1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Ask an atheist

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Askthepizzaguy, May 7, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. erez87

    erez87 Lord of Random

    Joined:
    May 16, 2002
    Messages:
    13,450
    Location:
    Lod, Israel
    Atheists don't "believe in nothing". That's a straw man and an attempt to show atheists in a cynical way. Atheist's don't believe in gods. That's all. Some might believe in other stuff (like Democracy), other might even believe in nothing (like crazy people), but being an atheist does not mean believing in nothing.

    Other than that, you said
    "He doesn't, directly, interfere in daily life. He offers support and inspires to do the "right" thing."
    That contradicts itself. How can god offer support and inspire if he has no interference in life?

    You also said
    "He can't be proven but neither can he be disproven."
    Than how can you tell it exists?
     
  2. peter grimes

    peter grimes ... Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2005
    Messages:
    13,314
    Location:
    Queens, New York
    I think you'll find many atheists will disagree with this. It's not that we believe in nothing, rather that we reject the existence of any gods without evidence for their existence.

    In all likelihood, most christians are also atheists when it comes to the hindu gods, or the norse gods, or confucian-style ancestor worship, and so on. From what you've explained above, I think you would not call yourself an atheist regarding these other gods. But I really think your views are not shared by most of the christians here in USA. I kind of wish they were.
     
  3. mayor

    mayor Heart & Mind

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2009
    Messages:
    3,029
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    @ Ziggy, yours are a bit more difficult to answer and require a bit more thought from my side before I'll be able to answer them to my (and hopefully your) satisfaction.

    Yours do overlap a bit with Erez' questions, which are slightly easier, to answer. :)

    You're absolutly right. I wasn't clear enough on that point and it wasn't an attempt to show atheists in a cynical way. I am hardly ever cynical about any outlook on life, being it Monotheïstic, Polytheïsitc or Atheïstic.

    Excellent question.
    With I kind of responded to question that weren't asked and I see I had to give a bit more detail about it.

    I'll answer in twofold starting with 'supports and inspires'.
    God offers me support in "hard" times. This support is purely mentally. When I feel the need to ask for support I'll pray to God for this. This prayer doesn't have to be a lengthy one, most of my prayers are 2/3 lines and are said in my head, others are longer and spoken outloud. It just depends on the need and situation. These prayers result in an "mental boost", if you will, that help me get through certain things, give me the strenght to make certain hard decisions etc.
    The inspiring part is even more "unreal":) and, I find while I'm writing, hard to explain.

    I'm comming back to this.


    You say that God can't interfere in life without offering support an inspiring.
    I don't see the latter as interfering but rather as influencing with permission :)
    With direct interfering, because that is what I said, I mean interfering in daily events.
    I ment that God isn't involved with a drunkdriver killing an bypasser, or somebody who jumps of a roof because he believes God will protect him.

    The first is an human fault and not a punishment for the bystander. The second is just an idiot (in my book).


    I can't tell he exists that's the most dificult part. I had my share of doubts especially when I was a teenager.
    but as I said God is a believe. I can't tell he is here in such a manner that I can tell the chair I'm currently sitting on is here. But I believe he is here and I can tell he is here when I need him.
    The short answer I think.
    This will probably come up again when I answer all of Ziggy's questions/comments :)



    and as final word. I am in the assumption that as soon as you start to take believes to serious they get dangerous. I haven't done it in this post but I tend to make fun of religions/atheïsm. If you see me doing this, don't take it as if I'm not taking it serious but rather as a sign I feel the need to get things "back to earth" :)
    In my discussion group I am notorious for making comments that border on blasphemy and certainly critizise relious aspects :)
     
  4. mayor

    mayor Heart & Mind

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2009
    Messages:
    3,029
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    Yes I answered this above. I wasn't clear on that point
     
  5. Leoreth

    Leoreth Friend Next Door Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    35,132
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Faraway
    Just to note, there are even things you can define that can't possibly exist at all, like the set of all sets that don't contain themselves.
     
  6. erez87

    erez87 Lord of Random

    Joined:
    May 16, 2002
    Messages:
    13,450
    Location:
    Lod, Israel
    Than I'll recycle the other guy's question. How is this different than me telling myself I'll learn harder and succeed and give myself inspiration? The only difference I see is that you give your personal inner voice a name and claim it exist outside of you. You have no evidence for that. Yet you still claim it's true. Claiming something is true without evidence is dishonest, are you dishonest?

    Again the same contradiction.
    "I don't see the latter as interfering but rather as influencing"
    Influencing = Interfering. How can it influence without influencing?

    Do you claim god exist?Do you speak of god as a true thing in your life? Do you understand why claiming something is true with no evidence put's you in the dishonest category, which I really don't think you should be in? I don't think you are dishonest, but your faith is, and it is putting you in the wrong light.
     
  7. timtofly

    timtofly One Day

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2009
    Messages:
    9,445
    The thought occured to me today that I never "got" your take on the "1st" day when God separated the light from the darkness equates to the fact that man can survive on his own without God or His presence. Or that God can separate the known from the unknown? Can there still be a God, if God Himself allows this to happen? Can man be left to his own cognizance and still be held accountable to God's justice? Is the known justice of man (without God) actually the "hidden" from man justice of God, but yet (that allows) men can (the ability to) live together in harmony with or without "knowing" a God?

    Or why does a human use a lightbulb to show that he has had an idea (eureka moment)?
    Spoiler :
    It has also been said that humans have two eyes, but the truth cannot be divided. The "light" that enters the body must be single, but yet at the same time it comes in double. It is in the brain that the opposing "sides" are reasoned into a single truth. Logic cannot be done in the singular, but using a binary means one must come to either accept one way or the other. There is only a third option in that you have to take the word of another and never come up with your own decision.
     
  8. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    21,810
    Location:
    Liverpool, home of Everton FC
    It's called a proper class :p It's just not a set.

    EDIT: The "universal set", i.e. the set of every possible set, isn't a set either ;)
     
  9. Leoreth

    Leoreth Friend Next Door Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    35,132
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Faraway
    So if you define it as a set it's not :D
     
  10. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    21,810
    Location:
    Liverpool, home of Everton FC
    Well if you define numbers as positive x + 1 = 0 doesn't have a solution either.

    But you just redefine numbers to suit your needs. x2 + 1 = 0 is the next major hurdle ;)
     
  11. Thoughtful Thug

    Thoughtful Thug Deity

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2009
    Messages:
    2,340
    Location:
    ohi-yo
    Where's that wacky Nihilist guy? love that dude.


    On topic: Why is it that atheists are easy to be trolled than believers?
     
  12. Leoreth

    Leoreth Friend Next Door Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2009
    Messages:
    35,132
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Faraway
    Is it? I don't think so.
     
  13. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    21,810
    Location:
    Liverpool, home of Everton FC
    Nah, it's far easier to troll Christians.
     
  14. CELTICEMPIRE

    CELTICEMPIRE Zulu Conqueror

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Messages:
    4,406
    Location:
    Eastern Kentucky
    What I never understand about Atheism is that they always say "we have science we don't need God", when the laws of physics, chemistry, biology, etc. are way to detailed to happen by chance.
     
  15. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    21,810
    Location:
    Liverpool, home of Everton FC
    [citation needed]
     
  16. Thoughtful Thug

    Thoughtful Thug Deity

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2009
    Messages:
    2,340
    Location:
    ohi-yo
    Really? Then I guess we all have a different set of experience in this.

    I personally think that it is much harder to convince a christian that I am an atheist instead of the other way around.
     
  17. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    21,810
    Location:
    Liverpool, home of Everton FC
    Ask them if you should still love your neighbour if they are of the same sex.
     
  18. CELTICEMPIRE

    CELTICEMPIRE Zulu Conqueror

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2010
    Messages:
    4,406
    Location:
    Eastern Kentucky
    :confused:

    Moderator Action: No smiley only posts please. (See rule 12 of OT rules.)
    Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
     
  19. GamezRule

    GamezRule Inconceivable!

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2009
    Messages:
    8,668
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Michigan
    (insert homosexual joke here)
     
  20. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2007
    Messages:
    21,810
    Location:
    Liverpool, home of Everton FC
    If I get the 1000th post, even if I am agnostic, do I get to start the next thread?
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page