Amazon blocks sale of rape videogame

[Bill3000]

Name one culture. Go one step further; Name one culture where individual rights are valued where rape has a meaningful purpose.

Since when did Japan value individual rights?

 

[GoodGame]

And please respond to the Marquis de Sade aside...

All I can say about him was he was an aristocrat author that some considered a philosopher. He definitely wasn't well-received in his day. Wikipedia says:

He was a proponent of extreme freedom (or at least licentiousness), unrestrained by morality, religion or law, with the pursuit of personal pleasure being the highest principle.

I presume we couldn't even do a literary analysis in this forum given his choice of topics.

As for Amazon carrying him? All I can say is some college classes actually study him for historical/philosophical content. Culturally, he probably has a few marks rating higher than a game enacting rape. And he would end up in jail promptly nowadays.

 

[Formaldehyde]

CONSPIRACY - 18 U.S.C. 371 makes it a separate Federal crime or offense for anyone to conspire or agree with someone else to do something which, if actually carried out, would amount to another Federal crime or offense.

Premeditation might have been a better choice of word.

Hmm. That still doesn't give me a clue as to what you are referring to in this particular context.

And you still haven't answered the question about the Marquis de Sade. Should Amazon also ban his writings about rape?

EDIT: Aha. You don't know what his books are about. He wrote quite explicit novels about the rape and torture of innocent girls by priests and nuns, for example.

http://www.globusz.com/ebooks/Justine/index.htm

 

[GoodGame]

Hmm. That still doesn't give me a clue as to what you are referring to in this particular context.

And you still haven't answered the question about the Marquis de Sade. Should Amazon also ban his writings about rape?

I did answer. In some college classes, his work his studied. It has a historical context--representing a perspective of the corrupt nobility, and also a philosophical concept of hedonism. On that grounds, it's nearly a textbook. Should textbooks be banned? Amazon apparently doesn't think so.
Back to the videogame, is the videogame a textbook about commiting rape? Even if it had intellectual value as that, should society tolerate such a college course?


My point about fantasy vs. consipiracy is---are we saying all games are fantasy and never amount to anything? For example, should we next have a game that puts you in the role of Osasma and 9/11 terrorists? Shall we have a post-WW2 game about playing Stalin, consolidating our dictatorship through pogroms? Should there be a Postal 3, only a thousand times worse where we act as a mad mutilating Pathologist?

Does not the fantasy ever reach a point where it is training and premeditation to commit a criminal act?

That's my question.

 

[Formaldehyde]

I did answer. In some college classes, his work his studied. It has a historical context--representing a perspective of the corrupt nobility, and also a philosophical concept of hedonism. On that grounds, it's nearly a textbook. Should textbooks be banned? Amazon apparently doesn't think so.

But you are dodging the issue. Most people read the Marquis de Sade for its pornographic value, not its historical relevance. Once again, it's largely about the rape of young girls by priests and nuns. Aren't you also offended that Amazon.com provides those sorts of books to 'perverts' instead of 'historians'?

My point about fantasy vs. consipiracy is---are we saying all games are fantasy and never amount to anything? For example, should we next have a game that puts you in the role of Osasma and 9/11 terrorists?

Um, they already exist and they have for quite some time now:

http://www.americasarmy.com/

http://store.steampowered.com/app/240/

You can also purchase Microsoft Flight Simulator and practice crashing into whatever you want. The terrorists did.

Shall we have a post-WW2 game about playing Stalin, consolidating our dictatorship through pogroms?

I'd be surprised if there isn't a comparable Civ scenario or two. Do you think those are 'evil' too, if they do indeed exist?

Does not the fantasy ever reach a point where it is training and premeditation to commit a criminal act?

In a word, no. Do you think playing Civ makes you want to take control of the world by whatever means necessary to build a spaceship to go to Alpha Centauri before it is too late?

 

[Archbob]

Freedom of speech and expression and all, I can't not agree with Amazon's decision.

 

[GoodGame]

But you are dodging the issue. Most people read the Marquis de Sade for its pornographic value, not its historical relevance. Once again, it's largely about the rape of young girls by priests and nuns. Aren't you also offended that Amazon.com provides those sorts of books to 'perverts' instead of 'historians'?

I'm not dodging any issue, just stating that Marquis de Sade probably has 100x the cultural value that this new Japanese game does. Also please show a citation that "most people read Marquis de Sade for it porn value". The 'most people' arguement is way overused IMHO. It implies some kind of stats work was done, yet I see none.

Originally Posted by GoodGame
Does not the fantasy ever reach a point where it is training and premeditation to commit a criminal act?

In a word, no. Do you think playing Civ makes you want to take control of the world by whatever means necessary to build a spaceship to go to Alpha Centauri before it is too late?

Is the average gamer realistically in a position to be named 'quasi' leader of a nation? No.
How a bout a more realisitic reductio ad absurdum example then..

 

[Formaldehyde]

I'm not dodging any issue, just stating that Marquis de Sade probably has 100x the cultural value that this new Japanese game does.

Since you clearly haven't read any of his works, and you clearly don't intend to do so to determine whether you think it is pornography or not (I guarantee you would...), I'd say your opinion in this matter is rather weak.

Is the average gamer realistically in a position to be named 'quasi' leader of a nation? No.

Ah. You are now restricting it to a game where you actually play Osama bin Laden. Once again, the short answer is 'no'. Why? It's fantasy.

Anybody want to make a Civ scenario where OBL is the leader? That would be one tough scenario to win...

 

[Formaldehyde]

Double post...

 

[mangxema]

Freedom of speech and expression and all, I can't not agree with Amazon's decision.

I probably would, too. They are out to make money after all.

 

[warpus]

Amazon can remove whatever the hell they want, agreed.

People who would play a game like this are sick and should be punched in the face, agreed.

Japan is an interesting place, agreed.

 

[carmen510]

It is a truth that 99% of everything weird or perverted comes from Japan, combining the best and worst of humanity on a bunch of islands to be posted on the internets.

 

[TopDog]

Maybe, morally, murder is worse than rape.

But seriously, can some of you guys not see how this game is so much worse than say, gta?

 

[CaptainF]

In all truth...I kinda want to play this game. Maybe the controversy plays a part.

 

[Mise]

A computer game is clearly more graphic, involving and enjoyable than a book, other wise children would all be reading books instead of playing computer games. Yet another moronic comparison.

I don't know what it is about debating computer games that bring out the moron in people.

 

[Trajan12]

It's kind of sad that I already knew this came from Japan.

 

[Bill3000]

I don't know what it is about debating computer games that bring out the moron in people.

You're surprised about a bunch of introverted computer nerds would be out to defend a computer game about rape?

 

[mrt144]

You're surprised about a bunch of introverted computer nerds would be out to defend a computer game about rape?

It isn't just about the rape; it's about forcing abortions too!

 

[Bill3000]

It isn't just about the rape; it's about forcing abortions too!

That makes my point stand out further!

 

[Formaldehyde]

You're surprised about a bunch of introverted computer nerds would be out to defend a computer game about rape?

I don't see anybody on here defending it. Guess again.

And, of course, you aren't an "introverted computer nerd" yourself with 9100 posts in an internet gaming forum...