Snowygerry
Deity
Might be as simple as to transfer her to a non-Catholic hospital ?
That's the way it used to work here, before abortion was satisfactory regulated.
[RD] Abortion, once again
- Thread starter Angst
- Start date
Might be as simple as to transfer her to a non-Catholic hospital ?
That's the way it used to work here, before abortion was satisfactory regulated.
Snowygerry
Deity
Not the place for a pregnant women to go then, sorry for that.
Do we have a separate thread about the surpreme court decision?
Anyways, will plug in something else:
https://www.euronews.com/2022/06/24...-to-end-nazi-era-ban-on-advertising-abortions
Not the very most important progress there (IMHO), but the rule simply didn't make much sense anymore.
Short summary: Abortions are legal for up to 12 weeks, no change there. Until now a doctor could not say in any info material (including website) if they do perform any abortions (since not all do, up to the doctor). This prohibition is now gone. So it gets now easier to find a doctor who does.
Anyways, will plug in something else:
https://www.euronews.com/2022/06/24...-to-end-nazi-era-ban-on-advertising-abortions
Not the very most important progress there (IMHO), but the rule simply didn't make much sense anymore.
Short summary: Abortions are legal for up to 12 weeks, no change there. Until now a doctor could not say in any info material (including website) if they do perform any abortions (since not all do, up to the doctor). This prohibition is now gone. So it gets now easier to find a doctor who does.
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TheMeInTeam
If A implies B...
- Joined
- Jan 26, 2008
- Messages
- 27,995
imo it's noteworthy that most us states will remain equal or more lax on abortions compared to 12wk ban. it's pretty weird that other countries that uphold laws in that timeframe point fingers at usa on this topic, when probably only a couple states will go for bans at conception even now.
I really appreciate that posting by The_J. Now, I find that I have to fight the pro-life movement in the United States, but it's going to be because I am worried about them leaking up here into Canada. If I cared about women's rights, I should be able to find more cost-effective targets. Like, I didn't even know how bad Germany was (and we deliberately abandoned Afghani women over the entire NATO involvement). It's very hard for me to separate (in my head) as to whether I am 'caring for people', 'playing defense' or 'biased against non-Americans'.
Broken_Erika
Play with me.
Judge blocks Louisiana's abortion 'trigger law'
A Louisiana judge has blocked the state's abortion "trigger law" banning the procedure at any stage of pregnancy.
The controversial law, which was passed in 2006, makes no exceptions in cases of rape or incest.
The decision comes days after a landmark ruling from the US Supreme Court overturned the constitutional right to abortion.
Access to the procedure is now up to individual states.
Louisiana is one of 13 states that has reinstated bans or strict limits following the high court ruling.
These so-called "trigger laws" can come into immediate or near-immediate effect following the Supreme Court's reversal of Roe v Wade last week, but many now face fresh legal challenges at the state level.
On Monday, Orleans Parish Civil District Court Judge Robinson Giarruso temporarily blocked enforcement of the Louisiana law and set a hearing for 8 July.
A lawsuit filed Monday morning by the Center for Reproductive Rights on behalf of local abortion providers argued that trigger bans "lack constitutionally required safeguards to prevent arbitrary enforcement" and are "void for vagueness".
The state's three remaining abortion clinics said they would resume providing abortion care to patients following Judge Giarruso's ruling.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61958810
A Louisiana judge has blocked the state's abortion "trigger law" banning the procedure at any stage of pregnancy.
The controversial law, which was passed in 2006, makes no exceptions in cases of rape or incest.
The decision comes days after a landmark ruling from the US Supreme Court overturned the constitutional right to abortion.
Access to the procedure is now up to individual states.
Louisiana is one of 13 states that has reinstated bans or strict limits following the high court ruling.
These so-called "trigger laws" can come into immediate or near-immediate effect following the Supreme Court's reversal of Roe v Wade last week, but many now face fresh legal challenges at the state level.
On Monday, Orleans Parish Civil District Court Judge Robinson Giarruso temporarily blocked enforcement of the Louisiana law and set a hearing for 8 July.
A lawsuit filed Monday morning by the Center for Reproductive Rights on behalf of local abortion providers argued that trigger bans "lack constitutionally required safeguards to prevent arbitrary enforcement" and are "void for vagueness".
The state's three remaining abortion clinics said they would resume providing abortion care to patients following Judge Giarruso's ruling.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-61958810
Broken_Erika
Play with me.
El Salvador's abortion ban: 'I was sent to prison for suffering a miscarriage'
The news from the US that women face tighter restrictions on abortion has been felt in El Salvador, which itself has very strict laws preventing access.
In February, four women sat down before the full glare of El Salvador's press. Between them, they had served nearly 50 years in prison.
Their crime was to have the misfortune of suffering a miscarriage - in a country with one of the strictest abortion laws in the world.
Among them was Elsy.
In June 2011, Elsy was pregnant and working as a domestic worker in her hometown. She remembers going to the toilet at work, where she apparently passed out.
When she came to a little later, she was surrounded by police officers. Her baby was gone. Her boss had reported her for terminating the pregnancy.
At her trial, Elsy was sentenced to 30 years for aggravated homicide. She served 10 before campaigners managed to get her sentence shortened.
"I felt terrible in prison, all I could think of was the 30 years," Elsy told the BBC. "I thought I'd never see my mother or any of my family again."
Elsy tried to distract herself in jail. She got her high school diploma, participated in workshops and volunteered at the prison church.
Yet it wasn't enough to stop her from entering a dark place in her head.
"I just kept thinking, 'Why? Why did those who testified against me do this?'"
Now back living with her family, Elsy says her sentence was simply an "injustice which happens" in El Salvador. She points out there are many still going through what she did.
As recently as May, a woman identified as "Esme" was sentenced to 30 years, also for aggravated homicide following a miscarriage.
But protests have been difficult since the country's controversial president, Nayib Bukele, imposed a state of exception giving the police wide-ranging powers of arrest.
Mariana Moisa is one of the leading women's rights activists in El Salvador. She is part of the "green wave" abortion rights movement sweeping across Latin America.
Ms Moisa says their battle isn't just to free the women or even change the law, but to shift attitudes in society.
"We have to keep working, it depends on us and not the political parties", she says at her organisation's headquarters in San Salvador. "We have to face up to our reality and promote real cultural changes."
Over in the United States, the US Supreme Court has overturned a ruling that made abortion a constitutional right.
Campaigners like Ms Moisa fear this will strengthen the hand of conservatives across Central America.
The US would do well to look south, she warns, to see how an outright ban can lead to "denying women their freedom in these circumstances".
Changing attitudes in El Salvador won't come easily, though.
Padre Vito Guarato is a home for abandoned children in San Salvador, many of whom have some form of disability.
Five-year-old resident Ana Lucia has microcephaly, where children are born with significantly smaller heads, possibly due to infection with the Zika virus.
Lying in her cot, surrounded by donated teddy bears, Ana Lucia needs round-the-clock attention. Her carers do everything they can to provide her with a comfortable and dignified life.
But in truth, with no option to abort in El Salvador, some parents see little choice but to abandon.
"I think the mothers should assume their responsibility", says Rosa Evelyn, one of the managers at the church-run children's home.
"If God bestowed upon you the virtue of becoming a mother, then you must be one for as long as God allows it," she says.
It's a view shared by many in this traditionally Catholic nation.
What's more, the fastest-growing religion in Central America today is evangelical Christianity.
As its reach grows, so too does its political clout, with evangelical values and views increasingly present inside parliament.
Guillermo Gallegos, one of the vice presidents of the national assembly, is staunchly anti-abortion.
He insists decriminalisation would never pass the first legislative hurdle, "even where the mother's life is at risk".
"In any case where that little creature still has life," he tells me, "then I lean towards saving it over saving the mother".
In a national address on the anniversary of his third year in office, President Bukele applauded a plan, led by his wife, to make childbirth safer in El Salvador's public hospitals.
Abortion, though, remains strictly off limits, even in cases of incest or rape - an entrenched view now bolstered by the ruling of the US Supreme Court.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-61798330
The news from the US that women face tighter restrictions on abortion has been felt in El Salvador, which itself has very strict laws preventing access.
In February, four women sat down before the full glare of El Salvador's press. Between them, they had served nearly 50 years in prison.
Their crime was to have the misfortune of suffering a miscarriage - in a country with one of the strictest abortion laws in the world.
Among them was Elsy.
In June 2011, Elsy was pregnant and working as a domestic worker in her hometown. She remembers going to the toilet at work, where she apparently passed out.
When she came to a little later, she was surrounded by police officers. Her baby was gone. Her boss had reported her for terminating the pregnancy.
At her trial, Elsy was sentenced to 30 years for aggravated homicide. She served 10 before campaigners managed to get her sentence shortened.
"I felt terrible in prison, all I could think of was the 30 years," Elsy told the BBC. "I thought I'd never see my mother or any of my family again."
Elsy tried to distract herself in jail. She got her high school diploma, participated in workshops and volunteered at the prison church.
Yet it wasn't enough to stop her from entering a dark place in her head.
"I just kept thinking, 'Why? Why did those who testified against me do this?'"
Now back living with her family, Elsy says her sentence was simply an "injustice which happens" in El Salvador. She points out there are many still going through what she did.
As recently as May, a woman identified as "Esme" was sentenced to 30 years, also for aggravated homicide following a miscarriage.
But protests have been difficult since the country's controversial president, Nayib Bukele, imposed a state of exception giving the police wide-ranging powers of arrest.
Mariana Moisa is one of the leading women's rights activists in El Salvador. She is part of the "green wave" abortion rights movement sweeping across Latin America.
Ms Moisa says their battle isn't just to free the women or even change the law, but to shift attitudes in society.
"We have to keep working, it depends on us and not the political parties", she says at her organisation's headquarters in San Salvador. "We have to face up to our reality and promote real cultural changes."
Over in the United States, the US Supreme Court has overturned a ruling that made abortion a constitutional right.
Campaigners like Ms Moisa fear this will strengthen the hand of conservatives across Central America.
The US would do well to look south, she warns, to see how an outright ban can lead to "denying women their freedom in these circumstances".
Changing attitudes in El Salvador won't come easily, though.
Padre Vito Guarato is a home for abandoned children in San Salvador, many of whom have some form of disability.
Five-year-old resident Ana Lucia has microcephaly, where children are born with significantly smaller heads, possibly due to infection with the Zika virus.
Lying in her cot, surrounded by donated teddy bears, Ana Lucia needs round-the-clock attention. Her carers do everything they can to provide her with a comfortable and dignified life.
But in truth, with no option to abort in El Salvador, some parents see little choice but to abandon.
"I think the mothers should assume their responsibility", says Rosa Evelyn, one of the managers at the church-run children's home.
"If God bestowed upon you the virtue of becoming a mother, then you must be one for as long as God allows it," she says.
It's a view shared by many in this traditionally Catholic nation.
What's more, the fastest-growing religion in Central America today is evangelical Christianity.
As its reach grows, so too does its political clout, with evangelical values and views increasingly present inside parliament.
Guillermo Gallegos, one of the vice presidents of the national assembly, is staunchly anti-abortion.
He insists decriminalisation would never pass the first legislative hurdle, "even where the mother's life is at risk".
"In any case where that little creature still has life," he tells me, "then I lean towards saving it over saving the mother".
In a national address on the anniversary of his third year in office, President Bukele applauded a plan, led by his wife, to make childbirth safer in El Salvador's public hospitals.
Abortion, though, remains strictly off limits, even in cases of incest or rape - an entrenched view now bolstered by the ruling of the US Supreme Court.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-61798330
Broken_Erika
Play with me.
Controversial Florida abortion ban blocked by court
In a win for pro-choice activists, a Florida judge has blocked a state law banning abortions after 15 weeks.
The controversial law signed in April by Governor Ron DeSantis, was set to go into effect tomorrow, and made no exceptions in cases of rape or incest.
The decision comes amid a flurry of state legal battles following the US Supreme Court decision to overturn the constitutional right to abortion.
The state is expected to appeal to the Florida Supreme Court.
Florida is one of 11 US states that protect abortion access in their own state constitutions.
On Thursday, Leon County circuit judge John Cooper granted a temporary injunction to the law, which was legally challenged earlier in June by a coalition of pro-choice groups and clinics.
His ruling blocking the law, however, will not be binding until a written order is signed by him - which he said would not happen immediately. The law is set to go into effect at midnight.
Florida, the third most populous state in the US, had for over 40 years protected the right to abortion through a privacy amendment in the state's constitution. In his ruling, the judge said that the law would violate those privacy protections.
In the lawsuit, the plaintiffs argued that the state's residents believe "that abortion is a fundamental right deserving of the strongest protection against government intrusion".
The law had been widely applauded by anti-abortion groups in the state, including the Florida Conference of Catholic Bishops. According to data from the Centres of Disease Control, Florida has one of the highest rates of abortion in the US, behind only Illinois and New York. Polls also show that just over half of residents - 56% - believe abortions should be legal, making it the only state in the south-eastern US with a pro-choice majority. Governor DeSantis, however, has praised the recent Supreme Court ruling and vowed that Florida will work to restrict abortion access. "Florida will continue to defend its recently-enacted pro-life reforms against state court challenges, will work to expand pro-life protections and will stand for life by promoting adopting, foster care and child welfare," he said in a statement last week.
Judges in both Louisiana, Kentucky and Utah have already blocked trigger laws in those states.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-62002298
In a win for pro-choice activists, a Florida judge has blocked a state law banning abortions after 15 weeks.
The controversial law signed in April by Governor Ron DeSantis, was set to go into effect tomorrow, and made no exceptions in cases of rape or incest.
The decision comes amid a flurry of state legal battles following the US Supreme Court decision to overturn the constitutional right to abortion.
The state is expected to appeal to the Florida Supreme Court.
Florida is one of 11 US states that protect abortion access in their own state constitutions.
On Thursday, Leon County circuit judge John Cooper granted a temporary injunction to the law, which was legally challenged earlier in June by a coalition of pro-choice groups and clinics.
His ruling blocking the law, however, will not be binding until a written order is signed by him - which he said would not happen immediately. The law is set to go into effect at midnight.
Florida, the third most populous state in the US, had for over 40 years protected the right to abortion through a privacy amendment in the state's constitution. In his ruling, the judge said that the law would violate those privacy protections.
In the lawsuit, the plaintiffs argued that the state's residents believe "that abortion is a fundamental right deserving of the strongest protection against government intrusion".
- Inside a US abortion clinic on its last day
- What happens now Roe v Wade has been overturned?
- The world reacts to US abortion ruling
The law had been widely applauded by anti-abortion groups in the state, including the Florida Conference of Catholic Bishops. According to data from the Centres of Disease Control, Florida has one of the highest rates of abortion in the US, behind only Illinois and New York. Polls also show that just over half of residents - 56% - believe abortions should be legal, making it the only state in the south-eastern US with a pro-choice majority. Governor DeSantis, however, has praised the recent Supreme Court ruling and vowed that Florida will work to restrict abortion access. "Florida will continue to defend its recently-enacted pro-life reforms against state court challenges, will work to expand pro-life protections and will stand for life by promoting adopting, foster care and child welfare," he said in a statement last week.
Judges in both Louisiana, Kentucky and Utah have already blocked trigger laws in those states.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-62002298
TheMeInTeam
If A implies B...
- Joined
- Jan 26, 2008
- Messages
- 27,995
the language in the article about florida is kind of funny.
"56% believe abortions should be legal" --> at what point do these 56% believe that? it doesn't say. i expect different % for 4 weeks and 40 weeks. what % of floridians feel that way after 15 weeks?
it's worth asking, because an awful lot of places seem fine with 12 weeks, including other countries.
not a fan of trigger laws though. put this on the next ballot, and don't put other crap with it. actually, never put unrelated things together on a ballot, officials can screw off with that practice. i would support making that illegal.
"56% believe abortions should be legal" --> at what point do these 56% believe that? it doesn't say. i expect different % for 4 weeks and 40 weeks. what % of floridians feel that way after 15 weeks?
it's worth asking, because an awful lot of places seem fine with 12 weeks, including other countries.
not a fan of trigger laws though. put this on the next ballot, and don't put other crap with it. actually, never put unrelated things together on a ballot, officials can screw off with that practice. i would support making that illegal.
This is a product of weirdo American obsession with written week thresholds, without understanding international context.
It leads to misinterpreting such gestational "limits" as being hard red lines after which abortion is banned (like actually does occur in some of the more backwards parts of America).
Rather, what those thresholds generally actually are, is a trigger point for abortion to move from automatically accessed, to some sort of medical sign-off process. That's usually roughly in line with the shift from mifepristone and day procedures, to more involved surgeries.
(And of course, in most places other places it's relatively easier to actually get a timely and affordable abortion without delays in the first place)
Of course it shouldn't matter anyway. The obsession with week thresholds is a bit sick and cruel, given nearly all "late" abortions occur for parents who did want the baby but something went wrong.
For the record, there's no legally enshrined "gestational limit" where I live, but unfortunately the method of access changes as specialists can be needed for complicated later procedures, which can involve a trip to Sydney due to lack of providers here. The obstacles are therefore cost and practicality, not legal.
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I saw this:
It's great to illustrate why any abortion restriction is evil. No woman wants an abortion. Men are incapable of understanding whatsoever, which is why they need to not have an opinion.
It's great to illustrate why any abortion restriction is evil. No woman wants an abortion. Men are incapable of understanding whatsoever, which is why they need to not have an opinion.
sophie
Break My Heart
* cis men
Lexicus
Deity
The women in this article are utter lunatics and/or fools:
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/03/us/pro-life-young-women-roe-abortion.html
This is a funny consequence of politics based on abstractions and feelings (the use of the word "empowered" in this article really exemplifies this - it shows that the word means basically nothing). It is "empowering" for women to be minutely surveiled and controlled to protect the rights of the fetal person in her womb? It is "empowering" to be potentially investigated as a murderer every time you menstruate?
Some of these women probably just have no idea what abortion bans will really mean (the criminalization of prenatal medical care, the criminalization of pregnancy, etc.). Their views may evolve some when they begin to see some of that side of abortion being illegal.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/03/us/pro-life-young-women-roe-abortion.html
This is a funny consequence of politics based on abstractions and feelings (the use of the word "empowered" in this article really exemplifies this - it shows that the word means basically nothing). It is "empowering" for women to be minutely surveiled and controlled to protect the rights of the fetal person in her womb? It is "empowering" to be potentially investigated as a murderer every time you menstruate?
Some of these women probably just have no idea what abortion bans will really mean (the criminalization of prenatal medical care, the criminalization of pregnancy, etc.). Their views may evolve some when they begin to see some of that side of abortion being illegal.
Lexicus
Deity
Tl;dr it tells us about some youngish (20s) women who believe that supporting abortion bans without exceptions for rape and incest is actually feminist and empowering.
They obviously missed the memo on what feminism is about. Yes, women can choose to remain no better than chattel if that's what they want, but they don't get to enforce it on other women.
Angst
Rambling and inconsistent
i follow a page on facebook that's nerd memes for women. the owner is personally anti-abortion but is horrified at the ruling. she wants people to be able to choose for themselves and think the ruling is robbing people liberty, even if the rulings aligns with her own way of life. she's devastated over it
The idea that people are pro-abortion is just nonsense. Its a hard decision and experience for any women to go through, but not one someone else should be making for us.
