Atheists: Apostate vs Non-Apostate

[AlpsStranger]

I'm a regular Joe from the heart of America who just happened to be raised more-or-less as an atheist. Most people I meet who are atheists are usually apostates. While I certainly support many atheist causes that I'm sure religious people find infuriating, I'm not quite as passionate about my atheism in other ways.

To me Christianity is an alien, even somewhat disturbing system of thought. I understand it in a clinical manner, but I've never been "saved." I'm not "seeking" so I don't want Christians on the forum to get too excited, but I've just been thinking about this. I think it might actually be a subtly but substantially different kind of atheism.

Have any other atheists on here thought much along these lines?

 

[Phrossack]

I don't quite get what you mean. Could you rephrase it?

 

[AlpsStranger]

I'm basically just asking other atheists if they think being an apostate makes a difference in their worldview.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I'm not "seeking" so I don't want Christians on the forum to get too excited

Quoted for emphasis.

Have any other atheists on here thought much along these lines?

While being raised by Christian parents who told me about their religious believes I was never forced to subscribe to them. In fact there was little my parents taught me with regard to religion since they believed that I had to have the free will to chose for myself out of my own accord since raising me with only a Christian outlook in life takes away that choice. I'm very grateful to them they gave me that freedom.

I have acted as if I believed in God to not stand out in my environment, and I have had some depressing moments when I was young, because I figured God wasn't interested in me. When I was 13 I went to a school in a city where atheism was the common view, and about the time I was 15-16 I started to pay attention to this. So that's about the time I realised maybe God did not exist. But that was confusing since my parents did believe, and they were the wisest people in the world to me. So that was the start of a lot of interesting and confusing and good talks. They even sent me to have a talk to their pastor, who was a great guy and helped me out immensely.

So, lots of Christians supported me when I was forming my worldview, even if it went against theirs with regard to believing in God.

 

[strijder20]

I don't know whether I'm apostate or not: my mother isn't Christian but doesn't deny the existence of a God, while I have no clue what my father thinks. I've been baptised and did those two things at 6 and 12 years old (don't know the translation), but I don't really consider that period of my life as really believing, because one is usually heavily influenced by others (in this case my grandparents pushed me into it) in that period of life.

I don't consider the belief in a God 'alien', because wanting to have answers on certain questions in life (what follows death - how was life created - how was the universe created ...) is very human.

I'm not even fully atheist because I don't deny the possibility of there being a god. However, I don't let that influence my life because I consider the probability of it too low.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I'm not even fully atheist because I don't deny the possibility of there being a god. However, I don't let that influence my life because I consider the probability of it too low.

Being open to the possibility does not take away atheism. You either believe, or you don't. And while not believing you still can allow for the possibility that which you believe may be wrong

 

[AlpsStranger]

Being open to the possibility does not take away atheism. You either believe, or you don't. And while not believing you still can allow for the possibility that which you believe may be wrong

Exactly.

I don't believe that God exists. ~ A debatable but not overtly insane statement.

I am certain that God doesn't exist. ~ Ravings of a madman.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

I can speak only of my life up to about 16. Since after that I would consider myself believer not just in God but in Man as well.
Raised as atheist in atheistic country (communist Czechoslovakia) there was no question of apostasy as I have considered believing in God something between hilarious practical joke and pitiful example of mental retardation.
Nowdays what I see as an obvious is that impossibility is only a temporary reality and that truth has capacity to hides its face in staggering manner.

 

[Phrossack]

I was raised Catholic but never was very religious. While being made to go through religious education to prepare for Confirmation, I realized I was an atheist, and ultimately convinced my parents to stop sending me. The priest thought it was better for me to quit if I didn't believe than to go through the motions, in any case. My dad had no real problem with this, but my mom was bitter for some time, and I think still is a bit.

I realized I was an atheist not at any particular moment, but when I started to think that belief in an undying, uncreated, all-seeing, all-knowing benevolent man in the sky was making a pretty extreme claim. Extreme claims require extreme evidence, as I always tell my questionably sane friend whose religious beliefs seem to be a blend of ancient Egyptian belief and aliens. So far, all the evidence I've seen is a really old unsourced book. When people see something they can't easily explain, some use it as "proof" for a God. Not having an answer is not evidence of anything other than not having an answer.

Really, I think a lot of people believe because it's comforting and makes them happy. But I value believing in the truth, not just whatever is the most pleasing idea.

 

[Formaldehyde]

I take it you mean by "apostate" that you were once a practicing Christian, or some other religion, and you no longer are. I never really was ever a Christian, even though I was required to attend Sunday school and then church for 8 years or so when I was a child.

I'm also not an atheist. I'm a strong agnostic instead.

 

[Terxpahseyton]

I am certain that God doesn't exist. ~ Ravings of a madman.

lol wut?
It is mad to be certain that something doesn't exist where there objectively is no good reason to assume that it does exist? Am I also a madman because I am certain that the evil twin of Captain Kirk isn't out there to enslave the universe?

 

[AlpsStranger]

questionably sane friend whose religious beliefs seem to be a blend of ancient Egyptian belief and aliens

It's funny. I've often said that a Christian isn't the opposite of an atheist. The opposite of atheism is, in my opinion, something like the so-called SBNR movement.

EDIT: I'm well aware that the opposite of atheism is Theism. I mean in terms of personality type, not dictionary definitions.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I'm also not an atheist. I'm a strong agnostic instead.

I'm sorry to keep droning on about this in every thread it comes up, but the two aren't mutually exclusive. If I have read you right I think you are an agnostic atheist. One who states no certainty about the existence of God, but opt not to believe in God.

lol wut?
It is mad to be certain that something doesn't exist where there objectively is no good reason to assume that it does exist? Am I also a madman because I am certain that the evil twin of Captain Kirk isn't out there to enslave the universe?

It's a technicality we sadly need in here.

For all intents and purposes one lives and reasons with no consideration of the existence of God.

 

[Formaldehyde]

I'm sorry to keep droning on about this in every thread it comes up, but the two aren't mutually exclusive. If I have read you right I think you are an agnostic atheist. One who states no certainty about the existence of God, but opt not to believe in God.

I prefer the widely accepted term of "strong agnostic" because I think it more closely reflects my own opinions. YMMV.

It's a technicality we sadly need in here.

Nope. It is just incessantly arguing over silly semantics.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I prefer the widely accepted term of "strong agnostic" because it more closely reflects my own opinions. YMMV.

And I can see the logic in that reasoning.

It however doesn't state whether you do or do not believe in God. It only addresses the knowledge part of the matter.

Nope. It is just incessantly arguing over silly semantics.

yeah, I know I'm anal about that. But it somehow grates me that agnosticism is seen as a sort of a middle ground between theism and atheism. Being an agnostic myself and an atheist, I always feel it indirectly concerns me.

If it really bothers you, just ignore me and my silly semantics

 

[Traitorfish]

I'm also not an atheist. I'm a strong agnostic instead.

So you believe in God, but you're not certain that he exists?

 

[AlpsStranger]

People don't understand the word agnostic because few of them know anything about the word gnostic.

That's what I've always figured anyhow.

 

[Formaldehyde]

It however doesn't state whether you do or do not believe in God. It only addresses the knowledge part of the matter.

What I think it better states is that I have no beliefs in the matter because it is impossible to either prove or disprove. I think philosophically it is a much stronger and better defensible position. Again, YMMV.

yeah, I know I'm anal about that. But it somehow grates me that agnosticism is seen as a sort of a middle ground between theism and atheism. Being an agnostic myself and an atheist, I always feel it indirectly concerns me.

That also bothers me as well. While there are certainly at least some "fence sitters", I don't think it is true with most agnostics. It is mostly just an attempt to ridicule and troll those who are.

If it really bothers you, just ignore me and my silly semantics

I certainly don't mind discussing it as often as you want. I object to people trying to tell me that they know my opinions better than I do. This is particularly true since I have spent a great deal of time trying to properly pigeon-hole myself.

So you believe in God, but you're not certain that he exists?

I rest my case.

No, I don't think there is any god or gods, angels, leprechauns, tooth fairies, Santa Clauses, or Easter bunnies.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

What I think it better states is that I have no beliefs in the matter because it is impossible to either prove or disprove.

Isn't having no belief in the matter not the same as lacking the belief?

Example: Someone who has never heard of nor considered the existence of God is also deemed atheist. Being a theist requires a conscious decision. Without it, I would label someone an atheist.

I certainly don't mind discussing it as often as you want. I object to people trying to tell me that they know my opinions better than I do when I have spent a great deal of time trying to properly pigeon-hole myself.

I'm not questioning your opinions. Just the price-tag

edit: AlpStranger, if you feel this derails the thread too much, say the word and I'll drop it.

 

[Traitorfish]

I rest my case.

...What?