2020 US Election (Part Two)

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Winstons were fine. Didn't care for Camels. We were trying to be all not our parents' generation, which smoked the cowboy killers. Couple friends that would bring those back if they did the run. Or Pall Mall. Wound up smoking a bunch of Pall Mall when taxes went up before hand rolling. Couldn't ever quite get to the point where I didn't filter them though. I didn't like sparks in my mouth and I was too cheap not to smoke it basically all the way down.

You know, I'd have probably tried more Newports, I remember them being good, if they ever went on the 3 for 2 promo sales, but they never did.
 
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Phew... That's hardcore. Winstons flavor is... I'll call it an acquired taste. That was the one brand where if I was bumming and the person had them, I'd often reconsider and decline. Reds are harsh, but Winstons are just... the taste... Camels were no prize either, but i could deal... with Winstons it was just too much.

Newport is pretty much the Menthol of choice for most Menthol folks I've encountered, something about fiberglass, but that may just be an urban legend. My very last one in this life was a Newport. I gave the rest of the pack away, literally to a random stranger on the street. I asked her "You smoke Newports right?" to which she replied "Of course!" so I gave her the pack and she looked at me like I'd given her a hundred bucks. But that's how popular they are, I knew she smoked them without even asking.
 
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I may have been drunk on those occasions, if I'm being honest. They weren't regular cycle. Then again, I just rediscovered Hamm's, so it's not like I have good taste, really.

I miss the smell of people out smoking the wood/plastic tip cigars. Never liked them myself, but they smell really good when somebody else has them. Must have been pipe tobacco in there, that's always kind of like that. Tinderbox used to have a peach melba that smelled good enough to eat, until you were the one smoking it. :lol:
 
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I may have been drunk on those occasions, if I'm being honest. They weren't regular cycle. Then again, I just rediscovered Hamm's, so it's not like I have good taste, really.

I miss the smell of people out smoking the wood/plastic tip cigars. Never liked them myself, but they smell really good when somebody else has them. Must have been pipe tobacco in there, that's always kind of like that. Tinderbox used to have a peach melba that smelled good enough to eat, until you were the one smoking it. :lol:
Yeah that was definitely the pipe tobacco. Black & Milds had the chocolatey smell and the plastic tips for the nice plastic fumes if you smoked them all the way to the end. Hav-A-Tampa had the sweet cherry-ish smell and the wood tips with the sweet glaze on them... very nice.

To add an obligatory fig leaf of relevance to our discussion... :mischief:, I've just read, Courtesy of Gallup polling, that "Democrats are somewhat more likely than Republicans to smoke cigarettes. One in four Democrats (25%) smoke cigarettes, while 21% of Republicans do. Twenty-eight percent of independents smoke."
 
Hm, how does vote-by-mail work in the US? Don't you have to be registered, as when voting at the station?
And if so, how is registration right verified by mail/online?

One registers to vote and requests a mail in ballot.
II don't know of any online voting. Mail-in ballots must be signed by the voter.

Given almost half the electorate (?) doesn't vote anyway, would it be very difficult/impossible to forge votes of people you (for whatever reason) know don't plan to vote?
If you KNEW someone wasn't going to vote, I guess you could steal the ballot from his mailbox [felony], forge his signature [felony], and use it to vote [felony]. 3 felonies for 1 extra vote? Hardly seems worth it.
 
I seem to be wrong, according to CNBC

"Because absentee ballots and early voting ballots are retrievable, if someone tries to get around the system, their ballot can be retrieved and not counted, so it will not affect the outcome of an election."
This is why mail in ballots aren't counted as they come in. They are kept in the envelope until they can be compared to the election day live voter rolls.

However, if there is a mail in ballot received and the in person voting rolls show that a ballot was cast in that person's name there should be an investigation before the mail in ballot is discarded. If you mailed in your ballot properly and someone voted falsely using your name nothing can be done to retrieve their fraudulent vote, but yours should still be counted. Large numbers of intentional double voters will bog down the system, which is probably what Trump is actually after.

Hopefully, states respond effectively to this ploy. Poll workers need to emphasize to people who show up to vote that if they have already mailed in their ballot casting a second ballot without providing instruction to dispose of their mailed in ballot is in fact a crime.
 
Yeah, states can be confronted by thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of double vote investigations that have to be completed before the results can be certified when we already know they are up against the certification deadline. Plus Trump is undoubtedly going to be spewing "many people say that 'they' just keep producing more ballots until the Democrats win" to create enormous pressure to not only meet the deadline but to "just lose those ballots we can't deal with them." I think it is pretty clear that his objective is to create an impression that "the US is no longer capable of managing an election, guess I just have to stay on."
 
The entire campaign to stop Donald Trump being elected president was that he was "a racist, a liar, a misogynist, a rapist, a rich white male, a fascist, and a creep". Joe Biden is all these things and more, so if the campaign against Trump was based off these things why is Joe Biden running for president for the Democrats?

I don’t think any democrat has actual fascist predilections. As for the rest of it the difference of supporting policies that reinforce those thing a versus tryin got support policies that address those things is obviously very important. Trump runs into the fear, anger, racism, and fascism. Biden is garbage but at least he’s not that.
 
bog down the system, which is probably what Trump is actually after.
This exactly. What Trump is hoping for, is that the reliably red states get called for him early (which FOX News will be happy to oblige) so that he can say he is "winning"... then, declare that all the states that are being reported as "Too early to call" due to mail-in ballots are, in-fact dutifully rigging the vote totals so that Biden wins.

He just wants to throw the whole process into question so that he can justify refusing to concede. If we get to a point in the night where most or all of the states expected to go for Trump have been called, but then he happens to lose a key state, Pennsylvania for example, or Wisconsin, that's when the news outlets are going to start projecting that he will inevitably lose as "the math isn't there for him anymore". At that point Trump will go berserk, crying conspiracy and foul, because "the dishonest media is saying that I will lose the election even though I'm clearly winning, sleepy Joe only has 2 states and I've won 10! Conspiracy?? TREASON???"
 
Hm, how does vote-by-mail work in the US? Don't you have to be registered, as when voting at the station?
And if so, how is registration right verified by mail/online?

Being the US, there are likely 50 sets of rules with varying degrees of (intentional) incompetence.
 
Burger not pizza.
I was answering to the part about Big macs.
The Wrap, 2 September 2020 - "Arnold Schwarzenegger Offers to Pay to Reopen Closed Polling Places Across the South"

Ahnuld said:
Most people call closing polls voter suppression. Some say it is “budgetary.” What if I made it easy & solved the budgetary issue? How much would it cost to reopen polling places?

This is a serious question. Is closing polling stations about making it harder for minorities to vote, or is it because of budgets? If you say it’s because of your budget, let’s talk.

Hrm. Well. Okay.

Spoiler :
notsureifserious.jpg

If he's being sincere, I guess I'm okay with him calling his fellow Republicans' bluff. And I guess I'm curious now: How much does it cost?
I remember that the Ahnold paid for an entire scene of Terminator 3 that the producers didn't want to include because it would be too expensive to shoot. I know it was over a million dollars so he's done it before.
There will be no clean election with Dump involved, feel free to convince me otherwise.
So who knows what will happen..
That is why it is usually estimated that the Democrats need an advantage of at least X% 8depending on the year) conveniently spread in this or that way across several states to actually achieve victory. Any narrow victory in numbers of votes cast results in the electoral college and/or Congress defaulting to Republican.
 
Have you ever played Supreme Ruler 2020? They had that exact scenario where each state became its own nation and DC became an independent city-state. For maximum difficulty I played as DC and although it took forever, I eventually reunified the US and conquered the entire world. Fun times.

Does it have foreign intervention from outside taking advantage of the U.S. highly weakened and divided state, or is that aspect just kind of brushed aside?

I mean he advocates for the murder of protesters basically so. . .

His responses to protests are, despite a lot of going on here, and a lot of the media coverage, VERY limp and wet-noodle, as an authoritarian leader, compared to East Germany 1953, Hungary 1956, Prague 1968, Tiananmen Square 1989, and Tripoli and Damascus 2011. Even though actual Fascist-regimes by proper and accurate definition in the 1920's to 1940's didn't face peaceful protests of any significant motive note on their home soil, no doubt their responses would have been AT LEAST as brutal.

Could be! The McDonald’s Filet-o-Fish was developed by a Catholic franchisee as Catholics don’t eat red meat on Fridays, and founder Ray Kroc thought it was a stupid idea. He had a better idea: the Hula Burger, replacing the beef patty with a thick slice of pineapple.

The Hula Burger never took off, so can we deductively reason that the pineapple, if not ethnic, is at least Protestant? :lol:

But like, it's from South America which makes it roughly the same as a tomato or a potato...

Actually here it's a symbol of Queensland, our most racist state. And also is an essential part of a complete Australian hamburger.

Loaded-Aussie-Burger-DSC06213-1-1-2.jpg


So make of that what you will.

Yep, lightly pickled slices of beetroot are also essential. The interplay of the sweet and tart pineapple and/or pickled beetroot serve roughly the function your dill pickles do, I guess, in contrasting the savoury flavours.

When I make my burgers at home the basics are lettuce tomato onion and beetroot along with cheese.

That picture you posted almost the same as my local fish and chip shop.

I normally hold the beet though.

Home made effort.
View attachment 568074

I think it's protestant, like Amadeus said. My sister made it to Hawaii for what is likely to be her farmgirl big life trip, she loved the Dole plantation(is that use of the word still allowed? Did that blow over?). Brought home a pineapple shirt for me as a souvenir. I wore it a lot. Wore it when taking out of town guys to Chicago for a make-up rain delay game at Wrigley Field near boys town the night before the Pride parade. It was very confusing with the wedding ring, but it was at least friendly. Francis seemed like a really cool dude. Danced some. Shared my smokes. Turned down the coke.


I believe there's one or more "sandwich thread." Perhaps requesting a thread move of these posts?

The US President openly calls for election fraud, and you guys are discussing burgers?

At this point, a vote for Trump is essentially treason.

At this point, a vote for any candidate who runs on either the label of the Republican Party of the United States OR the Democratic Party of the United is an act of treason against any Americans who values their nation, it's long-term advancement or betterment, and equal justice for all (including elected politicians).

Are you alright

You ask this question a lot. The real question is, "are you alright?"

So you are admitting Trump is an incompetent puppet? Whose puppet?

He doesn't seem at all to be a puppet. But he is incompetent. Far too incompetent to be the cunning, terrifying political mastermind whose going to establish an absolute totalitarian dictatorship and destroy utterly the U.S. Constitution and all political opposition if he wins in 2020. He obviously doesn't have THAT particular capacity in him.

I knew you would try some variation of "it's not the federal government's job to handle a pandemic," because you're very predictable ;), but I did not expect this large dollop of condescension to go with the pro-death argument.

"Pro-death argument?" That's an interesting term. Please tell me, other than Jains, Taoists, certain small Christian denominations like the Quakers, the Amish, the Hutterites, the old Anabaptists, and a few others, and several specifically pacificisitc socio-political ideologies - representing an infintissimal percentage of the world's population - which ideology in the world today is not absolutely rife and filthy with "pro-death arguments," and viewpoints, of one sort or another, they commonly espouse, if I may ask.

There will be no clean election with Dump involved, feel free to convince me otherwise.
So who knows what will happen..

There has no been clean, or free-and-fair, or truly contested, Presidential election in the U.S., where the voters had any true choice, for decades. This state of affairs didn't just start now.

I don’t think any democrat has actual fascist predilections. As for the rest of it the difference of supporting policies that reinforce those thing a versus tryin got support policies that address those things is obviously very important. Trump runs into the fear, anger, racism, and fascism. Biden is garbage but at least he’s not that.

Oh, for crying out loud. As I've said many times, Trump and his followers, while definitely monstrous, horrid, vile, and having right-wing populist traits out the wazoo, are NOT Fascist by definition. They are a NEW socio-political phenomenon within the broader multi-headed hydra that is right-wing authoritarian populism (of which Fascism is only one SPECIFIC facet of). Using old terms (just to invoke old baggage that is not even attached to modern subject) and shoehorning it in, no matter how many discrepancies and incongruities must be just ignored, rather than give new socio-political movements new labels, and acknowledging and viewing them as new, is counter-productive to any conservation, and, indeed, is in line with the same "toxic nostalgic narratives," that are one of the pillars of all right-wing authoritarian populist movements, themselves.
 
So it's 2 months until the election, so I thought it might be fun to run over some of the more competitive states.

The Top 10 States which Biden might pick up
:
1. Michigan
2016: Trump 0.23 2020 Polls: Biden 6.4 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 2.7 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: People might accuse me of bias, but Michigan does seem like Biden's most likely pick up. Trump is defending a very narrow margin, the polls are bad for him, and the 2018 midterms were consistently bad for the GOP. Even if the polls are wrong like 2016, Biden still shows as being up. Michigan in the last 20+ years has normally gone for the Democrats in presidential elections, though unless their candidate's name is Barrack Obama, it will always be fairly pretty competitive.

2. Pennsylvania
2016: Trump 0.72 2020 Polls: Biden 4.7 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 2.1 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: Very similar situation to Michigan, though Biden is not polling quite as well. As this is the state Biden was born in, if he can’t win here it seems pretty unlikely he will win the election.

3. Wisconsin
2016: Trump 0.77 2020 Polls: Biden 6.2 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 1.0 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: Again similar situation to Michigan & Pennsylvania. The only real difference is that the polls were legitimately wrong in 2016 (outside the 4% margin for error) which then casts doubt on the accuracy of the polls this time round. Hopefully the polling issue in Wisconsin has been fixed, as if they are as inaccurate again in 2020 as they were in 2016 then Biden may struggle to take Wisconsin.

4. Arizona
2016: Trump 3.55 2020 Polls: Biden 3.9 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 4.4 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat, Republicans win governorship
Summary: This has been a Republican state for a couple of decades now, but has been moving gradually to the left. In 2018 the Democrats won a senate seat here for the first time in a considerable period. The polling for the state has been remarkable consistent, with Biden's lead of around 4 barely changing since March/April time, suggesting that perhaps most people have already made up their mind who they are going to vote for in November. On the negative side, some have suggested that the Democrats have a max support of around 48-49% of the populous and have hit that roof now. Also even in a blue wave year, the GOP still held on to the governor seat.

5. Florida
2016: Trump 1.2 2020 Polls: Biden 4.2 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 3.2 2018 results: Republicans win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: Until the pandemic hit, this had looked relatively safe for Trump, with good poll numbers, and solid midterm results. The ‘Florida Man’ seemed to be the epitome of a MAGA fan! However the poor handling of Covid by Trump and the governor (a major Trump ally) Ron DeSantis changed all that. Florida is likely to be very close (as it is in every presidential year)!

6. North Carolina
2016: Trump 3.66 2020 Polls: Biden 0.9 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 1.8 2018 results: No contests
Summary: Hard to call this one with no midterm data. Polling whether swing adjusted or not suggests it will be very close. Trump is even encouraging his supporters to vote twice in a desperate attempt to hang on the state, legality be damned!

7. Ohio
2016: Trump 8.13 2020 Polls: Trump 2.0 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 6.6 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat, Republicans win governorship
Summary: Considering how comfortably Trump won here in 2016, this should not be a contest. However the recent narrowing between Biden and Trump in the polls, and the Democrats win in the 2018 Senatorial contest suggests Ohio might not be out of reach.

8. Texas
2016: Trump 8.99 2020 Polls: Trump 1.6 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 1.4 2018 results: Republicans win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: The thought of Texas turning Democrat seemed ludicrous not that long ago. However it has been moving to the left for a while. Beto O’Rourke’s spirited senate contest against Ted Cruz reinforced this. Trump supporters often go on about 2016 and how the polls ‘were wrong’ however maybe they might not want the 2016 swing to repeat itself, as if it does, Texas is very much in danger of turning blue.

9. Georgia
2016: Trump 5.13 2020 Polls: Trump 1.5 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 1.8 2018 results: Republicans win the governorship
Summary: Another traditionally safe Republican seat which has been moving left (though slower than Texas). Similar to Texas, a spirited governor race, this time involving Stacy Abraham, showed that a Democrat victory in Georgia was within touching distance. Trump in the polls only leads by 1.5, which is within the 4% margin for error rate, so you never know…

10. Iowa
2016: Trump 9.41 2020 Polls: Trump 1.9 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 8.4 2018 results: Republicans win the governorship
Summary: Iowa flipped hard in 2016 and until this year seemed way out of sight. However like several of the states above it on this list it narrowed up due to Trump's poor handling of the Covid pandemic. Like Georgia the polling has Biden within the 4% margin for error rate.

Honorable mentions to Alaska, Missouri and South Carolina that just missed the cut.

*2020 Swing adjusted polls, are the 2020 polls adjusted for the amount of swing which occurred between the 2016 polls and the actual results (ie what happens if ‘the polls were wrong like 2016).
 
So it's 2 months until the election, so I thought it might be fun to run over some of the more competitive states.

The Top 10 States which Biden might pick up
:
1. Michigan
2016: Trump 0.23 2020 Polls: Biden 6.4 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 2.7 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: People might accuse me of bias, but Michigan does seem like Biden's most likely pick up. Trump is defending a very narrow margin, the polls are bad for him, and the 2018 midterms were consistently bad for the GOP. Even if the polls are wrong like 2016, Biden still shows as being up. Michigan in the last 20+ years has normally gone for the Democrats in presidential elections, though unless their candidate's name is Barrack Obama, it will always be fairly pretty competitive.

2. Pennsylvania
2016: Trump 0.72 2020 Polls: Biden 4.7 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 2.1 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: Very similar situation to Michigan, though Biden is not polling quite as well. As this is the state Biden was born in, if he can’t win here it seems pretty unlikely he will win the election.

3. Wisconsin
2016: Trump 0.77 2020 Polls: Biden 6.2 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 1.0 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: Again similar situation to Michigan & Pennsylvania. The only real difference is that the polls were legitimately wrong in 2016 (outside the 4% margin for error) which then casts doubt on the accuracy of the polls this time round. Hopefully the polling issue in Wisconsin has been fixed, as if they are as inaccurate again in 2020 as they were in 2016 then Biden may struggle to take Wisconsin.

4. Arizona
2016: Trump 3.55 2020 Polls: Biden 3.9 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 4.4 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat, Republicans win governorship
Summary: This has been a Republican state for a couple of decades now, but has been moving gradually to the left. In 2018 the Democrats won a senate seat here for the first time in a considerable period. The polling for the state has been remarkable consistent, with Biden's lead of around 4 barely changing since March/April time, suggesting that perhaps most people have already made up their mind who they are going to vote for in November. On the negative side, some have suggested that the Democrats have a max support of around 48-49% of the populous and have hit that roof now. Also even in a blue wave year, the GOP still held on to the governor seat.

5. Florida
2016: Trump 1.2 2020 Polls: Biden 4.2 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 3.2 2018 results: Republicans win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: Until the pandemic hit, this had looked relatively safe for Trump, with good poll numbers, and solid midterm results. The ‘Florida Man’ seemed to be the epitome of a MAGA fan! However the poor handling of Covid by Trump and the governor (a major Trump ally) Ron DeSantis changed all that. Florida is likely to be very close (as it is in every presidential year)!

6. North Carolina
2016: Trump 3.66 2020 Polls: Biden 0.9 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 1.8 2018 results: No contests
Summary: Hard to call this one with no midterm data. Polling whether swing adjusted or not suggests it will be very close. Trump is even encouraging his supporters to vote twice in a desperate attempt to hang on the state, legality be damned!

7. Ohio
2016: Trump 8.13 2020 Polls: Trump 2.0 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 6.6 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat, Republicans win governorship
Summary: Considering how comfortably Trump won here in 2016, this should not be a contest. However the recent narrowing between Biden and Trump in the polls, and the Democrats win in the 2018 Senatorial contest suggests Ohio might not be out of reach.

8. Texas
2016: Trump 8.99 2020 Polls: Trump 1.6 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 1.4 2018 results: Republicans win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: The thought of Texas turning Democrat seemed ludicrous not that long ago. However it has been moving to the left for a while. Beto O’Rourke’s spirited senate contest against Ted Cruz reinforced this. Trump supporters often go on about 2016 and how the polls ‘were wrong’ however maybe they might not want the 2016 swing to repeat itself, as if it does, Texas is very much in danger of turning blue.

9. Georgia
2016: Trump 5.13 2020 Polls: Trump 1.5 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 1.8 2018 results: Republicans win the governorship
Summary: Another traditionally safe Republican seat which has been moving left (though slower than Texas). Similar to Texas, a spirited governor race, this time involving Stacy Abraham, showed that a Democrat victory in Georgia was within touching distance. Trump in the polls only leads by 1.5, which is within the 4% margin for error rate, so you never know…

10. Iowa
2016: Trump 9.41 2020 Polls: Trump 1.9 *2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Trump 8.4 2018 results: Republicans win the governorship
Summary: Iowa flipped hard in 2016 and until this year seemed way out of sight. However like several of the states above it on this list it narrowed up due to Trump's poor handling of the Covid pandemic. Like Georgia the polling has Biden within the 4% margin for error rate.

Honorable mentions to Alaska, Missouri and South Carolina that just missed the cut.

*2020 Swing adjusted polls, are the 2020 polls adjusted for the amount of swing which occurred between the 2016 polls and the actual results (ie what happens if ‘the polls were wrong like 2016).

Pretty much how I see it.

I don't think he will get Georgia or Texas.
 
Remembering that attack is the best form of defense lets look at
The top 5 States which Trump might gain:

1. Minnesota
2016: Clinton 1.52 2020 Polls: Biden 5.9 2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 1.4 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: This was the Rust Belt state that got away from Trump in 2016 (I think technically its not a Rust Belt State, but lets just go with it). However like the rest of the Rust Belt it moved distinctly to the right. Apparently Trump is still going after it, and there has been some narrowing in the polls recently, so it may not be just a vanity project for him.

2. New Hampshire
2016: Clinton 0.37 2020 Polls: Biden 7.9 2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 7.6 2018 results: Republicans win the governorship
Summary: The only one of the really close results which didn’t go Trumps way in 2016. The Democrats are defending a very narrow lead here, and in 2018 the Republicans retained the governorship. On the less positive side, the polling is not good for Trump, but then polls can be wrong right!?

3. Maine
2016: Clinton 2.96 2020 Polls: Biden 9.7 2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 8.1 2018 results: Independent win the governorship
Summary: There isn’t a great case for Trump winning here. However Clinton didn’t win by a lot in 2016, and as shown by them continuing to elect an independent to the position of governor, they are not beholden to the Democrats. Maybe this one will narrow up…

4. Nevada
2016: Clinton 2.42 2020 Polls: Biden 6.3 2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 9.5 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat and governorship
Summary: Trump was predicted to win here in 2016, but he didn’t. Since then there hasn’t been a lot of good news for Republicans in Nevada. However Nevada remains one of the less safe seats for the Democrats, so if things go well for Trump in the next 2 months, maybe things could start looking brighter for him here.

5. Virginia
2016: Clinton 5.32 2020 Polls: Biden 10.6 2020 Swing adjusted Polls: Biden 11.0 2018 results: Democrats win Senate seat
Summary: For a long time this was considered a safe Republican state. Then Obama surprisingly won it. It was considered a tough hold for Clinton, hence her choice of Tim Kaine as VP. The Democrats unusually rely on white suburban voters in the heart of the Bible Belt to win this state. Maybe without Kaine as VP this state could come back to the GOP, and this unusual Democrat voting base will desert Biden. However currently the polling doesn’t back this up.

Honorable mentions to Colorado and New Mexico for just missing the top 5.
 
I don't think Trump has any shot of taking VA this time. It's only gotten more blue since Clinton took it in '16. And remember Democrats now control the state legislature and the governorship there.
 
At this point one has to assume that a debate between Trump and Biden will almost certainly not help Biden.
Question is how the dnc is going to try to prevent a debate, when unlike the primaries this isn't a dnc controlled issue.

In Hypothetia, a land better than the current US, one could have nominee Bernie going to (f)ox news and demolishing their narrative. It's not even a bad joke to expect Biden to be convincing anyone not 100000000000000% ready to vote for him.
 
Moderator Action: I have deleted a few posts that served only to bicker at each other. Any other offenders will be thread-banned or worse. Thank you.
 
This is why mail in ballots aren't counted as they come in. They are kept in the envelope until they can be compared to the election day live voter rolls.

However, if there is a mail in ballot received and the in person voting rolls show that a ballot was cast in that person's name there should be an investigation before the mail in ballot is discarded. If you mailed in your ballot properly and someone voted falsely using your name nothing can be done to retrieve their fraudulent vote, but yours should still be counted. Large numbers of intentional double voters will bog down the system, which is probably what Trump is actually after.

Hopefully, states respond effectively to this ploy. Poll workers need to emphasize to people who show up to vote that if they have already mailed in their ballot casting a second ballot without providing instruction to dispose of their mailed in ballot is in fact a crime.

Thank you for your explanation.
 
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