Ask a Forensic Scientist

[nonconformist]

Congrats!

What are the main differences between csi and reality?

Well, CSI is a very American show, so for a start, procedural differences are quite large.

The major differences are the speeds at which the analyses are done (like, an hour max?), the fact that there is little tedium (i.e they enver ever spend 12 hours on hand and knees looking for tiny particles and such), the complete lack of evidential integrity, the fact they go around with guns arresting people and such.

Generally, the job isn't filled with explosions, kidnappings, gunshots, and criminals coming back to confess their nefarious plans disguised as other people.

Do you use your expertise in everyday life?

Certainly the legal expertise comes in handy, and basically our biggest skill is common sense and the ability to think around the box.
The chemistry and physics side means you understand your surroundigns a lot better too.

What are common mistakes made by criminals?

Apart from commiting the crimes?

Essentially, giving the investigative powers legitimate reasons to investigate in the first place. Being on the system already. Thinking they're cleverer than the investigators.
Using TV dramas to plan their crimes.

 

[Loppan Torkel]

Congrats!

1. Why do you choose to go back to school at this time? How long have you studied to get here and how long remains?

2. Are dental records as important as it used to be, or are DNA-techniques being used instead to determine the identities of dead now?

 

[nonconformist]

1. Why do you choose to go back to school at this time? How long have you studied to get here and how long remains?

Heh, a number of reasons. The uni kinda wants me back, and I guess I wanna do some research before being thrown into the real world.

2. Are dental records as important as it used to be, or are DNA-techniques being used instead to determine the identities of dead now?

Oh, of course. If no biological tissue remains, either because the remains are skeletal, or the corpse has suffered huge damage, dental records are used.
Likewise, if a person is not on the DNA ststem, and there are no relatives to test against, dental records are used because, whereas relatively few people are on the DNA files, pretty muche veryone has a dental record.

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

Apart from commiting the crimes?

Essentially, giving the investigative powers legitimate reasons to investigate in the first place. Being on the system already. Thinking they're cleverer than the investigators.
Using TV dramas to plan their crimes.

Is it very common that the criminals are inspired by tv?

Do you proffesionals learn the tricks the crooks learnt from tv so you can stay ahead of the crooks.

 

[nonconformist]

Is it very common that the criminals are inspired by tv?

No; most crimes aren't planned per se, but rather more spontaneous. TThere are some notable exceptions however.

Do you proffesionals learn the tricks the crooks learnt from tv so you can stay ahead of the crooks.

Not really, sicne the TV is basically based on us.

 

[Perfection]

Do you wear killer shades?

Do you make awesome puns about criminals?

Are you just learning this so you can get away with crimes?

 

[Narz]

I'm actually returning to Uni to do a paid research post, and get a masters out of it.

Cool, congrats.

Question : what's the cleanest way to murder someone at close range?

 

[Cutlass]

Are dental records in some central database, or do dentists submit them for any person missing so that there is a database of just those?

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

Are there any standard jokes in the field?

 

[nonconformist]

Do you wear killer shades?

Nah, I'm a cap kinda guy, when I work outdoors. Anyways, wearing shades on a crime scene is just silly.

Do you make awesome puns about criminals?

Yeah, I have to say we're faitrly guilty about this, though it's less awesome puns, and more just silly black humour.

Are you just learning this so you can get away with crimes?

Yes. I mean no.

Question : what's the cleanest way to murder someone at close range?

I'm not sure of the legality of discussing this under US law, so I won't comment.

Are dental records in some central database, or do dentists submit them for any person missing so that there is a database of just those?

I'm not sure about the US, but in the UK, there is no such system. It is the jobs of detectives to use leads, and to use a forensic-created cast or model of the dentures, which are then compared with likely dentists (i.e, in the general area etc, or even general NHS)

Are there any standard jokes in the field?

There are, though most of them relate to procedures, and rivalry with other arms of the emergency services, rather than cases themselves, since it's thought of quite uncouth and rude to make jokes about cases (or, at least, this is the opinion of the media; behind closed doors, dark humour abounds, as a coping mechanism, but the media will pick up on any kind of joke or smile with their telescopic lenses, and crucify anyone who seems to not be mourning).

Humour is used primarily for learning stuff; one of the things that alwas stick in my mind is
"Under no circumstance ever trust a fireman".

 

[Ayn Rand]

1. How do we catch all the bad guys [I mean every single one]? What would it take?

2. Do you have some kind of computer we can put against people's heads to find out if they're communist?

3. If we arrest the entire population in groups and give every person truth serum, would it solve all unsolved crimes?

 

[nonconformist]

1. How do we catch all the bad guys [I mean every single one]? What would it take?

We can't. Simple as that.
It's become quite blasé and cool to repeat "Forensic Science...isn't", which is completely wrong, as it most definitely is, but there's no way we can actually get 100% resolution on all crimes, especially certain types where the victim has to cooperate with us fully.
Also, bear in mind, that no matter how good an investigation is, there's always the chance it goes tits-up in a courtroom.

2. Do you have some kind of computer we can put against people's heads to find out if they're communist?

No, and the great United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland does not convict or discriminate based on political allegiance.

3. If we arrest the entire population in groups and give every person truth serum, would it solve all unsolved crimes?

There's no such thing as truth serum, so no. Even so, this wouldn't be allowed under evidential procedures, as there's no legitimate reason for it.

 

[Cutlass]

I'm not sure about the US, but in the UK, there is no such system. It is the jobs of detectives to use leads, and to use a forensic-created cast or model of the dentures, which are then compared with likely dentists (i.e, in the general area etc, or even general NHS)

Using dental records to identify a body is so old it's hardly even a cliche any longer. But thinking about it, there are many 1000s of independent dentists in the US. It makes the task seem impossible unless there are a lot of other identifying information.

 

[Ayn Rand]

4. So how do you protect yourself from the psychological trauma of visiting serious crime scenes? That can be some pretty nasty stuff to deal with.

5. Have you caught - or contributed to the catching - of any bad guys yet? [if so, well done ]

6. With regard to my question 1., is there some kind of pre-emptive security framework we can create to solve all crimes. I just mean hypothetically, what would it take? Are we talking about putting microchips in everyone's head, or is there a cheaper way to do it?

7. What do you think is the scariest type of crime and/or threat to Britain's security today?

 

[nonconformist]

4. So how do you protect yourself from the psychological trauma of visiting serious crime scenes? That can be some pretty nasty stuff to deal with.

I won't say I've ever actually been on scene in a professional capacity, my contact has been mainly through videos, autopsy photos and actual crime scene photography, which is considerably different, but still bloody brutal.

Generally, and from colleagues and such, it's psychologically distancing yourself from the scene, plus heavy drinking, normally.

5. Have you caught - or contributed to the catching - of any bad guys yet? [if so, well done ]

Well, I'm a month out of school, and finally got awarded my degree 2 weeks ago, so I'm not actually "working" as a Forensic scientist, I'm qualified as a government one.
That said, not all Forensics are actual scene guys.

I haven't actually worked on any open cases, sorry to disappoint you, but it'll come soon.
I've worked on a couple of closed cases, as training, and in that sense, ya, I guess I did

6. With regard to my question 1., is there some kind of pre-emptive security framework we can create to solve all crimes. I just mean hypothetically, what would it take? Are we talking about putting microchips in everyone's head, or is there a cheaper way to do it?

Well, for a start, legally, a crime is not a crime unless there is an action which is in itself criminal (there are exceptions, such as conspriacy to commit, terrorism etc.), but generally, preempting is something our evidential and legal framework doesn't recognise, or allow, and to institute such a system would mean the negating of 25 years of laws.

I'd also like to point out that "criminologists" and "forensic profilers" are one of the worst ways to predict criminality, or criminal tendencies.
Many a serial murderer/rapist has gone on to commit more crimes, because the police is using these pseudosciences, and it's telling them to look for people of completely different backgrounds.

I can, for example, say that Raoul Moat was characterised by a profiler (not for the police, but for the UK media) as having "Commando syndrome" (I don't think it really exists?) and that he would not enter into negotiation with the police, and under no circumsttance would he ever commit suicide, preferring isntead to charge at the police, guns blazing.

Whoops.

7. What do you think is the scariest type of crime and/or threat to Britain's security today?

Scariest, as in what is the most horrifying, or scariest as in we're more likely to fall prey to it?

FOr the former, you should bear in mind the media likes to distort facts, and actually, crime rates in Britain have generally fallen, and we're catching more people.
However, rapes and sexual crimes are fairly cosntant, and horrific, especially involving minors. Many forensic scientists will specialise so they are not required to be invovled in such crimes.

The latter? Well, white collar crime is pretty bad, but I have to say Road Traffic Collisions, especially caused by drunk drivers.
Pretty common, and pretty horrific; I can say for a fact that RTCs are horrific in terms of trauma and disgust second only to major terrorist incidents, and your most barbaric of murders. IT's usually measured in how many pieces you have to put into plastic bags.

 

[Ayn Rand]

I won't say I've ever actually been on scene in a professional capacity, my contact has been mainly through videos, autopsy photos and actual crime scene photography, which is considerably different, but still bloody brutal.

Generally, and from colleagues and such, it's psychologically distancing yourself from the scene, plus heavy drinking, normally.

Yes, some serious stuff. I suppose distancing is all you can do really.

Scariest, as in what is the most horrifying, or scariest as in we're more likely to fall prey to it?

FOr the former, you should bear in mind the media likes to distort facts, and actually, crime rates in Britain have generally fallen, and we're catching more people.
However, rapes and sexual crimes are fairly cosntant, and horrific, especially involving minors. Many forensic scientists will specialise so they are not required to be invovled in such crimes.

The latter? Well, white collar crime is pretty bad, but I have to say Road Traffic Collisions, especially caused by drunk drivers.
Pretty common, and pretty horrific; I can say for a fact that RTCs are horrific in terms of trauma and disgust second only to major terrorist incidents, and your most barbaric of murders. IT's usually measured in how many pieces you have to put into plastic bags.

Thanks for the answers, I agree about the RTCs.

Congratulations on passing . I hope you have a very successful career.

 

[Ajidica]

Whats your opinion on the polygraph not being allowed as court evidence? From what I have read about it, it seems no more suspect than psychiatric exams, if not less so.

 

[nonconformist]

Whats your opinion on the polygraph not being allowed as court evidence? From what I have read about it, it seems no more suspect than psychiatric exams, if not less so.

Quite right it's banned imho. It's not infallible at all, and actually it's relatively easy to fake.
The biggest issue is prejudicing a jury on the matter.

 

[Ajidica]

Isn't a psychiatrist saying the person was insane during an insanity defense trial just as prejudicing? The defense would have a chance to cross-examine the expert performing the polygraph test and prove it isn't 100% reliable just like any other person who had performed tests.

 

[nonconformist]

Isn't a psychiatrist saying the person was insane during an insanity defense trial just as prejudicing? The defense would have a chance to cross-examine the expert performing the polygraph test and prove it isn't 100% reliable just like any other person who had performed tests.

Despite what you see on TV, practically noone ever puts in an insanity plea. First, it's exceptionally hard to achieve. Secondly, if found criminally insane, the result is usually a life commital to a mental institute. Which is, by the way, not appealable.
Defence cannot cross-examine a person who has plead insanity.

The problem is the jury; if a jury sees a polygraph say positive, they will convict, no matter what/.