disputing that point. The point being disputed is that the region was stable under GW's administration due to the occupation. Something being "more stable than x" does not make it stable.

 

[El_Machinae]

Your so-called "plan" has been nothing but an utter failure of death, violence, chaos, and destruction. It also fails to provide any solution to the crisis.

I will agree that so-called 'liberals' had a great deal of political power in the world as Syria collapsed and ISIS appeared. The constructive application of power is something that doesn't seem to lend itself well to iterative improvement. Conservatives bungle it. Liberals bungle it. We have only a couple examples in history of it 'working', and it seems to be hard to replicate.

I don't know if there's a 'solution' to the crisis other than ones that actually require time. Let refugees flee, and militarily place the crisis zones back under the control of governments.

But without bleeding off the strain of ever-mounting numbers of refugees, the crisis cannot get better. And certainly not with a lower body count. Like I said, I have no problem with the idea of local safe zones. But that doesn't change the number of refugees that already exist and need to be redistributed amongst liberal nations.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Sometimes that is the only way.

And for some people it is clearly the preferred way.

 

[RomanKing]

But without bleeding off the strain of ever-mounting numbers of refugees, the crisis cannot get better. And certainly not with a lower body count. Like I said, I have no problem with the idea of local safe zones. But that doesn't change the number of refugees that already exist and need to be redistributed amongst liberal nations.

You have no solution. Your "solution" is to keep taking millions of people into Europe until the crisis magically ends itself. The crisis needs to be brought to an end and all of these people cannot stay in Europe. They are attacking civilians and causing conflict within Europe.

So unless you want a regional conflict that has already spread to 3 continents, to turn into a World War measures need to be taken and they need to be taken now.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

So unless you want a regional conflict that has already spread to 3 continents, to turn into a World War measures need to be taken and they need to be taken now.

"Measures" like a little genocide to resolve the refugee problem?

 

[RomanKing]

"Measures" like a little genocide to resolve the refugee problem?

Terrorists aren't a race. Get a grip.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Terrorists aren't a race. Get a grip.

On what?

 

[RomanKing]

Reality.

 

[Broken_Erika]

Most of those refugees will go home when they are reasonably sure they wont get imprisoned, shot or blown up when they return.

 

[RomanKing]

Most of those refugees will go home when they are reasonably sure they wont get imprisoned, shot or blown up when they return.

I can't even... just wow.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Reality.

While "terrorists aren't a race" is a pretty simple and straightforward fact, the reality is that you interjected it as if it had something to do with the conversation at hand, and it didn't. So if we have slipped away from reality I'd say it is you that led the way.

Now, back at the right wing extremist fantasy that "sending in an occupying force to 'put down all resistance'" is something other than a call for genocide...

 

[El_Machinae]

You have no solution. Your "solution" is to keep taking millions of people into Europe until the crisis magically ends itself. The crisis needs to be brought to an end and all of these people cannot stay in Europe. They are attacking civilians and causing conflict within Europe.

So unless you want a regional conflict that has already spread to 3 continents, to turn into a World War measures need to be taken and they need to be taken now.

Please don't throw in the word 'magically'. It's denigrating. The crisis doesn't magically end itself. I know that. And you should just assume that I know that. You snipped out where I hinted at the part of a solution. It requires military conquest of un-controlled territories, and having those territories placed back under governmental controls. That's an ongoing process. But even an escalation of this process will require handling refugees. I asked before, what's the acceptable ratio of radical to non-radical deaths? The places where the people are fleeing have ongoing murders happening at ratios vastly, vastly higher than the ratios we see in countries that accept refugees.

Are you performing some calculation, where some number of refugees are more expendable than European citizens? Are you suspecting that your version of refugee camps will create fewer extremists? My assumption is that radicalization is less likely to occur once the integration process has begun than if someone is kept in a camp. It's like jails causing more criminality.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Please don't throw in the word 'magically'. It's denigrating.

He knows it is denigrating. That's why he used it. It's not worth the effort to maintain a pretense that you don't know what we are dealing with here El Mac. We can't use the word, but there's no point pretending we are dealing with anything but what we have here.

 

[Traitorfish]

I stated that islamic terrorism is a political problem and so was Nazism. The solution to both was open war, occupation, and internment camps.

I agree, the solution to Nazism is putting all the people we don't like into camps wait what

 

[Broken_Erika]

Yeah 'cause military intervention has worked so well for us. Use War occupation and internment camps to crush ISIS and watch as the next group rises from it's ashes stronger than ever. Doesn't really matter what we do it's going to blow up in our face here.

 

[RomanKing]

Please don't throw in the word 'magically'. It's denigrating. The crisis doesn't magically end itself. I know that. And you should just assume that I know that. You snipped out where I hinted at the part of a solution. It requires military conquest of un-controlled territories, and having those territories placed back under governmental controls. That's an ongoing process. But even an escalation of this process will require handling refugees. I asked before, what's the acceptable ratio of radical to non-radical deaths? The places where the people are fleeing have ongoing murders happening at ratios vastly, vastly higher than the ratios we see in countries that accept refugees.

Are you performing some calculation, where some number of refugees are more expendable than European citizens? Are you suspecting that your version of refugee camps will create fewer extremists? My assumption is that radicalization is less likely to occur once the integration process has begun than if someone is kept in a camp. It's like jails causing more criminality.

The left wants to maintain the status quo although they know it does not propose any end to the crisis, since any possible solution means the end of their worldview and ideology.

Your ideology and worldview are dead whether you like it or not. It has failed and it has been utterly rejected throughout the West. You're only delaying the inevitable, not preventing it and the more the left drags it's heels the worse it's going to be for them when the time finally does come.

I agree, the solution to Nazism is putting all the people we don't like into camps wait what

The allies put Germans and Japanese into internment camps.