Stuck in Pi
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I'd take some more cities of De Gaulle's, then take his capitulation.
ALC Game 21: Zulus/Shaka
- Thread starter Sisiutil
- Start date
What's the point of taking cities that
- you will have to defend
- will never do you any good?
I didn't follow the thread very closely, but if you have a common border with hammuraby, take him out next.
He will capitulate within a handful of turns (and it's very likely peter will help you), then he'll be a very helpful partner in your final war.
Conquest!
- you will have to defend
- will never do you any good?
I didn't follow the thread very closely, but if you have a common border with hammuraby, take him out next.
He will capitulate within a handful of turns (and it's very likely peter will help you), then he'll be a very helpful partner in your final war.
Conquest!
KrikkitTwo
Immortal
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Messages
- 12,418
If you can get a city or 2 from France (1 turn) Easily then do that before capitulation
Otherwise Take Capitulation Now... Ge Gaulle won't gain any territory and you will in the upcoming time period.
I agree with Hamurabi as the Next Target... ideally taking the Holy City and the city with the AP.
He's Weaker and as long as you are prepared to defend from Peter you should be OK (France already has Rifling correct? that should let them hold off Peter for a stop gap)
Also If you capitulate Babylon, (and make sure to take the AP so he doesn't compete with you) you could force Russia to submit without firing a shot (at them... plenty fired at everyone else.)
Otherwise Take Capitulation Now... Ge Gaulle won't gain any territory and you will in the upcoming time period.
I agree with Hamurabi as the Next Target... ideally taking the Holy City and the city with the AP.
He's Weaker and as long as you are prepared to defend from Peter you should be OK (France already has Rifling correct? that should let them hold off Peter for a stop gap)
Also If you capitulate Babylon, (and make sure to take the AP so he doesn't compete with you) you could force Russia to submit without firing a shot (at them... plenty fired at everyone else.)
r_rolo1
King of myself
Accept the French as vassals and start moving troops to near of the Russian-babilonian Border. Then you can evaluate the situation with more ease... I would consider backstabbing Peter after he Dows Hammy, and try to vassalize Hammy then... This game would be a masterpiece with a conquest win only with 1 civ dead 
popejubal
Emperor
If you keep fighting DeGaulle, you lose military and he loses military. If you're close to getting another Great General, then you might go ahead and grab any more cities that you really want and get the GG, but I'm thinking you'll have another war soon enough even if you do accept the capitulation this turn.
If you accept the capitulation now, you'll have more units and France will have more units to fight the next war against either Peter or Hammy. Why kill units that you're going to effectively own in a couple of turns?
If you accept the capitulation now, you'll have more units and France will have more units to fight the next war against either Peter or Hammy. Why kill units that you're going to effectively own in a couple of turns?
WTH is going on in this game? I normally have to beat a civ down until they have 2 or 3 cities left before they capitulate. All you need to do is take 1 or 2 cities and they're crying uncle. 
Are you sure you didn't check the "Wussy AI" box instead of "Aggressive AI"? 
Moving forward, accepting DeGaulle's capitulation would be nice, but a quick look at the save indicates it might be advantageous to continue for a bit. If I counted right DeGaulle has 11 cities to your 17 (including Cheju). If land area per city is equal that would mean the French empire is about 65% of the Zulu empire. The population issue is a lot better since the Zulu cities are larger on average than the French cities. But if I added up the pop numbers correctly it's 236 total for Zulu and 116 for France. So just barely enough to avoid France meeting the break free conditions.
Taking Uzbek should be enough to prevent the situation from changing prior to acquiring more cities from Russia/Babylon. It should only take a few turns. The only real issue I can see is if Peter joins in on France's side DeGaulle might not be willing to capitulate at that point.
Peter is currently able to field cossacks. It's going to take a while to have enough of a rifle army to take on Russia. Going for Hammurabi while you're waiting to get there might be a good idea, but there is a possibility that Peter will join in on Babylon's side. So if you do go this route make sure you keep enough troops around Thracian/Saxon to defend against a Russian invasion force.
If you wait to take on Peter first I don't see any chance Hammurabi will join in with the Russians. And even if they do they'll be attacking French or Korean cities.
Are you sure you didn't check the "Wussy AI" box instead of "Aggressive AI"? Moving forward, accepting DeGaulle's capitulation would be nice, but a quick look at the save indicates it might be advantageous to continue for a bit. If I counted right DeGaulle has 11 cities to your 17 (including Cheju). If land area per city is equal that would mean the French empire is about 65% of the Zulu empire. The population issue is a lot better since the Zulu cities are larger on average than the French cities. But if I added up the pop numbers correctly it's 236 total for Zulu and 116 for France. So just barely enough to avoid France meeting the break free conditions.
Taking Uzbek should be enough to prevent the situation from changing prior to acquiring more cities from Russia/Babylon. It should only take a few turns. The only real issue I can see is if Peter joins in on France's side DeGaulle might not be willing to capitulate at that point.
Peter is currently able to field cossacks. It's going to take a while to have enough of a rifle army to take on Russia. Going for Hammurabi while you're waiting to get there might be a good idea, but there is a possibility that Peter will join in on Babylon's side. So if you do go this route make sure you keep enough troops around Thracian/Saxon to defend against a Russian invasion force.
If you wait to take on Peter first I don't see any chance Hammurabi will join in with the Russians. And even if they do they'll be attacking French or Korean cities.
reknaw
the Hopeless
I played one turn of your latest save to see what was what in more detail and something very interesting happened...
Spoiler :
Shoot the Moon
Playing World in Conflict
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2005
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Der Graf
Omnipresent Eye
This one ?
SAFETY
In general, France is a safe destination, although travelers must be aware that from time to time it is invaded by Germany. Traditionally, the French surrender immediately. A tunnel connecting France to Britain beneath the English Channel has been opened in recent years to make it easier for the French government to flee to London during future German invasions, and for them to offload all their illegal immigrants.
(American's Guide to France)
As I recall, I already have a tech advantage over Peter: Steel for Cannon. So I think I should move units into position and pull a Rummy, going to war with the army I have rather than the army I'd like to have.
Sounds like a good plan to me
iamnleth
Warlord
Spoiler :
Sisiutil
All Leader Challenger
Even with the spoiler tags in use (thanks for that at least), I'd very much prefer it if any and all ALC spoilers for this and future games were posted in a separate thread. Just post a notice here that you've started the thread. Thanks!
reknaw
the Hopeless
Sorry, I will keep that in mind for future posting.
r_rolo1
King of myself
I do not agree with the bolded part......
If Sis vassals the french ( now or after some more cites ,just to nail the thing a little more ) and hammy vassals to Peter again ( not unlikely... with or without war ), Peter ,as the trustful leader he is
, will surely point guns to Sis.... not thait matters much ( Sis is in control of the game ) but could be a big delay due to the big shared border Peter has with Sis.
You could easily win a diplomatic victory from here, but Shaka should not stoop to such backdoor shenanigans.
Enslave De Gaulle, tech to Infantry, kill Peter, start new ALC (and this time make it a proper challenge!).
Enslave De Gaulle, tech to Infantry, kill Peter, start new ALC (and this time make it a proper challenge!).
Der Graf
Omnipresent Eye
They just fear the might of Sisiutil - very clever nowadays, the AI
Why shouldn't I ?
Besides, I didn't make it, it's just a quote
Melon Head
Warlord
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2006
- Messages
- 134
I think a large part of them capitulating so fast is that Sisiutil has begun taking vassals. The AI takes a couple of things into account when reviewing the decision to capitulate. I definitely don't know all of them, but here are a few things I see as being influential here. One of these is the comparison in power ratings between two sides. Since Sisiutil has Washington and Wang Kon's substantial power ratings added to his, the AI is feels far weaker. Leaving Washington and Wang Kon powerful and capitulating makes them a stronger force in aiding his power rating.
Second, the AI is more likely to capitulate to the person who has been doing lots of damage to it. By crushing De Gaulle's army, he dealt sufficient damage to make it unlikely De Gaulle would capitulate to Peter, for instance, and also weakened De Gaulle enough that he was willing to capitulate at all.
These two things are how runaway AIs get so powerful. They keep capitulating major civs on their continent, cherry-picking nearby territory and focusing on military techs. They can extort and trade for civillian techs from their new vassals. This keeps their economy alive while they maintain their stranglehold on the region.
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